Alive Posted May 23, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 22 Topic Count: 194 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 11,054 Content Per Day: 6.47 Reputation: 9,018 Days Won: 36 Joined: 09/12/2019 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/09/1956 Author Share Posted May 23, 2022 Nothing yet shows clewr scripture regarding the Op question. What is apparent is something else. And the point of this exercise. I only wish to know the truth of what scripture shows. Such a thing shouls be clear as is all prophecy regarding our common salvation…Christ the Messiah. Show me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teddyv Posted May 23, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 4,265 Content Per Day: 2.89 Reputation: 2,302 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/03/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2022 59 minutes ago, Heaven_Bound said: We never read where people were being forced to take a Mark between 67 AD and 95 AD before John wrote about it in 96 AD. The Church Fathers don't mention it ever taking place and we have hundreds of accounts and documentations. We have complete history from 1st Century till now and no evidence of that ever happening. So if it has not happened up to this moment, it seems rather compliant to view it as future. I don't know. The required sacrifice to the genius of the Emperor in those early days were an initial test of the early church. Only a pinch of incense or a splash of wine was required. Early Christians refused and were persecuted for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teddyv Posted May 23, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 4,265 Content Per Day: 2.89 Reputation: 2,302 Days Won: 1 Joined: 05/03/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2022 2 minutes ago, Heaven_Bound said: That was human governments. A beast coming out of the Sea and given power by the Adversary of the Most High God is not a human government at all. The whole book is so full of symbology that I'm very unconvinced that anyone has it right. But it was written for contemporary Christians revealing impending trials. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marilyn C Posted May 23, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 30 Topic Count: 269 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 13,243 Content Per Day: 3.49 Reputation: 8,522 Days Won: 12 Joined: 12/21/2013 Status: Online Birthday: 10/06/1947 Share Posted May 23, 2022 On 5/23/2022 at 9:24 AM, Alive said: Not one of these scriptures or inferences clearly indicate a world wide governance at all never mind the future world from their perspective. Supposition and inference based on a presupposition. God clearly reveals the 5 Gentile World rulers before He comes to set up His own kingdom rule. God tells us that they are world rulers - `...WHEREVER the children of men dwell, or the beast of the field and the birds of the heaven, He has given THEM INTO YOUR HAND, AND MADE YOU RULER OVER THEM ALL - ...` (Dan. 2: 38) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted May 23, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2022 11 hours ago, Heaven_Bound said: Being required to accept a Mark on your hand/forehead to buy/sell/trade is not a qualifier? That pretty much sums up one world all by itself. Not really. The word ghay which was translated to the Word earth can mean the world, but it can also mean a contenent, country, or state. My understanding of the text is everyone in the country will recieve the mark. Not the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted May 23, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2022 (edited) 10 hours ago, Heaven_Bound said: The Revelation 13 1 Then I saw a beast rising out of the sea, 2 And the dragon gave him his power and his throne and great authority. 3 The whole earth was amazed and followed the beast. 7 He was given authority over every tribe and people and tongue and nation. 8 All who dwell on the earth shall worship him 16 He also causes all—the small and the great, the rich and the poor, the free and the slave—to receive a mark on their right hand or upon their forehead. 17 And so no one can buy or sell unless he has the mark—either the name of the beast or the number of his name. Just reading that much anyone can see this is a one world Ruler and you can't buy sell without his Mark. It states several areas every tribe, tongue. Nation, the Whole Earth. Sounds pretty one world to me. As I understand it, when Israel appeared, the world was amazed and people from all nations from all over the world followed Israel into the land of Israel. It doesn't mean israel rules the world. It just means people followed after it from all the world. This has taken place. As of now the Israeli goverment is working on its cashless society. Give them alittle time,they are working hard. Edited May 23, 2022 by Shilohsfoal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted May 23, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.45 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2022 (edited) 19 hours ago, Alive said: Alive’s assertion: all verses folks use to assert a one world/all world government are inferential and are thus informed by a preconception. Prove me wrong. While doing so, be careful not to add to the words of scripture…let’s keep it simple. I looked but couldn't find any text proving a one world goverment. All I kept finding was nation rising against nation and kingdom against kingdom which proves there is more than one goverment. Kingdom doesn't rise against kingdom if they have the same king. Daniel speaks of a king of the north and a king of the south throughout chapter 11 and they have about 3 wars against each other right up to the very end. They were never a one goverment anything. Edited May 23, 2022 by Shilohsfoal 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heleadethme Posted May 23, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 15 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,371 Content Per Day: 1.35 Reputation: 3,268 Days Won: 5 Joined: 07/10/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2022 It might be worth considering that at different times in history there has usually been a leading notable kingdom in the world, eg, this side of the cross there was still Rome for a while, then Holy Roman Empire (Europe), then Great Britain, followed so far by the United States. It doesn't have to mean the leading kingdom rules over all the others by force, but by influence...... and just by being greater, richer, and more powerful, the leading kingdom of whatever era has the ascendency over smaller less powerful, less influential kingdoms. Smaller kingdoms wanting a piece of what the leading kingdom has by way of advantages...prosperity and security etc, willingly join in and emulate and participate with the leading kingdom's system or way of doing things...economic system, education, medicine, military methods and alliances etc. "Ruling" doesn't have to be about force in other words. We might be barking up the wrong tree if we assume it does. The nature of prophetic language isn't like reading a textbook or newspaper which are more factual and literally precise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heleadethme Posted May 23, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 15 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,371 Content Per Day: 1.35 Reputation: 3,268 Days Won: 5 Joined: 07/10/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2022 20 hours ago, Alive said: Alive’s assertion: all verses folks use to assert a one world/all world government are inferential and are thus informed by a preconception. Amen. Been thinking about that lately. Along with the scriptures, we have the Holy Spirit....how many believers actually get a witness of the Spirit when we hear about "one world government"? I get the opposite, more like a quiet "gong" or a sour note. As someone already pointed out...Jesus said nation would rise up against nation...that doesn't sound like a one world government. And I'm wondering also, if it was Almighty GOD who dispersed and divided the nations, does man or devil even have the power to reverse that? Even if it's always in their hearts to try, just because rebelliousness and lust for power lives in their hearts. But trying is not the same thing as succeeding. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heleadethme Posted May 23, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 15 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,371 Content Per Day: 1.35 Reputation: 3,268 Days Won: 5 Joined: 07/10/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 23, 2022 1 hour ago, Shilohsfoal said: As I understand it, when Israel appeared, the world was amazed and people from all nations from all over the world followed Israel into the land of Israel. It doesn't mean israel rules the world. It just means people followed after it from all the world. This has taken place. As of now the Israeli goverment is working on its cashless society. Give them alittle time,they are working hard. Wouldn't hurt to keep a little eye on Israel, in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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