WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS

[JesusisGod2]

This has been brought up in various points of light, I too have my opinion what are yours:

1) they all had lamps

2) 5 had oil--5 did not

3) they were all expecting the lords return

4) they all fell asleep

5) they all had lamps

6) they all heard the cry of the bridegroom

7) 5 were allowed into the wedding 5 were not

My question is were the 5 left behind saved and lost thier salvation? or were they never saved to begin with?

after all they believed in His return and were in fact anticipating His return which hints that they were believers.

[Ovedya]

As usual, I cannot top the Recovery Version's footnotes on this subject.

Here is the link to the verses: http://online.recoveryversion.org/BibleCha...fcid=25&lcid=25

Click each red number to view the footnote references. The blue letters reference verses related to the word that follows.

Enjoy!

[JesusisGod2]

Hey thanks God-man, that really is a good site for reference. I wish I could have seen others opinion on the board prior to my asking the question so that I am not beating the same horse that you guys have already put to pasture.

This guy (who does the footnotes) seems to imply that all the virgins were dead (asleep) though. I dont really get that out of this passage, but it is an interesting interpretation and not to say that he is wrong. it definately merits further study for I never seen this in this light before.

the way I understand it is they all have the word of God (Psalm 119:105 ...lamp to my feet..) represented by the lamps.

but only half are born again by the Spirit of God -- represented by the oil (there are unnamed religions out there that practice this today, by trying to attain salvation through works of the law and try to use Gods word [the lamp] to justify thier actions and there are those who seek thier justication through faith and are approved by God sealing with the Holy Spirit [oil] )

well like I said I dont want to beat the same horse but isnt this passage refering more to the rapture of those who are alive? the foolish brides went to try and buy oil, but there was none to be found. which I understand to mean that the church is already gone and therefore all that is left are false religions who have no oil (Holy Spirit).

but I still have that question of were the follish virgins saved and lost thier salvation? were they ever really saved? God man --- I have read some of your responses to others and respect your insight. if this is a closed subject I will understand. I have alot more on this subject that I can learn from others. as well as share what I have learned already. Gods word is a beautiful thing to behold especially when he parts the waters of understanding and we are shown the way to freedom.

Have a great weekend! I wont be able to respond back until Monday but would appreciate anyones response.

[Ovedya]

This guy (who does the footnotes) seems to imply that all the virgins were dead (asleep) though. I dont really get that out of this passage, but it is an interesting interpretation and not to say that he is wrong. it definately merits further study for I never seen this in this light before.

Neither have I. But in any case, we agree that the ten virgins represent the kingdom people.

But I still have that question of were the follish virgins saved and lost thier salvation? were they ever really saved?

The verses seem to indicate that the five foolish virgins were saved, but they were not prepared for the Bridegroom/ Verse 3 says that they took their lamps, but did not take any oil with them. A lamp can only carry sufficient oil for a certain period of time. Therefore, they were foolish for not taking an extra portion of oil. The prudent virgins had their lamps, plus vessels to carry the oil in. This indicates that they gained an extra portion of the Spirit.

As indicated in the Scriptures, the wedding feast of the Lamb is partaken of only by the overcomers and the Lamb of God. The overcoming saints in Revelation are adorned in white robes, as are the guests at the wedding in Matthew 22. The overcomers in Revelation get to partake of a special portion, whereas the defeated believers do not. This does not mean that the defeated believers become unsaved or cast into the lake of fire, however. It means that they will not be able to partake of the special portion of the wedding feast of the Lamb.

The point of this parable is that we must gain an extra portion of the Spirit while we await the arrival of our bridegroom, lest the darkness of this age falls upon us and overtakes us.

I do not consider this subject to be put away. Not in the least bit. It is very important for us all to learn from the Lord's parables and take heed.

