Standing one's ground?

[Neighbor]

"Stand Your Ground"

While law or at least a principle  of criminal law and separately civil law in some places within the USA is it Biblical? Is it in line with the directions of our Lord and savior Yeshua?

There have been a whole series of events most resulting in deaths where the principle that one is protected from criminal prosecution  as well as civil liability when standing  one's ground has come into play. Does this principle of law as proclaimed and utilized help or hinder personal safety?

I have my own present thought that it is a most abused concept that is resulting in deaths  that never would have occurred except for this concept that it is legal to shoot people whose presence cause  some sense of  great discomfort or fear. Seems the abuse of it bty individuals is leading to a deliberate incitement and then entrapment where unarmed individuals posing no threat are being shot and killed.

I see it getting way worse at places like the USA State of Florida. Seems to me the defense "stand your ground" is being preplanned, and is actually an attack not a defense at all. Hardly seems like a turning the other cheek and instead is more a I dare you to knock this chip off my shoulder.

The resulting chaos  today is simply awful, with people's worse instincts not being stiffled , instead encouraged.

 

 

 

[The_Patriot21]

While I can see where stand your ground laws can be abused...I also see the value.

In states without them there have been many people, who while armed, were shot in the back while trying to follow the law-by fleeing. 

If your in a open area and an assailant approaches you, sure your car maybe 50 feet away, but there's no garentee you can get there before being shot or stabbed.

If I am walking around my neighborhood and some gangster walks up to  me flashing a gun demanding I let him take my daughter or else, it certainly wasn't pre planned by me. But I garentee I'm not going to run, unless there's a clear avenue of escape-im going to do whatever I have to do to protect my daughter, or die trying.

Even if I'm alone it's likely to be the same story, I'm the sole provider of my family, I can't provide or protect them if I'm dead.

Of course, if they're just after my wallet, then they can have that. No sense killing someone over money. But I'm not going to let them harm me or my family.

So do stand your ground laws have their downsides? Yes. They're not perfect. But I'd rather have them then not.

 

[FJK]

Deadly force for self defense is a difficult choice for a Christian, my long standing view on it is don't shoot if you don't have to because there is no other option available.

 

[Marathoner]

6 hours ago, Neighbor said:

"Stand Your Ground"

While law or at least a principle  of criminal law and separately civil law in some places within the USA is it Biblical? Is it in line with the directions of our Lord and savior Yeshua?

There have been a whole series of events most resulting in deaths where the principle that one is protected from criminal prosecution  as well as civil liability when standing  one's ground has come into play. Does this principle of law as proclaimed and utilized help or hinder personal safety?

I have my own present thought that it is a most abused concept that is resulting in deaths  that never would have occurred except for this concept that it is legal to shoot people whose presence cause  some sense of  great discomfort or fear. Seems the abuse of it bty individuals is leading to a deliberate incitement and then entrapment where unarmed individuals posing no threat are being shot and killed.

I see it getting way worse at places like the USA State of Florida. Seems to me the defense "stand your ground" is being preplanned, and is actually an attack not a defense at all. Hardly seems like a turning the other cheek and instead is more a I dare you to knock this chip off my shoulder.

The resulting chaos  today is simply awful, with people's worse instincts not being stiffled , instead encouraged.

We remember the words of the Lord regarding the estate of mankind, brother. Most of us are familiar with a particular passage from Romans 3, but it would be good if I posted it here so others may be reminded of the truth regarding man, this world he has fashioned in his own image with his laws, and the judgment of the Lord.

What then? Are we better than they? Not at all; for we have already charged that both Jews and Greeks are all under sin; as it is written:

“There is no righteous person, not even one;
  There is no one who understands,
  There is no one who seeks out God;
  They have all turned aside, together they have become corrupt;
  There is no one who does good,
  There is not even one.”
  “Their throat is an open grave,
   With their tongues they keep deceiving,”
  “The venom of asps is under their lips”;
  “Their mouth is full of cursing and bitterness”;
  “Their feet are swift to shed blood,
   Destruction and misery are in their paths,
   And they have not known the way of peace.”
  “There is no fear of God before their eyes.”
(Romans 3:9-18 NASB)

No nation of this earth loves the Lord, nor have these nations of man loved the Lord at any time. The words of the Son of God mean nothing to men, for His words are absent from their legal documents and foundations. Some swear oaths on bibles, violating the commandment of the Lord to utter no oath of any kind. Others declare that whatever they do, they do in His name, but their works are nothing but evil and wickedness. It will not go well for them.

