Jayne Posted February 27 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 108 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 3,827 Content Per Day: 1.29 Reputation: 4,818 Days Won: 2 Joined: 03/31/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted February 27 3 minutes ago, AdHoc said: I agree with you. But what made him choose the way he went? Remember, the OP established a LAW in us. Adam did not have this Law of sin and death. He had the "law" of don't eat the fruit of that particular tree. Why did he do it if not deceived? He just decided to disobey. She did. He chose to also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdHoc Posted February 27 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 4 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,067 Content Per Day: 3.29 Reputation: 1,465 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/29/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted February 27 31 minutes ago, Jayne said: Short answer - Eve was deceived. The devil's deception involved convincing her that God's words were incorrect. "Did God REALLY say?" Her sin began when she had a conversation with the devil and listened to him. It wasn't because she was stupid, just deceived. The devil didn't start with her because she was weaker than Adam. Adam whom the Bible was "with her" just deliberately disobeyed. Jesus says that the whole of humanity is deceived by the devil. Revelation 12:9. And after that initial deliberate disobedience, I'm sure that Adam was deceived in sin, too, during his lifetime. Two things: [1] Yes, Eve saw that the fruit was pleasant to the eye and good for food. But remember, God MADE it that way. Genesis 2:9. There's more to this than meets the eye. There's a sermon somewhere in that. [2] I've taught many times the relationship between Eve's sin, Jesus' temptation, and 1 John 2:15-17. So you are correct there making a correlation. In my opinion, the devil used and uses those tactics because those were the things that caused him to fall. He only uses what he knows. He was full of beauty and became prideful because of it. Ezekiel 28:12-13 and 17. Pride of life and lust of the eye. He thought he was higher than God. Isaiah 14:12-14 Pride of life Yes. Eve was deceived. But only in one matter - eating from a forbidden Tree. She was not deceived into NOT eating from the Tree of Life. She was not deceived into thinking that God was holding out on her. What was in her to not do what was "commanded of her" (Gen.2:16)? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marilyn C Posted February 27 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 30 Topic Count: 269 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 13,245 Content Per Day: 3.49 Reputation: 8,523 Days Won: 12 Joined: 12/21/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/06/1947 Share Posted February 27 9 minutes ago, AdHoc said: Yes. Eve was deceived. But only in one matter - eating from a forbidden Tree. She was not deceived into NOT eating from the Tree of Life. She was not deceived into thinking that God was holding out on her. What was in her to not do what was "commanded of her" (Gen.2:16)? Hi Ad Hoc, And why do you think Adam and Eve had not partaken of the `tree of life?` God said they could eat of every tree (except the tree of the knowledge of good and evil). The `tree of life` was in the garden and obviously Adam and Eve ate of the different trees. It was only after they sinned that they then couldn`t partake (again?) of the tree of life, because they then would live forever in their sin. Partaking of the tree of life before they sinned enabled Adam and Eve to have continual life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marilyn C Posted February 27 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 30 Topic Count: 269 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 13,245 Content Per Day: 3.49 Reputation: 8,523 Days Won: 12 Joined: 12/21/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/06/1947 Share Posted February 27 As to Adam and Eve, their moral characters were vulnerable as it takes choices over time to develop a moral character. Adam and Eve did not know God intimately. They looked upon Him as a master over them. The devil came as a `friend` who was telling them the `real` story. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdHoc Posted February 27 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 4 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,067 Content Per Day: 3.29 Reputation: 1,465 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/29/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted February 27 3 minutes ago, Marilyn C said: Hi Ad Hoc, And why do you think Adam and Eve had not partaken of the `tree of life?` God said they could eat of every tree (except the tree of the knowledge of good and evil). The `tree of life` was in the garden and obviously Adam and Eve ate of the different trees. It was only after they sinned that they then couldn`t partake (again?) of the tree of life, because they then would live forever in their sin. Partaking of the tree of life before they sinned enabled Adam and Eve to have continual life. The word "also" in Genesis 3:22. 22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever: "Also" means "in addition to". It implies that they had not yet eaten. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdHoc Posted February 27 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 4 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,067 Content Per Day: 3.29 Reputation: 1,465 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/29/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted February 27 4 minutes ago, Marilyn C said: As to Adam and Eve, their moral characters were vulnerable as it takes choices over time to develop a moral character. Adam and Eve did not know God intimately. They looked upon Him as a master over them. The devil came as a `friend` who was telling them the `real` story. Now ... you're close to my theory! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RdJ Posted February 27 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 68 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,212 Content Per Day: 0.39 Reputation: 693 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/11/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/25/1970 Share Posted February 27 12 minutes ago, Jayne said: He had the "law" of don't eat the fruit of that particular tree. Why did he do it if not deceived? He just decided to disobey. She did. He chose to also. Well he told God why: She gave him and then he ate. When sexual sin doesn't bother you at all, but it does bother your partner and you give in, that's like this. Adam wanted to have a partner. Maybe idolatry, that she was more important than God. I think without her he would never have sinned. And maybe because God created him in His own Image. Adam was created in the Image of Jesus. 2 captains on a ship. He wants to be God too. Not naive and be treated like a kid that just has to obey while you have no clue why. They did not know God as He is. If they had they wouldn't have sinned and if satan hadn't sinned I don't think they would ever have sinned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marilyn C Posted February 27 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 30 Topic Count: 269 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 13,245 Content Per Day: 3.49 Reputation: 8,523 Days Won: 12 Joined: 12/21/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/06/1947 Share Posted February 27 Just now, AdHoc said: The word "also" in Genesis 3:22. 22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever: "Also" means "in addition to". It implies that they had not yet eaten. Not really, it says that after they had eaten of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil that they THEN hadn`t gone and taken of the tree of life. it never says anywhere that they had never partaken of it. (You know bro Ad Hoc, we always seem to find something to have a difference over. Well, I suppose it makes discussion interesting.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdHoc Posted February 27 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 4 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,067 Content Per Day: 3.29 Reputation: 1,465 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/29/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted February 27 2 minutes ago, Marilyn C said: Not really, it says that after they had eaten of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil that they THEN hadn`t gone and taken of the tree of life. it never says anywhere that they had never partaken of it. (You know bro Ad Hoc, we always seem to find something to have a difference over. Well, I suppose it makes discussion interesting.) Yes. You make a very interesting debating partner. But in this posting you'll have to reconsider. If God said that that Adam would live for ever IF he ate from the Tree of Life, he could not have died. But he did - showing that he did not eat. The alternative is that "ETERNAL Life" is not ETERNAL and God made a mistake. Besides, why would God block the way to the Tree if you could die anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RdJ Posted February 27 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 68 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,212 Content Per Day: 0.39 Reputation: 693 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/11/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/25/1970 Share Posted February 27 (edited) 6 minutes ago, AdHoc said: Yes. You make a very interesting debating partner. But in this posting you'll have to reconsider. If God said that that Adam would live for ever IF he ate from the Tree of Life, he could not have died. But he did - showing that he did not eat. The alternative is that "ETERNAL Life" is not ETERNAL and God made a mistake. Besides, why would God block the way to the Tree if you could die anyway? I always thought: tree of Life: This is eternal Life that they may know You. So had they eaten from it they would have known God and not eaten from the tree of knowledge of good and evil (get to know satan by experience) I hadn't even thought about that then they also would not die. Had they taken it afterwards, then they could never have been saved, cause they wouldn't die and always stay evil and Jesus then couldn't die for us. Edited February 27 by RdJ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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