"My" New Church Being Destroyed by Liberal Politics

[TJGospels]

This has been tentatively speaking, my primary church for a little under a year. It had always been a great medium sized church prior to 2020 but everything went bonkers and this church went sideways very quickly like most in our very liberal state. 

Things have been "fine" more or less since 2021 with many staff and church members reaching out to me to make me feel as welcome as possible, given the circumstances. Likewise, I've tried my best to be a good citizen, and also helping out with modest but regular donations.

For better or worse, the church has encouraged smaller group participation and with a great deal of reluctance, I've dipped my feet in and holy smokes the church staff is disturbingly liberal and dogmatic. In the smaller group discussions in particular, led by some of the lower level staff, it has been nothing but liberal dogma and indoctrination with severe censorship of those expressing non-orthodoxy. The bigger discussion groups led by actual pastors have been run much more smoothly.

I have made it known that I am going to speak my mind and criticize these bizarre, anti-christian liberal positions whenever possible. The lower level staff are getting very nervous as they are attempting to maintain a polite facade while trying to shut down anyone who disagrees with them. 

Sometimes, other low level staff walk by or even sit-in and seem disturbed that ANYONE dare disagree with a fellow staff member and they are being very, very intimidating in their body language. 

I think a lot of people would be surprised (maybe not?) to see how hostile church staff can become when a lowly church member dares to disagree with them. 

I find the entire situation laughable, pathetic yet more than vaguely menacing. I am really worried that given the liberal politics of my state, I won't be able to find any better, and am likely to encounter much worse. 
I could take a time out at this point but that sounds boring. I could seek out alternative churches but they are likely to be at least as liberal if not more so. I am still shocked at how power hungry low level church staff are and how quickly they will resort to open intimidation when challenged.

Has anyone encountered anything like this? I am beyond disappointed. 

[The_Patriot21]

Have you taken your conccerns to the higher level staff? Perhaps they dont know.

I find churchs, like everything else, the bigger they are, the more people involved the more liberal they lean. 

Always speak the truth, but remember to do so in love.

[TJGospels]

Thank you for your reply. There is only one older pastor and I respect him a lot. The head pastor also has a lot of integrity. Those are the two members of the team I respect the most. Unfortunately, both are extremely stressed out and I doubt they would want to handle an issue like this. It would require "taking sides" or criticizing members of their team and I doubt they'd want to take what they would likely consider a very drastic step.

These two senior pastors are in a tough spot. They are likely the only two who are capable of sound thinking and decision making. They are sadly surrounded by a slew of younger pastors who are extremely liberal. I find it very strange that this group of younger pastors made it through the hiring process. 

I am 100% certain that returning to this church would prove to be a disaster. A farce on an epic scale. This church is 100% focused on being as inoffensive as possible and demand the same. They worship politeness, not Jesus. 

[Starise]

Do you care to elaborate some on what things you see specifically as liberal there?

Some churches seem to have a firmer hand on training before someone can actively lead a group. To me this just makes sense. I have seen churches allow new members who no one really knows very well be nominated for deacons in smaller churches because they were good old boys ( and the church was hurting for deacons). To assure good leadership, a process should be maintained that makes sure the teaching of new leaders abides by the teaching of that group. If anything the structure at my church is tight in that regard. Those interested in leadership are required to attend a leadership class. If a member is out of line, there is a process to deal with it.

If a church isn't set up to deal with this, it obviously isn't a good thing.

One thing I have taken note of in the past and noticed again just recently is the way some churches will scope out new leaders and encourage them to become a part of the leadership. These might not necessarily be men called to the job by the Lord. These are men someone else thought looked good for the position. I have seen some of these men in power and they fell miserably. God needs to do the leading, not men.

Remember Israel wanted Saul for their king. here was a nice looking tall man who 'looks' like he would make a great king. David was probably voted the least likely to succeed but he was God's man.

[The_Patriot21]

The older pastors are likely trying to disciple them. Keep in mind everyone needs discipling. Also remember being liberal in and of itself isnt a sin, but you are right trying to intimidate the opposition into silence isnt Christ like.

