Christ's kingdom will never be physically on this earth

[DeighAnn]

20 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

That's a new one, Big Smiles!

Jesus returns and all those in the grave are raised to hear the gospel, Just forget about hell, everyone gets a second chance

I don't understand where you come up with a SECOND chance.  

How can it be a 2nd chance when SO MANY MORE souls have never gotten a FIRST chance?  They never got to choose.  They didn't even know there was a choice to be made, NEVER having heard a word or ONLY having HEARD LIES... 

And for that YOU SEE GOD as judging them to the 2nd DEATH, RATHER than to have A DAY in which they could find SALVATION and eternal life?  I truly wonder how that could, IN ANYONES MIND, be JUST OR HOLY OR RIGHT.  I don't SEE GOD being like that.  I don't think that is how GOD s plan would go.  I am truly SOTTISH yet even I CAN SEE what a TERRIBLE and UNFULFILLING plan that would be especially 

IF I WISHED ALL WERE TO COME TO REPENTANCE................. 

Then again, if one can be made to believe that someone who NEVER DIES (having been made ALIVE in Christ and knowing the WAY, and being raised in the likeness of His resurrection having FOLLOWED Him to be where He is to RETURN with Him) goes from THAT 
to BEING one of the DEAD in Christ, (the dead being those held in the captivity of DEATH for the penalty of sin...) until the 2nd Advent, and then be RAISED UP....(yet again??)


            I guess anything is possible to believe.    


EXACTLY how do you see GOD judging the body and soul to the 2nd death KNOWING they just NEVER HEARD???  Especially if they were REALLY good and righteous and charitable beings who only lacked knowledge of the Words of God?   



I'm sorry, that just isn't what I received through my studies of GODS WORD.  So, I'll just keep believing, it is THE DEAD that RISE at Christs return and not anyone who passed from death to life, been made ALIVE in Christ, and as one of the LIVING,  have ALREADY risen in the likeness of His resurrection and followed Him....

and those are GODS WORDS, not mine.  We just have come to completely different understandings about WHO GOD IS it seems.  







 
MARK 12

23  In the resurrection when they rise, of which of them will she be wife?  For the seven had her as a wife

24  Was saying to them Jesus Not because of this do you err, not knowing the Scriptures, nor the power of God

25  When for out from [the] dead they rise, neither do they marry, nor are given in marriage; but are like angels in the heavens

26  Concerning now the dead that they rise, not have you read in the book of Moses, on the bush, how spoke to him God SAYING I[am] the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob

27  Not He is God of [the] dead, but of [the] living.  

GREATLY you err.

 

[Luther]

18 hours ago, dad2 said:

Except the vials are wrath. Did you think that the wrath was finished by all those vials in a day?

Revelation 16:12

And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.

In just this one vial we see that it is more than a day. The pouring out just prepares the way fro some kings to cross the river.

 

I understand what you are saying. In the case of Revelation 16, There are two different Greek words used for  "wrath".

In v.1 we see: #2372, thumos
Pronunciation: thoo-mos'
Definition: From G2380; passion (as if breathing hard): - fierceness indignation wrath. Compare G5590 .
KJV Usage: wrath (15x), fierceness (2x), indignation (1x).

Revelation 16:1 KJV
And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath (#2372) of God upon the earth.

This rendering (wrath, fierceness, indignation) would fit within the context of preparation by these angels  (throughout chapter 16) for the last day Judgment and consequently wrath of God.

 

Then, in v.19 the Greek word orgē ((#3709) is used for " wrath" ( instead of #2372).

(Strong's #3709):
Definition: From G3713; properly desire (as a reaching forth or excitement of the mind) that is (by analogy) violent passion (ire or [justifiable] abhorrence); by implication punishment: - anger indignation vengeance wrath.
KJV Usage: wrath (31x), anger (3x), vengeance (1x), indignation (1x).
Occurs: 36

Revelation 16:19 KJV
And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath (#3709).

( This is definitely language of last day judgment.)

........................

You said: "In just this one vial we see that it is more than a day"

Yes. V.12-14 is the description of the period of Great tribulation which comes right before the last day:

Revelation 16:12-14 KJV
And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared. 