I refuse to carry or brandish weaponry of any kind, for I have learned that I live or die according to the will and purpose of the Lord who raised me up. The promise of death is the promise of this world, for murder is what this world has to give to the righteous and the wicked alike. I learned by walking in the face of certain death, and it was terrifying to endure at first. This flesh cried out against the insanity of facing armed men with nothing in my hands, but that's all this flesh knows: fear born of blindness and steadfast opposition to the Spirit of the Lord. 

Let them do whatever they want to me. There is nothing man can do to me that I haven't suffered already. What? They're going to take what I possess? I've lost more than that on more occasions than I can number. Let them have it, I say.

They're going to kill me? Good! To live is Christ, but to die is gain. Do they wish to torture me? That doesn't bother me. I've endured torture at various times during my life on this earth. I've starved and been left for dead, so there's nothing man can do to me that I haven't suffered already. Pain is an old friend. 

And yet, here I am. I stand not because of anything I've done, but because the Lord makes me stand. Whatever I have is easily replaced. As for the life in this body? I look toward the hope of our salvation that, one day, my course will be done and the Lord will gather me to Him. The Lord has honored me beyond words in this life by giving me His own. Even though He slay me, I trust Him. 

No, these "stand your ground" laws are not in keeping with the words of our Lord.

[Logostician]

I am a CCW carrier.  I carry my weapon to church, as do the others on our security team.  We are all retired military   If someone comes into my church and threatens the lives of the members, as has happened in other churches, I will kill him.  I will do the same to defend any stranger on the street whose life is threatened, if there is no other recourse.  Jesus will judge me.  But we've already discussed it.  He knows my heart.

[Neighbor]

Please let me share as clarification that I am not thinking through the merit of  conceal carry, nor open carry. That subject  is more than well discussed already. I am discussing "stand your ground" a quite different subject.

Perhaps a nuance of the overall topic, regarding lethal weaponry, but I think it an important one that needs stand on it's own for consideration, seeing what is now happening.

Some individuals have killed other individuals by shooting blindly through the closed and locked front door of their own home. At least one had just gone out and bought a weapon  for that very purpose. There was no lethal threat against the shooter at the time the shooter stood their ground at their "castle" and committed a homicide. They couldn't even see their victim, they just fired their lethal weapon because they were irritated became agitated and then acted out the way they did  thinking they can do so  standing their ground as their right to do so.

Stand your ground  is being used or thought of  as a law allowing one to kill when disturbed  by a noise a knock on a door. It seems to me to be bringing out the very worst in some individuals during this new era of irritations. Perhaps another  sign in the time of the signs. Lives are being ruined and some are being ended as result of stand your ground thinking as used by what I think of as rather unstable individuals. And yes most all these deaths occurring  have an aspect of hate and/or fear based upon race differences. 

 

[Neighbor]

Might an aspect of the super saturated level of irritation that some seem to have be in part due to the absolutely higher level of noise in the world today? Is it perhaps that simple, that there is no quiet no real peaceful time to relax. Or is that a way too simplified thought?

I just saw for the first time a calming booth. It is in an office building I went into where business people share use of office spaces. It was actually in use! Last evening on the news I saw a building that had three calming booths. Is that what we are coming to, the need for calm, or else risk going what once was called going postal? 

If so what is that a sign of, in this world and time? 

[FJK]

26 minutes ago, Neighbor said:

And yes most all these deaths occurring  have an aspect of hate and/or fear based upon race differences. 

Is that a fact (something that a can be researched and verified) or a personal opinion?

I ask because it doesn't look that way to me, but I'm willing to change that view if presented with facts that would convince me otherwise.

[Neighbor]

16 minutes ago, FJK said:

Is that a fact (something that a can be researched and verified) or a personal opinion?

I ask because it doesn't look that way to me, but I'm willing to change that view if presented with facts that would convince me otherwise.

 It is fact, absolute fact without any doubt at all. Each more infamous case that has led up to the stand your ground laws have had a beginning where race difference was a serious part of the "fear" that produced the hate and then the action of homicide.

Now  as latest example we have a white lady who was disturbed by the black kids playing  in the open field next to her home. She yelled racial epithets at them. Their mother came to the lady's home, knocked on the solid front door and was shot dead. Details are all over the news; but this is not an isolated case it is ongoing. It seems to me stand your ground has become the  key that has unlocked  opportunity to think one can just murder what irritates them all under the guise of standing one's ground.

Can't imagine such a thing happening  when I was a little kid playing with other kids all over the neighborhoods, and yet there was plenty of racial divide back then. Something is different today, people  are now IMO much like bees in a glass jar that is being shook up,  they just are going nutso with irritation- my thought anyway. 

[FJK]

10 minutes ago, Neighbor said:

It is fact, absolute fact without any doubt at all.

I can't find any official sources for that fact, only opinions, and generally opinions being expressed for political or other agenda driven reasons.  (Remember that you stated "most" and not "some".)