If you decide to leave you really should tell the senior pastors why. They cant fix something if they don't know its broke.

[TJGospels]

Most of the pastors are pro

-femnism

-lgbtq+

-abortion

-black lives matter

etc.

The two pastors I respect are not, but most of the rest of the pastors are. They have less sway for now, but who knows for how long. 

[Ani Tefillah]

8 hours ago, TJGospels said:

This has been tentatively speaking, my primary church for a little under a year. It had always been a great medium sized church prior to 2020 but everything went bonkers and this church went sideways very quickly like most in our very liberal state. 

Things have been "fine" more or less since 2021 with many staff and church members reaching out to me to make me feel as welcome as possible, given the circumstances. Likewise, I've tried my best to be a good citizen, and also helping out with modest but regular donations.

For better or worse, the church has encouraged smaller group participation and with a great deal of reluctance, I've dipped my feet in and holy smokes the church staff is disturbingly liberal and dogmatic. In the smaller group discussions in particular, led by some of the lower level staff, it has been nothing but liberal dogma and indoctrination with severe censorship of those expressing non-orthodoxy. The bigger discussion groups led by actual pastors have been run much more smoothly.

I have made it known that I am going to speak my mind and criticize these bizarre, anti-christian liberal positions whenever possible. The lower level staff are getting very nervous as they are attempting to maintain a polite facade while trying to shut down anyone who disagrees with them. 

Sometimes, other low level staff walk by or even sit-in and seem disturbed that ANYONE dare disagree with a fellow staff member and they are being very, very intimidating in their body language. 

I think a lot of people would be surprised (maybe not?) to see how hostile church staff can become when a lowly church member dares to disagree with them. 

I find the entire situation laughable, pathetic yet more than vaguely menacing. I am really worried that given the liberal politics of my state, I won't be able to find any better, and am likely to encounter much worse. 
I could take a time out at this point but that sounds boring. I could seek out alternative churches but they are likely to be at least as liberal if not more so. I am still shocked at how power hungry low level church staff are and how quickly they will resort to open intimidation when challenged.

Has anyone encountered anything like this? I am beyond disappointed. 

For over 20 years now my husband and I have been "outside" of the congregations here in Norway 🇳🇴, as they're become more and more worldly, liberal, unholy and apostasy "clubs". Go out of them! 

[Ani Tefillah]

5 hours ago, TJGospels said:

Most of the pastors are pro

-femnism

-lgbtq+

-abortion

-black lives matter

etc.

The two pastors I respect are not, but most of the rest of the pastors are. They have less sway for now, but who knows for how long. 

If you have read about how the congregations shall be in the last days, you would perhaps understand the apostasy more? They only wants what iches their ears, and not the Gospel of the Lord, and in that way they allows doctrines of men and demons, right? 

[Starise]

6 hours ago, TJGospels said:

Most of the pastors are pro

-femnism

-lgbtq+

-abortion

-black lives matter

etc.

The two pastors I respect are not, but most of the rest of the pastors are. They have less sway for now, but who knows for how long. 

If  leadership is tolerant of the lower staff and they do nothing about any of it, they are responsible as church leadership.

Either clean the pond or start a new lake. How can a truly Godly man or men in chief leadership positions tolerate such things?

I would not let fear of finding a new congregation keep you from leaving there. God will make a way. 

Churches that focus on and support these things have become politically correct social clubs instead of churches.

 

[Starise]

9 hours ago, TJGospels said:

Unfortunately, both are extremely stressed out and I doubt they would want to handle an issue like this. It would require "taking sides" or criticizing members of their team and I doubt they'd want to take what they would likely consider a very drastic step.

One mission of the church is to preach the word. Any leader who fails to do this has failed at the most basic level. Confrontation is ABSOLUTELY necessary. Only cults use group coercion to push views not biblical and punish those who disagree.

If the denomination itself is already invaded by those kinds of thinkers at the top levels, what's the point in staying there? I mean if you support the church your money goes to the top to help support their ideas and causes.