R. Hartono Posted March 23 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 771 Topics Per Day: 0.34 Content Count: 6,937 Content Per Day: 3.07 Reputation: 1,979 Days Won: 1 Joined: 02/15/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted March 23 (edited) https://biblehub.com/jeremiah/17-5.htm Jeremiah 17:5 Cursed are those who rely on human, who put their trust in mere flesh. Why did Jesus departed to heaven and relying on flesh to spread Gospel ? Edited March 23 by R. Hartono 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neighbor Posted March 23 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 18 Topic Count: 952 Topics Per Day: 0.35 Content Count: 13,573 Content Per Day: 5.03 Reputation: 9,054 Days Won: 6 Joined: 12/04/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/03/1885 Share Posted March 23 What makes you think God relies on man to spread the gospel of Yeshua? Is the creator dependent upon His creation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deborah_ Posted March 23 Group: Senior Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 790 Content Per Day: 0.25 Reputation: 878 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/07/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted March 23 We don't do it on our own. God sends the Holy Spirit to empower and direct us in the task. If we try to spread the Gospel in our own strength, without relying on the Holy Spirit, we get into deep trouble! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RdJ Posted March 23 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 65 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,090 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 605 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/11/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/25/1970 Share Posted March 23 (edited) He does it through us. He uses us as His body. The idea is: I don't live anymore, but Christ in me, so then it isn't us but Him doing it and using us as a vessel. If the church listens He can do way more this way. In Revelation also angels proclaim the Gospel, but man was given dominion over the earth like a renter, so man has to get the dominion back and Jesus can just visit muslims in dreams, but we have to pray that His Kingdom comes. God can't do anything on earth except when His people pray, said some prayer teacher. 1 Timothy says it too. Pray because God wants them saved. It looks like someone could go to hell if I'm lazy and don't pray. A catholic guy said: Jesus prays for us. Jesus prays? Huh? I thought the whole load was dumped on me. I always felt guilty, maybe because my twin brother died in the whomb, cause before I got saved I was also not allowed to take 3 steps on tiles and I had to move my hands like this or that otherwise someone would die and it was my fault. Guess they call that OCD nowadays. It was always my fault when whoever died. Some politician died? My fault. If you had prayed he would have been healed and saved. We had a politician in the 90s. He was homosexual, anti immigrants, not saved. Someone shot him dead. I was chilling in Canada in a church. I heard it. That poor guy went to hell because I was a lazy monster. I should have been so focused on God that I should have heard that I had to pray for him. That reminds me of a Lutheran who said I was a cosavior. Yes but not how you mean it. He meant by praying the sinner's prayer. God did tell me to pray for Diana btw. And then a year later I heard that a Dutch evangelist got him on his heart. God told him to pray for him to get saved. He prayed 4 hours and then God said it was good. He put on the tv and he saw that he was killed. So he just had to pray him into heaven. Ian McCormack met God before he died, who told him how to get saved and his mother was told to pray. But on the other hand When I say to the wicked, ‘O wicked man, you shall surely die!’ and you do not speak to warn the wicked from his way, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at your hand. Ezekiel 33:8 NKJV https://bible.com/bible/114/ezk.33.8.NKJV But you can say that if God elected someone He can make sure that Ezekiel or whoever warns them, which is not true, cause the ones who didnt hear it get little punishment. “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing! Matthew 23:37 NKJV https://bible.com/bible/114/mat.23.37.NKJV So He wanted to save the kids, but their parents wouldn't let them. I hope that the reformed are right and that God can save the elect. Edited March 23 by RdJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwikphilly Posted March 23 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 96 Topic Count: 307 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 18,136 Content Per Day: 4.63 Reputation: 27,817 Days Won: 327 Joined: 08/03/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted March 23 Your choice of Scripture is completely out of context- it has nothing to do with your allegation against God the Son ,insinuating HE is reliant upon mere mortals to spread the Gospel..... the Scripture is referencing them that have turned away from the Lord God Almighty -men who have turned their backs on God Jesus,our Redeemer Lives and to begin with - is not man,He Was Fully man and Fully God -He Sent the Helper in His Place to spread the Gospel when He Left His earthy Ministry in the flesh,He Continues in Spirit,Holy Spirit and IN each of His Children Born in Spirit,He Abides in us Very strange to pick such a Scripture in an attempt to try to apply it to God Most High Who Cannot turn away from Himself,Who is not a man ,Who is Longsuffering and Has Provided the Way the Truth and the Life that none should perish but have Everlasting Life It borders on blasphemy imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RdJ Posted March 23 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 65 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,090 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 605 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/11/2015 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/25/1970 Share Posted March 23 Lester Sumrall saw people in hell and God said: That's what happens when you won't preach to them. That was his calling. They got saved. I assume God is able to do His will although we can be lousy though. https://www.ligonier.org/learn/qas/if-we-do-not-witness-and-share-the-gospel-will-some-people-not-go-to-heaven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueFollowerOfChrist Posted March 23 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,039 Content Per Day: 1.62 Reputation: 589 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/26/2022 Status: Offline Share Posted March 23 9 hours ago, R. Hartono said: https://biblehub.com/jeremiah/17-5.htm Jeremiah 17:5 Cursed are those who rely on human, who put their trust in mere flesh. Why did Jesus departed to heaven and relying on flesh to spread Gospel ? Jesus knew the success of the mission he was giving the apostles. He knew the church would one day cover the whole world. Even though man is very fallible, God has always preserved a remnant and there have always been faithful people who passed on the message of Jesus. I think what scripture was talking about was don't place total trust in people because people will always hurt you and let you down and betray that trust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayne Posted March 23 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 107 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 3,820 Content Per Day: 1.30 Reputation: 4,806 Days Won: 2 Joined: 03/31/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted March 23 12 hours ago, R. Hartono said: https://biblehub.com/jeremiah/17-5.htm Jeremiah 17:5 Cursed are those who rely on human, who put their trust in mere flesh. Why did Jesus departed to heaven and relying on flesh to spread Gospel ? @R. Hartono Brother, you've done something odd here. You only quoted PART of the verse and put a period in the MIDDLE of the verse and left out the WHOLE verse. Here it is in its entirety. Jeremiah 17:5 = "Thus says the LORD: 'Cursed is the man who trusts in man and makes flesh his strength, whose heart turns away from the LORD.'" The key of the "curse" is turning a heart away from the LORD. You left that out. God can and does most definitely use people to spread the gospel. He gives us assignments and gifts and commands to do that according to his instructions and Holy Spirit guidance. WE aren't saving people. GOD is. But God uses us sometimes for his will. We DON'T put out faith in humanity to save us. We DO put our trust in God to save us. You, in only citing part of the verse, and out of context - made it say something that God did not intend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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