[JesusisGod2]

Hey thanks God-man, man is Gods word deep . I do have one question though and that is if the wise virgins are guest at the wedding , then who is the bride? I have always assumed that the church was the bride. that was a very good reply though it is definately food for thought and study. thanks again

[Ovedya]

Hey thanks God-man, man is Gods word deep . I do have one question though and that is if the wise virgins are guest at the wedding , then who is the bride? I have always assumed that the church was the bride. that was a very good reply though it is definately food for thought and study. thanks again

The bride is the church. In the Bible, the church is portrayed as many things at once, and need not be one or the other at any one time. Here's a short list:

• The Shulamite, the counterpart of Solomon (Christ) in the Song of Songs
  
• The kingdom of the heavens. The sphere in which Christ, as the king rules and reigns ( Matt. 4:17; 10:7; cf. Mark 1:15; Matt. 5:3; 10; 20; 7:21; 11:11; 13:24; 25:1; Dan. 2:44; 4:26)
  
• The household of God, with the believers as the members individually and the church corporately. (Matt. 24:45; Eph. 2:19; 1 Tim. 3:15)
  
• The bride of Christ (John 3:25-29; Eph. 5:23-25).
  
• The tabernacle of God with the members as the priesthood (1 Pet. 2:5)
  
• The eternal Bethel, the house of God (1 Pet. 2:5; Gen. 28:19; 22; 1 Tim. 3:15; 1 Pet. 4:17)
  
• The Body of Christ, with Christ as the essential content (Rom. 12:5; 1 Cor. 10:16; 12:12, 27; Eph. 3:6; 4:2)
  
• The New Jerusalem, the city of God (Rev. 21:2; 10; Gal. 4:26; Heb. 11:10; 12:22)
  

[nebula]

My pastor says that parables don't necessarily stand on all four legs. What he means by that is for the meaning of the parable to come across, it may not fit with all matters of theology.

For instance, in this case, should not the five wise virgins have shared their oil with the others? What about all of Jesus' teaching about giving and sharing? Why did this not apply to the five wise virgins? Well, if they had shared, it would have taken away from the point of the parable (as one person cannot take of their anointing and give it to someone else!).

So, you could likewise say that for the sake of the meaning of the parable, the Church is best symbolized as the 10 Virgins. See?

[Adstar]

Matthew 25

1 "Then the kingdom of heaven shall be likened to ten virgins who took their lamps and went out to meet the bridegroom. 2Now five of them were wise, and five were foolish. 3Those who were foolish took their lamps and took no oil with them, 4but the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps. 5But while the bridegroom was delayed, they all slumbered and slept.

6"And at midnight a cry was heard: "Behold, the bridegroom is coming;[1] go out to meet him!' 7Then all those virgins arose and trimmed their lamps. 8And the foolish said to the wise, "Give us some of your oil, for our lamps are going out.' 9But the wise answered, saying, "No, lest there should not be enough for us and you; but go rather to those who sell, and buy for yourselves.' 10And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came, and those who were ready went in with him to the wedding; and the door was shut.

11"Afterward the other virgins came also, saying, "Lord, Lord, open to us!' 12But he answered and said, "Assuredly, I say to you, I do not know you.'

13"Watch therefore, for you know neither the day nor the hour[2] in which the Son of Man is coming.

Lets look at some scriptures that talk about the lamp:

Proverbs 13:9

The light of the righteous rejoices, But the lamp of the wicked will be put out.

Isaiah 62:1

For Zion's sake I will not hold My peace, And for Jerusalem's sake I will not rest, Until her righteousness goes forth as brightness, And her salvation as a lamp that burns.

And here are the WORDs direct from the Messiah Jesus

Matthew 5

14"You are the light of the world. A city that is set on a hill cannot be hidden. 15Nor do they light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on a lampstand, and it gives light to all who are in the house. 16Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works and glorify your Father in heaven.

So to me the lamp is the faith that is the belief in the Messiah Jesus. If one has a lamp one has the faith. But we know faith without works is dead.

John 5

33You have sent to John, and he has borne witness to the truth. 34Yet I do not receive testimony from man, but I say these things that you may be saved. 35He was the burning and shining lamp, and you were willing for a time to rejoice in his light. 36But I have a greater witness than John's; for the works which the Father has given Me to finish--the very works that I do--bear witness of Me, that the Father has sent Me.

So John not only had the faith/lamp but he was also a burning and shining lamp that is he showed by shining the light/ delivering the message of salvation through the Messiah Jesus, His work was his bearing witness.

