God's awfully mean.

[Guest LadyC]

oh please, please please find some q-tips and clean out your ears.

God gives us FREEDOM to choose to do right or wrong. if God didn't allow people to sin, then we wouldn't have free will.

God does intervene in some instances though. He intervenes by request. if you're not requesting His help, then you have no right to complain when He doesn't offer it.

and God's intervention isn't always in the form we expect it, either. ask marnie. she's been in exactly that situation. her throat was slit. she can't speak. but God intervened and spared her life and has given her a GOOD life with much to be thankful for. and she doesn't blame God for the idiot that assaulted her. she praises God for saving her life so that she could be a witness for His mercy.

Wait a second.

You say that it's free will for these people to die of things they can't help?

are you being intentionally obtuse? God gives people free will to do things that are harmful/fatal to themselves and others. i NEVER said, or even implied, that it is a victim's free will to die from someone else's crime. i have said repeatedly that death and destruction are the result of sin. and we can sin because we have free will.

so if someone else slits your throat, it is the criminal's free will that caused you to die. it isn't God's fault. God gives that sinner the same freedom to reject Him and live a sinful life as He gives to you or me. difference between you and me is that i choose to accept His mercy, His gift of eternal life. so i know that if some moron comes and slits MY throat, i'm still going to LIVE. my body may die, but i'll be given a new body, and i'll live painfree for eternity. whereas when YOU die from someone's knife, you have chosen to spend eternity in far more excruciating pain than that knife caused you...

but it's still your choice.

[Arialia]

So, God isn't omnibenevolent, because he allows another's free will to intrude on ours.

Jeez, the Federal Government at least makes an attempt.

Oh.

Well, if a policeman witnesses an attempted murder but does nothing, does that mean he did nothing wrong?

[Arialia]

So, God isn't omnibenevolent, because he allows another's free will to intrude on ours.

Jeez, the Federal Government at least makes an attempt.

Oh.

Well, if a policeman witnesses an attempted murder but does nothing, does that mean he did nothing wrong?

It sure means he isn't omnibenevolent!!!

Yeah, he isn't obligated to help someone stay alive just because he CAN and people expect him to.

[Guest LadyC]

He is kind. He gives you the freedom to choose to live eternally with all the riches and glory afforded to His children as heirs to His kingdom. if you don't want those things, health, happiness, riches and glory for eternity, then you can continue to sit here and whine about how "mean" God is.

freedom of choice.... it's across the board. God doesn't discriminate about what KINDS of things He allows us the freedom to choose. the same freedom that allows the next person to commit murder is the same freedom that allows you to accept an escape from the chaos of this world in the eternal scheme of things.

obviously the unbelievers here would not want to be stripped of their freedom to reject God and live in your sin. one sin is as bad as the next, by the way... the sin you sqallor in is no less filthy than the sin of the murderer. so if you don't want your freedom to live life apart from God taken away, then you have no right to moan about God not taking away the freedom of the person who might do you harm.

[Guest LadyC]

Yeah, he isn't obligated to help someone stay alive just because he CAN and people expect him to.

funny joke. if you don't want God's gift, then you shouldn't have expectations and demands that He stick around and help you stay alive. little different from a policeman who swore to protect your life even if you didn't want his help.

[Arialia]

Yeah, he isn't obligated to help someone stay alive just because he CAN and people expect him to.

funny joke. if you don't want God's gift, then you shouldn't have expectations and demands that He stick around and help you stay alive. little different from a policeman who swore to protect your life even if you didn't want his help.

So God doesn't care about all of his creation, just the Christians?

[Guest LadyC]

arialia, if God didn't care about His creation, He wouldn't have sacrificed His Son to DIE FOR YOU.

He cares. You don't. get it straight.

[Guest man]

Either He's mean or doesn't exist--which is it? Can't be both, or either.

Isn't it obvious that I'm trying to say he doesn't exists?

If He doesn't exist...who are calling mean?

[Guest man]

I can't see a reason for God to exist. Sorry.

Then why argue the point?

[Arialia]

Either He's mean or doesn't exist--which is it? Can't be both, or either.

Isn't it obvious that I'm trying to say he doesn't exists?

If He doesn't exist...who are calling mean?

The idea, of course.

I prefer to think of it as this:

For the purpose of this debate, we are agreeing that the Christian God is true.

Since that term has been agreed to, we are debating the actuality of his powers and such.