God is not a laundry service that wash your sins in two hours and then you become clean and fragrant.

[kwikphilly]

52 minutes ago, Dan Knight said:

When unsaved folk become Christian Folk a new element is added to their responsibilities.  To be overcomers. Very critical. Jesus said that before, if we commit adultery we sin, but now if we think it in our hearts, lust gone unchecked,  we sin the same. Matt 5:27, 28-28But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman to lust after her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

 Not good. It is critical that we strive to be Overcomers.  

I have heard Christian people say that it's OK to think it, as long as we don't do it. Not true.  How important is overcoming?

Rev 21:6-8, - 6And He told me, “It is done! I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. To the thirsty I will give freely from the spring of the water of life. 7The one who overcomes will inherit all things, and I will be his God, and he will be My son. 8But...

Agreed- and when unsaved folk are Born Again they now have Christ Abiding IN them,having access to the very Heart & Mind of Christ Jesus- that is how we Overcome the bondages of sin (the flesh/ the carnal mind)

Holy Spirit/ our Helper.....feed the spirit!

All Glory to God!

[Dan Knight]

13 minutes ago, kwikphilly said:

Agreed- and when unsaved folk are Born Again they now have Christ Abiding IN them,having access to the very Heart & Mind of Christ Jesus- that is how we Overcome the bondages of sin (the flesh/ the carnal mind)

Holy Spirit/ our Helper.....feed the spirit!

All Glory to God!

Agreed.

[Starise]

1 hour ago, kwikphilly said:

Of course Brother- I have no doubt everyone slips up here & there but like Rosie1Jack2Pauline said " we ARE Forgiven"

A Born Again Believer will recognize his transgression,have remorse,repent & move on with Confidence in WHO He is in Christ Jesus,the sin was Forgiven over 2000 yrs ago on Calvary!The enemy will accuse,blame,condemn , remind you of your wrongdoing and tell you that you are not worthy, unholy but that's a lie of the devil.We can Trust Jesus Finished Work & have Faith in God's Grace that we have been counted as Righteous.... Let us boast for Christ!

With love in Christ,Kwik

I appreciate your thoughts kwik and appreciate the words of others here as well. Some of it spoke to me in ways they might never have imagined.

We are forgiven. As one pastor would often say for sins- " past, present and future".

Some say then why should we repent since we are forgiven already? 

For me, repentance is the realization I have guilt. Otherwise I would not see the need to repent. Why did I have guilt? Because I KNOWINGLY did something I knew was against what God asked me to do. Why would anyone knowingly go against what God told them to do after they realize the tremendous price that was paid to cover our sins? Why would anyone continue to sin or even entertain the idea of sin? 

Those who willingly continue in sin and and never think to repent of it are not children of God. Sins of ignorance which are few for most probably fall into another category. These are the things we confess that we aren't sure what they were, but still sins none the less. When we KNOWINGLY and WILLFULLY sin. we know deep down we are turning from God and we are breaking our fellowship with Him by running from Him.

To be relationally tight with God I believe repentance is necessary. Positionally we were never lost. Relationally we damaged the relationship. We shut off the blessings God wanted to give us. We sacrifice the fellowship we could have had with Him, and all for what? Some silly sin we can't seem to let go of.

I believe we SHOULD feel guilty when we willfully sin.

[Dan Knight]

9 minutes ago, Starise said:

I appreciate your thoughts kwik and appreciate the words of others here as well. Some of it spoke to me in ways they might never have imagined.

We are forgiven. As one pastor would often say for sins- " past, present and future".

Some say then why should we repent since we are forgiven already? 

For me, repentance is the realization I have guilt. Otherwise I would not see the need to repent. Why did I have guilt? Because I KNOWINGLY did something I knew was against what God asked me to do. Why would anyone knowingly go against what God told them to do after they realize the tremendous price that was paid to cover our sins? Why would anyone continue to sin or even entertain the idea of sin? 

Those who willingly continue in sin and and never think to repent of it are not children of God. Sins of ignorance which are few for most probably fall into another category. These are the things we confess that we aren't sure what they were, but still sins none the less. When we KNOWINGLY and WILLFULLY sin. we know deep down we are turning from God and we are breaking our fellowship with Him by running from Him.

To be relationally tight with God I believe repentance is necessary. Positionally we were never lost. Relationally we damaged the relationship. We shut off the blessings God wanted to give us. We sacrifice the fellowship we could have had with Him, and all for what? Some silly sin we can't seem to let go of.

