The Torah to Revelation: The Mystery

[Michael37]

12 minutes ago, revvel said:

Before addressing the 2 Bible questions on 2 Thessalonians, first, let’s address 1 Thessalonians by asking 2 questions:

1. What is the dogma currently promoted in theological circles that overshadows the divine light of the glory of the mystery revealed to Paul—a divine light that has been staring at us for nearly 2000 years?

In other words…

2. Does anyone know the 2 incorrect assumptions extracted from 1 Thessalonians 5:1, 2, which yield the faulty conclusion (dogma): The Rapture is “signless” because Christ is coming as a “thief”?

Note: The “Rapture” (Latin: Rapiemur), (1 Thessalonians 4:17) is sound doctrine; it is the revelation of the mystery—our “hope of glory”—and will come to pass exactly as given to Peter, Paul & John. “Signless” is the dogma.

If you know believers who still subscribe to the “signless” Rapture, could you invite them to this thread?

I’ll be back later in the week to address this most important subject.

After seeing the divine light of 1 Thessalonians, we’ll move to 2 Thessalonians and repeat the process: erase dogma & see the divine light of the mystery.

Peace.

revvel

We should invite David Jeremiah:

David Jeremiah teaches that the rapture is a "signless event," meaning it can happen at any moment without any specific signs preceding it

[revvel]

Thank you Michael.

If anyone knows David Jeremiah, please contact him, and invite him to follow along.

Peace.

revvel

[revvel]

To preface 1 Thessalonians...

How many following this believe—literally—what Christ prophesied?

Do not let your hearts be troubled (distressed, agitated). You believe in and adhere to and trust in and rely on God; believe in and adhere to and trust in and rely also on Me. In My Father’s house there are many dwelling places (homes). If it were not so, I would have told you; for I am going away to prepare a place for you. And when (if) I go and make ready a place for you, I will come back again and will take you to Myself, that where I am you may be also. (John 14:1-3, Amplified, Classic Edition)

How many following this must dismiss this prophecy (as literal) because it doesn’t fit with your end-time position?

I’ll be back this weekend with 1 Thessalonians.

Peace.

revvel

Edited November 6, 2024 by revvel

[revvel]

What are the 2 incorrect assumptions extracted from 1 Thessalonians 5:1, 2, which yield the faulty conclusion (dogma): The Rapture is “signless” because Christ is coming as a “thief”?

Note: The “Rapture” (Latin: Rapiemur), (1 Thessalonians 4:17) is sound doctrine; it is the revelation of the mystery—our “hope of glory”—and will come to pass exactly as Christ revealed to Peter, Paul & John. “Signless” has no scriptural justification.

The Day of the Lord: 1 Thessalonians 5:1, 2. Part 1

Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. (1 Thess. 5:1, 2)

First Incorrect Assumption: The Rapture is “signless” because Paul used the symbol of a “thief in the night.”

Did Paul say,

“Now, brothers and sisters, about signs we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night”? No, of course not. 

What exactly did Paul say?

Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 

The day of the Lord will arrive like “a thief in the night.” When Paul used this figure of speech (“a thief in the night”), he referred right back to the immediate context: “times and dates”—not the lack of signs.

The incorrect assumption is to equate “thief in the night” with a lack of signs. There is no scriptural justification in the immediate context to support this position. And as we will see, there is no scriptural justification in the remote context to support this position.

The second incorrect assumption is next.

Does anyone know the second incorrect assumption?

Peace.

revvel

[revvel]

Brothers and Sisters in Christ: If you once subscribed to the “signless” dogma, you have been set free from this snare. You are free to believe the truth of the revelation of the mystery that our Lord revealed to us.

Second Incorrect Assumption (1 Thess. 5:1, 2): “Christ” is coming as a “thief” at the time of the Rapture.

This is simply a gross misreading/interpretation of the text.

Did Paul say,

Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that Christ will come like a thief in the night. No, of course not.

What exactly did Paul say?

Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 

Is the “day of the Lord” “signless”? No, of course not.

It’s the complete opposite: God will announce (to the entire world) the “day of the Lord” with dramatic heavenly and earthly signs—and these signs announce the Rapture, just as Peter (Acts 2:20, 21) and John (Rev. 6:12-17 & 7:9-17) revealed. The Rapture was once a mystery hidden at the onset of the “day of the Lord”—exactly as Paul revealed (1 Thess. 5:1, 2). And yes, concerning “times and dates” it will arrive like a thief in the night.

Next: The very words of Christ regarding the symbol of a “thief.”

Does anyone know how Christ Himself used the symbol of a “thief” in His own prophecy?

Does anyone know how OT prophecies “set the stage” for Christ to use this symbol?

Peace.

revvel

[revvel]

Christ: Coming as “a Thief”/Armageddon/Second Coming to Israel

“Look, I am coming as a thief. Blessed is he who watches and keeps his garments on, lest he walk naked and his shame be exposed.” They gathered them together to the place which in Hebrew is called Armageddon. (Rev. 16:15, 16) 

Did Christ use the symbol of a “thief” to prophesy of a “signless” event? No, of course not. Armageddon isn’t “signless.”

If Christ didn’t use the symbol of a “thief” to mean “signless,” then what right does anyone in His kingdom have to say the symbol of a “thief” means “signless”? Zero.

Equating “thief” with “signless” is without scriptural justification. 