[13] And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet. 

[14] For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

The " spirits of devils" along with Satan will be given authority or power to decieve the world during the tribulation period when he will be worshiped as God ( at the very end of this period). Then afterwards Christ comes.

Revelation 13:5-8 KJV
And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

[6] And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven. 

[7] And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

[8] And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

At this point in time, the people of the world are being confused and divided while the churches are being deceived into supporting the preparation for Satan to be worshiped. And yes, one day your confession that Jesus Christ is Lord will not only have you persecuted but punished with death.

The mark of the beast is obedience to the new world order.

[truth7t7]

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

I don't understand where you come up with a SECOND chance.  

How can it be a 2nd chance when SO MANY MORE souls have never gotten a FIRST chance?  They never got to choose.  They didn't even know there was a choice to be made, NEVER having heard a word or ONLY having HEARD LIES... 

And for that YOU SEE GOD as judging them to the 2nd DEATH, RATHER than to have A DAY in which they could find SALVATION and eternal life?  I truly wonder how that could, IN ANYONES MIND, be JUST OR HOLY OR RIGHT.  I don't SEE GOD being like that.  I don't think that is how GOD s plan would go.  I am truly SOTTISH yet even I CAN SEE what a TERRIBLE and UNFULFILLING plan that would be especially 

IF I WISHED ALL WERE TO COME TO REPENTANCE................. 

Then again, if one can be made to believe that someone who NEVER DIES (having been made ALIVE in Christ and knowing the WAY, and being raised in the likeness of His resurrection having FOLLOWED Him to be where He is to RETURN with Him) goes from THAT 
to BEING one of the DEAD in Christ, (the dead being those held in the captivity of DEATH for the penalty of sin...) until the 2nd Advent, and then be RAISED UP....(yet again??)


            I guess anything is possible to believe.    


EXACTLY how do you see GOD judging the body and soul to the 2nd death KNOWING they just NEVER HEARD???  Especially if they were REALLY good and righteous and charitable beings who only lacked knowledge of the Words of God?   



I'm sorry, that just isn't what I received through my studies of GODS WORD.  So, I'll just keep believing, it is THE DEAD that RISE at Christs return and not anyone who passed from death to life, been made ALIVE in Christ, and as one of the LIVING,  have ALREADY risen in the likeness of His resurrection and followed Him....

and those are GODS WORDS, not mine.  We just have come to completely different understandings about WHO GOD IS it seems.  







 
MARK 12

23  In the resurrection when they rise, of which of them will she be wife?  For the seven had her as a wife

24  Was saying to them Jesus Not because of this do you err, not knowing the Scriptures, nor the power of God

25  When for out from [the] dead they rise, neither do they marry, nor are given in marriage; but are like angels in the heavens

26  Concerning now the dead that they rise, not have you read in the book of Moses, on the bush, how spoke to him God SAYING I[am] the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob

27  Not He is God of [the] dead, but of [the] living.  

GREATLY you err.
 

Luke 16:19-31KJV

19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:

20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,

21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.

22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;

23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.

25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.

27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:

28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.

29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.

30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.

31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Edited May 21 by truth7t7

[truth7t7]

2 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

I don't understand where you come up with a SECOND chance.  

How can it be a 2nd chance when SO MANY MORE souls have never gotten a FIRST chance?  They never got to choose.  They didn't even know there was a choice to be made, NEVER having heard a word or ONLY having HEARD LIES... 

And for that YOU SEE GOD as judging them to the 2nd DEATH, RATHER than to have A DAY in which they could find SALVATION and eternal life?  I truly wonder how that could, IN ANYONES MIND, be JUST OR HOLY OR RIGHT.  I don't SEE GOD being like that.  I don't think that is how GOD s plan would go.  I am truly SOTTISH yet even I CAN SEE what a TERRIBLE and UNFULFILLING plan that would be especially 

IF I WISHED ALL WERE TO COME TO REPENTANCE................. 