I believe we SHOULD feel guilty when we willfully sin.

 

Romans 7:19-25

King James Version

 

¹⁹ For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

²⁰ Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

²¹ I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

²² For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

²³ But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

²⁴ O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?

²⁵ I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

 

[Starise]

35 minutes ago, Dan Knight said:

 

Romans 7:19-25

King James Version

 

¹⁹ For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

²⁰ Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

²¹ I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

²² For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

²³ But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

²⁴ O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?

²⁵ I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

 

I appreciate these scriptures Dan. This text often comes up in discussions about Christians, repentance and sin. Poor old Paul, always doing what he didn't want to do. There's lots of truth in these passages.

Here is the dilemma for me. Sometimes we WANT to sin.

Paul is blaming a part of him he doesn't like that is sinning, but it is still part of HIM. On the surface it almost seems like a very indecisive person....Did I want to sin or not? Well I DID sin and I was attracted to whatever it was that drew me away to do it. It could even be said I LIKED it on some level. If I didn't like it I wouldn't do it.

So where does the responsibility lie? It still lies with Paul because it was HIM that did it, whether he liked that part of him or not.

If we are blaming, this must be the ultimate blame game. To blame a part of us that we don't see as really being a part of us, yet it is or this gets really weird. Sounds almost like a person with a split personality. " I didn't want to do it but HE did it". Who is HE? HE is you.

FWIW Paul doesn't pass the blame. He takes responsibility for that horrible part of him that liked to sin against God. That part of him that is ugly and has no redemptive qualities whatsoever.

I feel the need to apologize, to REPENT for that ugly sinful side when it goes astray and realize it's a part of ME that needs to be dealt with by God help.

What was Paul feeling exactly? Did he literally hate himself? Or was it merely frustration? 

I would much prefer Paul's attitude than a person who says, " I am actually quite an impressive Christian. When I look in the mirror, I see a wonderful almost sinless person. Oh there are a few small acne bumps in my life, but I cover them over and no one notices they are even there."

Edited September 9, 2022 by Starise

[Dan Knight]

1 minute ago, Starise said:

I appreciate these scriptures Dan. This text often comes up in discussions about Christians, repentance and sin. Poor old Paul, always doing what he didn't want to do. There's lots of truth in these passages.

Here is the dilemma for me. Sometimes we WANT to sin.

Paul is blaming a part of him he doesn't like that is sinning, but it is still part of HIM. On the surface it almost seems like a very indecisive person....Did I want to sin or not? Well I DID sin and I was attracted to whatever it was that drew me away to do it. It could even be said I LIKED it on some level. If I didn't like it I wouldn't do it.

So where does the responsibility lie? It still lies with Paul because it was HIM that did it, whether he liked that part of him or not.

If we are blaming, this must be the ultimate blame game. To blame a part of us that we don't see as really being a part of us, yet it is or this gets really weird. Sounds almost like a person with a split personality. " I didn't want to do it but HE did it". Who is HE? HE is you.

FWIW Paul doesn't pass the blame. He takes responsibility for that horrible part of him that liked to sin against God. That part of him that is ugly and has no redemptive qualities whatsoever.

I feel the need to apologize, to REPENT for that ugly sinful side when it goes astray and realize it's a part of ME that needs to be dealt with by God help.

What was Paul feeling exactly? Did he literally hate himself? Or was it merely frustration? 

I would much prefer Paul's attitude than a person who says, " I am actually quite an impressive Christian. When I look in the mirror, I see a wonderful almost sinless person. Oh there are a few small acne bump in my life, but I cover them over and no one notices they are even there."

To say poor old Paul is to say poor old us...

Poor old me, (us).

[Dan Knight]

4 minutes ago, Starise said:

I appreciate these scriptures Dan. This text often comes up in discussions about Christians, repentance and sin. Poor old Paul, always doing what he didn't want to do. There's lots of truth in these passages.

Here is the dilemma for me. Sometimes we WANT to sin.

Paul is blaming a part of him he doesn't like that is sinning, but it is still part of HIM. On the surface it almost seems like a very indecisive person....Did I want to sin or not? Well I DID sin and I was attracted to whatever it was that drew me away to do it. It could even be said I LIKED it on some level. If I didn't like it I wouldn't do it.

So where does the responsibility lie? It still lies with Paul because it was HIM that did it, whether he liked that part of him or not.