Why did our Lord use the symbol of the “thief”? He did so for the same reason Paul did in 1 Thessalonians 5:2: regarding “times and dates,” “thief” refers to the sudden arrival of the subject/event. Paul referred to the day of the Lord and the Rapture, and Christ referred to His second coming to Israel and Armageddon. 

Next: What are some of the OT prophecies that “set the stage” for Christ’s use of a “thief,” and what prophecy in the Gospels gives the visual effect of coming as a “thief”? 

Bible fans: What prophecy in the Gospels gives the visual effect of coming as a “thief”?.... This is a very easy question, that yields a profound understanding of prophecy.

When you see this, you see the parallel with Paul and the Rapture. 

Peace. 

revvel

[revvel]

Christ: Coming as “a Thief”/Armageddon/Second Coming to Israel

What prophecy in the Gospels gives the visual effect of coming as a “thief”?

For as the lightning flashes and lights up the heavens from one side to the other, so will the Son of Man be in His day. (Luke 17:24)

Think about lightning—out of nowhere, suddenly, it appears—arriving like a “thief”... and it isn't “signless.”

Symbol of a “Thief” = “sudden” arrival of the event/subject: Sound Doctrine.

Symbol of a “Thief” = “signless” is worthless dogma.

Next: What OT prophecy speaks of Christ’s “sudden” arrival (at His second coming to Israel) and how does it relate to Matthew 24:29-31?

And this: If you were told to believe Christ will leave his chaste virgin on the Earth during the wrath, and Matthew 24 was used to “prove it” … you will be set free from this snare.

Peace.

revvel

 

Edited November 22, 2024 by revvel

[revvel]

The Symbol of “a Thief”: Armageddon/Second Coming to Israel

“For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather.” (Matt. 24:27, 28)

“Look, I am coming as a thief. Blessed is he who watches and keeps his garments on, lest he walk naked and his shame be exposed.” They gathered them together to the place which in Hebrew is called Armageddon. (Rev. 16:15, 16)

[T]he Lord, whom you seek, will suddenly come to His temple, even the messenger of the covenant, in whom you delight. He is coming, says the Lord of Hosts. (Mal. 3:1)

The symbol of a “thief” speaks of time and the sudden nature of the arrival of the subject/event—like lightning—and it certainly isn’t “signless.”

At the second coming to Israel, Christ will arrive… suddenly, out of nowhere, descending from Heaven with His armies (Rev. 19:11-21), and the birds of the air will feast upon the carcasses of the Antichrist’s army.

The Symbol of “a Thief”: The Rapture

At the time of the Rapture, the day of the Lord will arrive… suddenly, out of nowhere (Rev. 6:12-14), and Christ will descend from Heaven (Rev. 6:16) with the dramatic signs of the day of the Lord to gather His Bride (Rev. 7:9-17), fulfilling His promise given at The Last Supper (John 14:1-3).

Consider: How did this “signless” dogma become so popular when it is clearly counter to Scripture?

What else is still circulating in Christian circles—regarding end times, assumed to be true—that also is counter to Scripture?

What have you been told to believe about Matthew 24?

Next: Matthew 23 - 25.

Peace. 

revvel

Edited November 26, 2024 by revvel

[revvel]

Matthew 23 – 25

Were you were told to believe Christ will allow His Bride to remain on the Earth during the wrath (that precedes Armageddon)?

Was Matthew 24 used to “prove it”? 

What are the 3 incorrect assumptions extracted from Matthew 23 – 25, that yield the faulty conclusion that the Father will leave us, His Son’s Bride, His “chaste virgin (2 Cor. 11:2),” on the Earth during the wrath?

Can anyone identify one of the incorrect assumptions that yield the dogma circulating in Christian circles: the Father will leave His Son’s Bride on the Earth during the wrath?

You will witness this house of cards… collapse... and you will revel in it, seeing the revelation of the mystery once hidden in Matthew 24.

The key to interpreting Matthew 24 is the revelation of the mystery. And Christ told us as much. How did He do it?

Does anyone know where to look to find the key in Paul’s letters?

Which prophet (who prophesied of the destiny of the Israelites) did Paul quote? 

Peace.

revvel

[revvel]

Matthew 23 - 25 & John 14

To preface Matthew 23 – 25, consider:

John 14:1-3 fits perfectly with Matthew 23 – 25. Of course they do, Christ is the author.

John 14

Do not let your hearts be troubled (distressed, agitated). You believe in and adhere to and trust in and rely on God; believe in and adhere to and trust in and rely also on Me. In My Father’s house there are many dwelling places (homes). If it were not so, I would have told you; for I am going away to prepare a place for you. And when (if) I go and make ready a place for you, I will come back again and will take you to Myself, that where I am you may be also. (John 14:1-3, Amplified, Classic Edition)

To everyone following this: You are free to take Christ at His Word: He will come back again, and He will take us to Himself, to the Father’s House, where He is now: Heaven. And yes, The Last Supper prophecy is directly connected to The Lamb’s Supper prophecy (Rev. 19).

Who among us takes Christ (literally) at His Word: John 14:1-3 & Matthew 24:27-31?

How do these literal prophecies fit perfectly with the revelation of the mystery?

Advent

During the season of Advent, many of us speak of the second Advent… Who among us has quoted/will quote Christ’s Last Supper prophecy (John 14:1-3) during Advent?

I will. And I will declare what you know is true: We can take our Lord at His Word.

Blessed Advent indeed!

Peace.

revvel