Theological Problems with God-guided Evolution

[AandW_Rootbeer]

1 hour ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

(Genesis 1:1)  ???????????? H7225 be·re·**** In the beginning ??????? H1254 ba·Ra created ????????? H430 E·lo·Him; God ???? H853 'et ???????????? H8064 hash·sha·Ma·yim the heaven ?????? H853 ve·'Et ????????? H776 ha·'A·retz. the earth [Hebrew Study Bible]

The account of Creation is the logical starting point for Genesis, for it explains the beginning of the universe. These verses have received much attention in connection with science; this is to be expected. But the passage is a theological treatise as well, for it lays a foundation for the rest of the Pentateuch.

In writing this work for Israel, Moses wished to portray God as the Founder and Creator of all life. The account shows that the God who created Israel is the God who created the world and all who are in it. Thus the theocracy is founded on the sovereign God of Creation. That nation, her Law, and her customs and beliefs all go back to who God is. Israel would here learn what kind of God was forming them into a nation.

The implications of this are great. First, it means that everything that exists must be under God’s control. The Creation must be in subjection to the Creator. Forces of nature, enemies, creatures and objects that became pagan deities — none of these would pose a threat to the servants of the living God.

Second, the account also reveals the basis of the Law. If indeed God was before all things and made all things, how foolish it would be to have any other gods before Him! There were none. If indeed God made man in His image to represent Him, how foolish it would be to make an image of God! If indeed God set aside one day for rest from His work, should not man who is walking with God follow Him? The commandments find their rationale here.

Third, the account reveals that God is a redeeming God. It records how He brought the cosmos out of chaos, turned darkness into light, made divisions between them, transformed cursing into blessing, and moved from what was evil and darkness to what was holy. This parallels the work of God in Exodus, which records His redeeming Israel by destroying the Egyptian forces of chaos. The prophets and the apostles saw here a paradigm of God’s redemptive activities. Ultimately He who caused light to shine out of darkness made His light shine in the hearts of believers (2 Corinthians 4:6) so that they become new creations (2 Corinthians 5:17).

These verses have traditionally been understood as referring to the actual beginning of matter, a Creation out of nothing and therefore part of day one. But the vocabulary and grammar of this section require a closer look. The motifs and the structure of the Creation account are introduced in the first two verses. That the universe is God’s creative work is perfectly expressed by the statement God created the heavens and the earth. The word bārā’ (“created”) may express creation out of nothing, but it certainly cannot be limited to that (cf. Gen_2:7). Rather, it stresses that what was formed was new and perfect. The word is used throughout the Bible only with God as its subject.  [Bible Knowledge Commentary]

From a scientific standpoint, the Big Bang lines up perfectly with scripture.

(Genesis 1:2)  ?????????? H776 ve·ha·'A·retz, And the earth ???????? H1961 ha·ye·Tah was ??????? H8414 to·hu without form ???????? H922 va·Vo·hu, and void ?????????? H2822 ve·Cho·shech and darkness ???? H5921 'al- upon ??????? H6440 pe·Nei [was] upon the face ??????? H8415 te·Hom; of the deep ???????? H7307 ve·Ru·ach And the Spirit ????????? H430 E·lo·Him, of God ?????????? H7363 me·ra·Che·fet moved ???? H5921 'al- over ??????? H6440 pe·Nei the face ?????????? H4325 ham·Ma·yim. of the waters  [Hebrew Study Bible]

But Genesis 1:2 describes a chaos: there was waste and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep. The clauses in Genesis 1:2 are apparently circumstantial to Genesis 1:3, telling the world’s condition when God began to renovate it. It was a chaos of wasteness, emptiness, and darkness. Such conditions would not result from God’s creative work (bārā’); rather, in the Bible they are symptomatic of sin and are coordinate with judgment. Moreover, God’s Creation by decree begins in Genesis 1:3, and the elements found in Genesis 1:2 are corrected in Creation, beginning with light to dispel the darkness. The expression formless and empty (ṯōhû wāḇōhû) seems also to provide an outline for Genesis 1:1-31, which describes God’s bringing shape and then fullness to the formless and empty earth.  [Bible Knowledge Commentary]

Genesis 1:2 describes the condition which will begin in Genesis 1:3.  That's when God begins the Reconstruction of the Ruined Earth of Genesis 1:2.

This is gibberish.  I don't know what you imagine the Bible says.  I don't even know what translation of the Bible you're using.  You like to use unidentified sources that keeps the reader wondering if they can be trusted.  Please identify your sources if you want me to respond.

Where did you invent this question and / or where did it come from?  This question is ridiculous.

You've destroyed nothing.

That is because if Posters don't confirm or conform to your Gap Theory, then it is nonsense.   But the fact is, the Earth was already in some shape and form before we read God begins His Creation.   

 

Now, you want to use [in the Beginning].

 

So, does this Beginning include the Kingdom of God already exists, or needs to be Spoken into Existence?

 

And if the Earth exists in the Beginning, was it Created just after God's Kingdom was Created?

 

The Angels are created, so they had to have a Beginning.  Only God is Eternal, so His Kingdom is most likely Created.   Was Earth Created soon afterwards?

 

The fact is, You don't from the Genesis Account how the Earth went from an Idea to the Condition found in Genesis 1:2.

 

You are merely guessing, because there are no Account for there being Nothing but emptiness to the point Earth is Null, Void, Formless, under water.