If we are blaming, this must be the ultimate blame game. To blame a part of us that we don't see as really being a part of us, yet it is or this gets really weird. Sounds almost like a person with a split personality. " I didn't want to do it but HE did it". Who is HE? HE is you.

FWIW Paul doesn't pass the blame. He takes responsibility for that horrible part of him that liked to sin against God. That part of him that is ugly and has no redemptive qualities whatsoever.

I feel the need to apologize, to REPENT for that ugly sinful side when it goes astray and realize it's a part of ME that needs to be dealt with by God help.

What was Paul feeling exactly? Did he literally hate himself? Or was it merely frustration? 

I would much prefer Paul's attitude than a person who says, " I am actually quite an impressive Christian. When I look in the mirror, I see a wonderful almost sinless person. Oh there are a few small acne bump in my life, but I cover them over and no one notices they are even there."

Jesus said that the man who beat on his chest in frustration of.his sinful life is better off than the guy who said " at least I ain't as bad as that guy."

[ayin jade]

4 hours ago, JohnR7 said:

Everything in life is a choice. People can choose not to get up out of bed in the morning if they want. We choose if we want life, health, prosperity or death, sickness and poverty. 

Proverbs 24 33A little sleep, a little slumber, a little folding of the hands to rest, 34and poverty will come upon you like a robber, and need like a bandit.

I do not know a single cancer patient who chose to have cancer. My husband did not choose to have poverty when he was young, nor did his parents. His baby sister did not choose to die in a car accident. Some things are not choices.

[JohnR7]

3 hours ago, ayin jade said:

I do not know a single cancer patient who chose to have cancer.

It is well established that smoking cause cancer. If you smoke, if you drink to excess, if you eat the wrong foods, that is a choice to be sick. 

My wife comes from extreme poverty in the Philippines. Her parents made a lot of sacrifice to get a good education. Then she left her family and friends to move to Hong Kong to get a better paying job compared to what was available in her country. 

Perhaps my son is the one to talk to. He put a lot of work and effort into getting a degree in Computer Engineering. He has NO sympathy for his fellow students who squandered their opportunity and complain about ending up working for McDonalds. Everyone had all the same opportunities. 

This is the land of opportunity, compared to a third world nation where opportunity is few and far inbetween. The same with my father. He had no money, yet he worked hard - earned scholarships and became a medical doctor. 

People live in poverty because they have a poverty mentality. They get sick because they bring the sickness on themselves. Not that it matters because no matter what happens to us in life: God has a plan for us to prosper and enjoy good health. All things work together for the good of those that love God and are called according to His purpose. 

David clearly tells us that God writes the book of our life at or before conception. We need to become the person God declares us to be. I have seen to many people healed to believe that is God's plan and purpose for us to be sick. God is life and heath and healing. He wants the very best for us. 

This is always the first step to healing is to overcome your negative thinking that accepts the sickness even though that is not God's plan and purpose for us. 

[ayin jade]

17 minutes ago, JohnR7 said:

It is well established that smoking cause cancer. If you smoke, if you drink to excess, if you eat the wrong foods, that is a choice to be sick. 

My wife comes from extreme poverty in the Philippines. Her parents made a lot of sacrifice to get a good education. Then she left her family and friends to move to Hong Kong to get a better paying job compared to what was available in her country. 

Perhaps my son is the one to talk to. He put a lot of work and effort into getting a degree in Computer Engineering. He has NO sympathy for his fellow students who squandered their opportunity and complain about ending up working for McDonalds. Everyone had all the same opportunities. 

This is the land of opportunity, compared to a third world nation where opportunity is few and far inbetween. The same with my father. He had no money, yet he worked hard - earned scholarships and became a medical doctor. 

People live in poverty because they have a poverty mentality. They get sick because they bring the sickness on themselves. Not that it matters because no matter what happens to us in life: God has a plan for us to prosper and enjoy good health. All things work together for the good of those that love God and are called according to His purpose. 

David clearly tells us that God writes the book of our life at or before conception. We need to become the person God declares us to be. I have seen to many people healed to believe that is God's plan and purpose for us to be sick. God is life and heath and healing. He wants the very best for us. 

This is always the first step to healing is to overcome your negative thinking that accepts the sickness even though that is not God's plan and purpose for us. 

Those born with a genetic defect do not choose to be sick or have cancer. Thise who live on indian reservations did not choose to be born into poverty.