Then again, if one can be made to believe that someone who NEVER DIES (having been made ALIVE in Christ and knowing the WAY, and being raised in the likeness of His resurrection having FOLLOWED Him to be where He is to RETURN with Him) goes from THAT 
to BEING one of the DEAD in Christ, (the dead being those held in the captivity of DEATH for the penalty of sin...) until the 2nd Advent, and then be RAISED UP....(yet again??)


            I guess anything is possible to believe.    


EXACTLY how do you see GOD judging the body and soul to the 2nd death KNOWING they just NEVER HEARD???  Especially if they were REALLY good and righteous and charitable beings who only lacked knowledge of the Words of God?   



I'm sorry, that just isn't what I received through my studies of GODS WORD.  So, I'll just keep believing, it is THE DEAD that RISE at Christs return and not anyone who passed from death to life, been made ALIVE in Christ, and as one of the LIVING,  have ALREADY risen in the likeness of His resurrection and followed Him....

and those are GODS WORDS, not mine.  We just have come to completely different understandings about WHO GOD IS it seems.  







 
MARK 12

23  In the resurrection when they rise, of which of them will she be wife?  For the seven had her as a wife

24  Was saying to them Jesus Not because of this do you err, not knowing the Scriptures, nor the power of God

25  When for out from [the] dead they rise, neither do they marry, nor are given in marriage; but are like angels in the heavens

26  Concerning now the dead that they rise, not have you read in the book of Moses, on the bush, how spoke to him God SAYING I[am] the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob

27  Not He is God of [the] dead, but of [the] living.  

GREATLY you err.

Romans 1:19-32KJV

19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

[truth7t7]

3 hours ago, Luther said:

I don't know if you are aware of this literal millennial reign teaching is a shared belief in judaism. It appears that over 150 years ago the church has been influenced to think the same way to help support their end time goals. ( Just putting it in general terms).

The goal of Judaism is not to have an eternal spiritual Kingdom but to continue to reign on this Earth and have control over it. This is an absolute fact according to their teachings. So I think the problem is with most Christians today is that they are more concerned with their goals than their own by supporting Israel.

So I think it's more than just not caring about the truth. It's more like being deceived.

I Agree 100% They Are Deceived, and the false teachings are coming out of Dallas Theological Seminary, dispensationalism in Christian Zionism

Edited May 21 by truth7t7

[Anne2]

4 hours ago, Luther said:

I don't know if you are aware of this literal millennial reign teaching is a shared belief in judaism.

This what concerns me. Rabbinic Judaism created a new Judaism after the temple was destroyed. I believe it is for a rival to Paul's ministry.

Ro 11:11  I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.
 

A similar thing occurred with the king of Israel when the kingdom was divided.

1 ki. 12:26  And Jeroboam said in his heart, Now shall the kingdom return to the house of David:
27  If this people go up to do sacrifice in the house of the LORD at Jerusalem, then shall the heart of this people turn again unto their lord, even unto Rehoboam king of Judah, and they shall kill me, and go again to Rehoboam king of Judah.
28  Whereupon the king took counsel, and made two calves of gold, and said unto them, It is too much for you to go up to Jerusalem: behold thy gods, O Israel, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt.
29  And he set the one in Bethel, and the other put he in Dan.
30  And this thing became a sin: for the people went to worship before the one, even unto Dan.
31  And he made an house of high places, and made priests of the lowest of the people, which were not of the sons of Levi.
32  And Jeroboam ordained a feast in the eighth month, on the fifteenth day of the month, like unto the feast that is in Judah, and he offered upon the altar. So did he in Bethel, sacrificing unto the calves that he had made: and he placed in Bethel the priests of the high places which he had made.

1 ki 12:32  And Jeroboam ordained a feast in the eighth month, on the fifteenth day of the month, like unto the feast that is in Judah, and he offered upon the altar. So did he in Bethel, sacrificing unto the calves that he had made: and he placed in Bethel the priests of the high places which he had made. {offered … : or, went up to the altar, etc } {sacrificing: or, to sacrifice }
33  So he offered upon the altar which he had made in Bethel the fifteenth day of the eighth month, even in the month which he had devised of his own heart; and ordained a feast unto the children of Israel: and he offered upon the altar, and burnt incense.

They "transferred" temple liturgy (ministerial work reserved to priests) to the synagogue, to compete with Christs church. This is why synagogues have been called temples....Even the interior was changed.