Edited December 10, 2021 by AandW_Rootbeer

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, AandW_Rootbeer said:

That is because if Posters don't confirm or conform to your Gap Theory, then it is nonsense.  But the fact is, the Earth was already in some shape and form before we read God begins His Creation.   

So what are your credentials for interpreting the Hebrew Old Testament?

6 minutes ago, AandW_Rootbeer said:

Now, you want to use [in the Beginning].

That's what the Bible says.

Source: Assembly of Called Out Believers - Bereshit and the Depth of Meaning in the First Word of the Bible

6 minutes ago, AandW_Rootbeer said:

So, does this Beginning include the Kingdom of God already exists, or needs to be Spoken into Existence?

See the above hyperlink.

6 minutes ago, AandW_Rootbeer said:

And if the Earth exists in the Beginning, was it Created just after God's Kingdom was Created?

See my previous post citing the Bible Knowledge Commentary.

6 minutes ago, AandW_Rootbeer said:

The Angels are created, so they had to have a Beginning.  Only God is Eternal, so His Kingdom is most likely Created.   Was Earth Created soon afterwards?

You are making too many assumptions here not warranted by the Bible text.

6 minutes ago, AandW_Rootbeer said:

The fact is, You don't from the Genesis Account how the Earth went from an Idea to the Condition found in Genesis 1:2.

This question is off topic.

6 minutes ago, AandW_Rootbeer said:

You are merely guessing, because there are no Account for there being Nothing but emptiness to the point Earth is Null, Void, Formless, under water.

The Bible text is my guide.  Who is guiding you?

[Sparks]

1 hour ago, one.opinion said:

It isn't difficult at all to explain symbiotic relationships, although I'm not sure what you have in mind for "the" symbiotic relationships.

If you really wanted to know, you would make the effort to look.

If you want to talk about something you see as a challenge to evolution, go ahead and present it here.

I will take this all back up when the forums are transferred.  These messages probably won't be transferred.

[AandW_Rootbeer]

8 minutes ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

So what are your credentials for interpreting the Hebrew Old Testament?

That's what the Bible says.

Source: Assembly of Called Out Believers - Bereshit and the Depth of Meaning in the First Word of the Bible

See the above hyperlink.

See my previous post citing the Bible Knowledge Commentary.

You are making too many assumptions here not warranted by the Bible text.

This question is off topic.

The Bible text is my guide.  Who is guiding you?

I cannot find the Gap Theory anywhere in Scripture, so I feel the same way as you feel about my Questions and Answers.

[Guest]

Just now, AandW_Rootbeer said:

I cannot find the Gap Theory anywhere in Scripture, so I feel the same way as you feel about my Questions and Answers.

This folder is NOT about the Gap Theory.  You trying to make this a referendum on the Gap Theory is Off Topic.  What are you afraid of?  Why won't you list the Bible you use or the resources you use?

[AandW_Rootbeer]

3 minutes ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

This folder is NOT about the Gap Theory.  You trying to make this a referendum on the Gap Theory is Off Topic.  What are you afraid of?  Why won't you list the Bible you use or the resources you use?

I use the Torah/Tanakh and the Codex Sinaiticus

Edited December 11, 2021 by AandW_Rootbeer

[Guest]

1 minute ago, AandW_Rootbeer said:

I use the Torah/Tankah and the Codex Sinaiticus

(Genesis 1:1)  In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

(Genesis 1:2)  Now the earth was formless and empty. Darkness was on the surface of the deep. The Spirit of God was hovering over the surface of the waters.  [AESV Torah]

Source: Assembly of Called Out Believers - Bereshit and the Depth of Meaning in the First Word of the Bible

Indicate where you are using the Codex Sinaiticus and how it applies to your argument.  Otherwise this looks like more smoke and mirrors on your part.  The desperate attempt of someone over their head.

[AandW_Rootbeer]

3 minutes ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

(Genesis 1:1)  In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

(Genesis 1:2)  Now the earth was formless and empty. Darkness was on the surface of the deep. The Spirit of God was hovering over the surface of the waters.  [AESV Torah]

Source: Assembly of Called Out Believers - Bereshit and the Depth of Meaning in the First Word of the Bible

Indicate where you are using the Codex Sinaiticus and how it applies to your argument.  Otherwise this looks like more smoke and mirrors on your part.  The desperate attempt of someone over their head.

1In the beginning of God's creation of the heavens and the earth.

2Now the earth was astonishingly empty, and darkness was on the face of the deep, and the spirit of God was hovering over the face of the water.

 

Tanakh

[Guest]

43 minutes ago, AandW_Rootbeer said:

1In the beginning of God's creation of the heavens and the earth.

2Now the earth was astonishingly empty, and darkness was on the face of the deep, and the spirit of God was hovering over the face of the water.

 

Tanakh

I can't find an acceptable English translation of the Bible that uses the word "astonishing".  Are you using whatever you can Google for translation?  Is this more smoke and mirrors on your part?  So whatever you post regarding the Old Testament should we assume you're using the Tanakh?

[AandW_Rootbeer]

2 minutes ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

I can't find an acceptable English translation of the Bible that uses the word "astonishing".  Are you using whatever you can Google for translation?  Is this more smoke and mirrors on your part?  So whatever you post regarding the Old Testament should we assume you're using the Tanakh?

Tanakh - The Hebrew Bible  Torah - The Pentateuch  Genesis

Bereishit - Genesis - Chapter 1