Shelak Posted May 6, 2006 Group: Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 21 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/14/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/08/1952 Share Posted May 6, 2006 In a discussion today in chat I asked a question ... it went something like this. In the bible God changed a mans name to Israel who was this man? Someone mentioned Issac, I thought it was Jacob, but I didnt have the scripture to prove that. So I didnt say I thought it was Jacob. I have found the scripture and read it and studied that section of scripture and it doesnt say the Jacob was the first Jew, or the first Israelite. It does say that God changed his name to Israel. (Edited by Moderator) Here is the verse from Gen. 32, verses 24-32. I will only put the reference verse in here so I dont have to type it all out ... V:28 "And He said, Your name shall no longer be called Jacob, but Israel; for you have struggled (wrestled) with God and with men and have prevailed." I wanted to put this in the discussion today in the worthychat room, but the moderator told me not to since I was not a "teacher, and I would mislead people" with my semetics (not sure of the spelling of that) (edited by moderator) Oh well, I feel liked I learned something good today, and hey found out I wasnt off base when I thought it was Jacob. I would have said Jacob, but wasnt sure, now I am sure, since I had to actually look for it in the Bible. So was Jacob the first Israelite, the first Jew? Just asking!?? Shelak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GodisTruth Posted May 6, 2006 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 50 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/05/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/18/1965 Share Posted May 6, 2006 Jacob WAS Israel. All of his 12 sons were the first Israelites. Judah was his third son, and his sons were the first Jews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Openly Curious Posted May 6, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 55 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,568 Content Per Day: 0.68 Reputation: 770 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/18/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted May 6, 2006 Jacob WAS Israel. All of his 12 sons were the first Israelites. Judah was his third son, and his sons were the first Jews. G-disTruth this is correct and i encourage Shelak to keep on studying for you are on the right track blessings OC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkieDannsa' Air An Drochaid Posted May 6, 2006 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 59 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,390 Content Per Day: 0.21 Reputation: 9 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/24/2005 Status: Offline Share Posted May 6, 2006 (((((Shelak))))) Hi dear friend, Well, what you were discussing is pretty honest discussion to me. I am glad you posted it, it does make for good discussion and a good subject. I appreciate you and just wanted you to know that I do. Hope to talk with ya soon. love and prayers, elkie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted May 6, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted May 6, 2006 Actually, the Israelites were not called Jews until the Babylonian captivity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shelak Posted May 6, 2006 Group: Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 21 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/14/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/08/1952 Author Share Posted May 6, 2006 (edited) (((((Shelak))))) Hi dear friend, Well, what you were discussing is pretty honest discussion to me. I am glad you posted it, it does make for good discussion and a good subject. I appreciate you and just wanted you to know that I do. Hope to talk with ya soon. love and prayers, elkie Dear Elkie, Thanks my friend! That means a lot to me Hope to see you soon in chat! Maybe I'll have another question to ask! Haha. Shelak Edited May 6, 2006 by Shelak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shelak Posted May 6, 2006 Group: Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 2 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 21 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/14/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/08/1952 Author Share Posted May 6, 2006 Actually, the Israelites were not called Jews until the Babylonian captivity. Ok ... Im still learning on this subject! Thanks to all who have replied! Shelak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Cephas Posted May 7, 2006 Share Posted May 7, 2006 actually, I believe the first occurance of the word Jews was in 2 Kings 16:6 (in the King James) and it was when Israel was at war with the "Jews". It referred to the Kingdom of Judah, which included Judah, Benjamin, part of Levi, parts of Ephraim, Manassah and Simeon, and ALL of the Tribes of Israel... as stated in 2 Ch 11:14 1 Kings 12:16 - 24 (NASB) 16When all Israel saw that the king did not listen to them, the people answered the king, saying, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted May 7, 2006 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.75 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted May 7, 2006 actually, I believe the first occurance of the word Jews was in 2 Kings 16:6 (in the King James) and it was when Israel was at war with the "Jews". True, but it seems to be only the King James Version. The others say "men of Judah" or "Judeans." It referred to the Kingdom of Judah, which included Judah, Benjamin, part of Levi, parts of Ephraim, Manassah and Simeon, and ALL of the Tribes of Israel... as stated in 2 Ch 11:14 2 Chr. 11:14 - For the Levites left their common-lands and their possessions and came to Judah and Jerusalem, for Jeroboam and his sons had rejected them from serving as priests to the Lord. I'm not following you here. The Kingdom of Judah consisted of Judah, Benjamin and Levites - but not the other tribes of Israel. The other tribes of Israel were the Kingdom of Israel. But yes, it was the people of the Kingdom of Judah who were eventually called Jews (Jew from Judah - or the Hebrew is Y@huwdiy from Y@huwdah). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vitality22004 Posted May 7, 2006 Group: Junior Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 105 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/22/2004 Status: Offline Share Posted May 7, 2006 Was Abraham not the father of the Jews, which makes him the first one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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