This is harmful to Jew's IMO. 

Edited May 21 by Anne2

[DeighAnn]

1 hour ago, truth7t7 said:

30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.

31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

'father Abraham'...the rich man chose the riches of the world over Moses and the prophets yet THOSE WORDS did not persuade them...

THAT would be a 2ND chance, I agree that MIGHT be a second chance but I am not speaking to them


I am speaking OF those who NEVER HEARD a single word, NOT from Moses NOR the prophets...SIMPLY never heard the words of God NOT ONCE in their entire lives.  GOOD AND JUST SOULS, who had they 'heard' would have, without question FOLLOWED HIM. 

 

 

[DeighAnn]

1 hour ago, truth7t7 said:

32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

Same thing WHO KNOWING THE JUDGMENT OF GOD....what about the billions of souls who died not knowing...

[Luther]

3 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

I Agree 100% They Are Deceived, and the false teachings are coming out of Dallas Theological Seminary, dispensationalism in Christian Zionism

Big time. It's actually quite amazing. What a little book called the Scofield Bible did to the entire Christian Church  (of course with the help of eager pastors and teachers). I just posted a new topic called " Christ is Israel" In the theology section if you'd want to check it out.

[Luther]

3 hours ago, Anne2 said:

This what concerns me. Rabbinic Judaism created a new Judaism after the temple was destroyed. I believe it is for a rival to Paul's ministry.

Ro 11:11  I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.
 

A similar thing occurred with the king of Israel when the kingdom was divided.

1 ki. 12:26  And Jeroboam said in his heart, Now shall the kingdom return to the house of David:
27  If this people go up to do sacrifice in the house of the LORD at Jerusalem, then shall the heart of this people turn again unto their lord, even unto Rehoboam king of Judah, and they shall kill me, and go again to Rehoboam king of Judah.
28  Whereupon the king took counsel, and made two calves of gold, and said unto them, It is too much for you to go up to Jerusalem: behold thy gods, O Israel, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt.
29  And he set the one in Bethel, and the other put he in Dan.
30  And this thing became a sin: for the people went to worship before the one, even unto Dan.
31  And he made an house of high places, and made priests of the lowest of the people, which were not of the sons of Levi.
32  And Jeroboam ordained a feast in the eighth month, on the fifteenth day of the month, like unto the feast that is in Judah, and he offered upon the altar. So did he in Bethel, sacrificing unto the calves that he had made: and he placed in Bethel the priests of the high places which he had made.

1 ki 12:32  And Jeroboam ordained a feast in the eighth month, on the fifteenth day of the month, like unto the feast that is in Judah, and he offered upon the altar. So did he in Bethel, sacrificing unto the calves that he had made: and he placed in Bethel the priests of the high places which he had made. {offered … : or, went up to the altar, etc } {sacrificing: or, to sacrifice }
33  So he offered upon the altar which he had made in Bethel the fifteenth day of the eighth month, even in the month which he had devised of his own heart; and ordained a feast unto the children of Israel: and he offered upon the altar, and burnt incense.

They "transferred" temple liturgy (ministerial work reserved to priests) to the synagogue, to compete with Christs church. This is why synagogues have been called temples....Even the interior was changed.

This is harmful to Jew's IMO. 

You said: "This what concerns me. Rabbinic Judaism created a new Judaism after the temple was destroyed. I believe it is for a rival to Paul's ministry."

Totally agree. It's not like most Christians think. I had no idea what judaism was until a year ago. I always thought it just had to do with the Old Testament religion. Nope.

Without getting into that, that's exactly what it was... a rival to the newly proclaimed gospel at that time. We read about the remnant in the Old and New Testament. They were the ones from Israel originally who obeyed God and brought forth Jesus Christ. They followed the law of God the best they could. 

But there were others who went after strange gods and followed the Pharisees eventually.

And with sorrow I say this, that the religion of Judaism is the modern religion of the Pharisees. It's not taking a swipe at them or being mean it's just true. Everything that our Bible teaches they teach the opposite.

And praise God there is a remnant of humanity who will come to Jesus Christ!