So a lamp that does not burn and shine it

[Guest shadow2b]

heyyyyyyyy all----could this also be referring to the fact that the 5 UNwise virgins had been "saved" But, they had NOT sought for or asked for the "gift" of the HOLY-SPIRIT-------luke.11.vs.13-----IF ye then,being evil,know how to give good gifts unto your children; how much more shall your heavenly FATHER give the HOLY-SPIRIT--to them that "ask" HIM??---acts.1.vss.4b & 5-----BUT wait for the promise of the FATHER, which, saith HE,ye have heard of me..For john truly baptized with water,but ye shall be baptized with the HOLY-GHOST not many days hence...-------acts1.vs.8------But ye shall receive"POWER", after the HOLY-GHOST is come upon you;and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in JERUSALEM,and in all JUDAEA,and in SAMARIA,and unto the uttermost part of the earth.....----acts.2.vs.4------And they were ALL "filled" with the HOLY-GHOST, and began to speak with other tongues,as the SPIRIT gave them utterance..-----ACTS.2.vs.38-& 39----Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized everone of you in the name of JESUS CHRIST for the remission of sins,and ye shall receive the "gift" of the HOLY-GHOST.....For the promise is unto you,and to your children,and to all that are afar off,even as many as the LORD our GOD shall call.....------EPH.1.vs.13-&.14-------

IN whom ye also trusted "AFTER" that ye heard the word of truth,the gospel of your salvation;in whom also

"AFTER" that ye believed,ye were "sealed" with that HOLY-SPIRIT of promise,which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession,unto the praise of HIS glory.......ACTS.1.vs.17------- That the GOD of our LORD JESUS CHRIST,the FATHER of glory,may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of HIM.....NOW, i said all that to say; there are many denominations that "teach"

the GIFTS of the HOLY-SPIRIT all CEASED after the last apostles DIED---i.e. john-- BUT john hasNOT died yet--

john.21.vss.20.thru.24------- SO that theory is not valid,unless a particular denomination teaches differently,

which "many" do.....SO, their theory is that they{ men/women} in that particular denomination doNOT need any EMpowerment from the HOLY-SPIRIT to lead the lost to salvation--AND the "GIFTS" or "GIFT" of the HOLY-SPIRIT is "childish"& as such "should be PUT AWAY!!! according to;1/st.corin.13.vs.11--- Well if the gifts of the HOLY-SPIRIT i.e. speaking with other tongues is "CHILDISH" then prophecy is "CHILDISH" & should be "put away"{STOPPED--NO longer used} the word of "KNOWLEDGE" is a gift of the HOLY-SPIRIT- & should be; {put away--stopped--no longer used,NO longer VALID!!}--Revelation knowledge is a "gift" of the HOLY-SPIRIT & since all these "gifts" ceased, then revelation knowledge should be; "stopped,no longer used,no longer valid"etc.etc.etc.--------NOW, since ALL these great luminaries of "the faith" KNOW so much more & better than GOD HIMSELF & doNOT want any of their "sheep" to do anything other than accept their denominational doctrines AS the foremost authority of GOD'S WORD, without any discordance or questioning of those doctrines by any member of that particular flock....TO do so {question} brings down the full weight & ire of the upper echelons in that church--denomination & lands on the poor hapless novice that had the UNmitigated gall to question..??????Would this be called {taking away from GOD'S WORD} as in REV.22.vs.19-

?????? SO,just how unwise {foolish} were the 5 virgins?? WERE the 5 wise {filled} with the HOLY-SPIRIT????

OR is there still another explaination of this parable?? AM i way OFF base here?? I guess it's a character flaw

that just "drives" me to question????? ----------GOD-BLESS-------in love-- {Gary}-- :upsided:

[JesusisGod2]

Hey Shadow,

Could be, Could be.

I never expected to hear so many different views on this and all of them great and all of them ringing with truth. Its a beatiful thing when the body of Christ comes together and shares all that the Master has taught them, and shows how much we need each other in order to function properly.

I believe in the baptism of the Holy Ghost (lets try not to go too far off the virgins question on this and get on the baptism of the holy spirit of which there is an excellant topic already posted on that) and have prayed for it but as of yet have not yet recieved it, (or at least I dont speak in tongues)

so lets say I die suddenly -- will I be left behind? (I am not being facetious here, but I am seeking the truth [and to tell the truth thats a pretty scary thought]) I think you bring up a good point though, could it be that this is the case here?

Gods word is deep, just when you think you understand the meaning of something, He either adds to your understanding or He shows you the error of your understanding. He has certainly done that for me in my life and I pray that He continues to keep my heart and mind open to understaning His word.

I look forward to the responses.

" Preserve me, O God; for in Thee do I put my trust" Psalm 16:1