How old is your church?

[Douay]

http://www.cuttingedge.org/news/n1656.cfm

The Pope KNEW of a molestation back in 1973 and IGNORED it!!!

Again, I ask, is the CHURCH fallable?

Is the Pope fallable?

The people around here have a list of their favorite questions to ask Catholics which are typically insulting in some way and are usually from an entirely fallacious assumption.

How does what a priest did factor into this teaching of the Church (albeit misunderstood)?

WWJD- what would jou do? Pull out a 45 from your desk drawer and blow him away? How do you KNOW what he did anyway?

Douay

[Douay]

Artsylady-

I don't think that my question regarding child molesters in the church was ever answered.

LIAR!!!

I don't remember him ever being referred to, in the BIBLE, as Pope Peter, or even Saint Peter.

Your church made that up.

No, Catholics don't proclaim themselves saints while they are alive, good point. Only Protestants can do that. Your church made that up.

Although I would not doubt that Peter referred himself to a servant.

And this makes the case against many of the things said in reference to Peter not acting high and mighty like they say he should have. Oh and don't forget that this was 1970 years ago, so maybe all of the fanfare about the pope today is due to the good things they have done in the past (not that bad things could not have been done by them).

And by the way, Peter was FALLABLE! He denied Christ three times!!! Hello!!

Are you trying to make some point here? Do you feel that some epiphany has befallen you and you are sent here with revelations?

Douay

[artsylady]

Douey:

How does what a priest did factor into this teaching of the Church (albeit misunderstood)?

WWJD- what would jou do? Pull out a 45 from your desk drawer and blow him away? How do you KNOW what he did anyway?

The CHURCH was responsible for the Inquisitions and Crusades and other astrocities.

You KNOW that.

The CHURCH covered up molestations of innocent by priests, YUP, all the way to the Vatican.

What would I do? Have him charged under the law and FIRE HIM!!! I'd do what any proper-thinking responsible person would do!

[IslandRose]

No, Catholics don't proclaim themselves saints while they are alive, good point. Only Protestants can do that. Your church made that up.

Phil 1:1 Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops and deacons:

Colo 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timotheus [our] brother, 2 To the saints and faithful brethren in Christ which are at Colosse: Grace [be] unto you, and peace, from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Ephesians 5:2 And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweetsmelling savour. 3 But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints ;

Ephesians 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 12 For the perfecting of the saints , for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

Ephesians 3:8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints , is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;

1 Corinthians 1:2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints , with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours: 3 Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

[artsylady]

LIAR!!!

Often when people feel they are losing a debate, they will attack the person rather than the argument.

Take a deep breath and then keep praying for wisdom.

I forgive you.

Actually, Angeledei answered something about the fact that child molesters get into the church, but I then asked, in response to THAT, about your feelings on the fact that the CHURCH covered up these problems, moving priests from city to city, hiding their sin and allowing them to continue to abuse others. Now, if there was a response to THAT, please show me.

No, Catholics don't proclaim themselves saints while they are alive, good point. Only Protestants can do that. Your church made that up.

But you said, and I agree, that no one can judge another's soul and know for sure if one will make it to heaven. You said a person cannot even know himself if he will make it. How then, does the Catholic church know? Is it possible that they've made Saints out of people who didn't even make it into heaven? Hey, I'm going by your reasoning here.

Are you trying to make some point here? Do you feel that some epiphany has befallen you and you are sent here with revelations?

Enlighten us. Is the pope fallable? Yes or no?

[Bill]

No, Catholics don't proclaim themselves saints while they are alive, good point. Only Protestants can do that. Your church made that up.

The early church was referred to as "the saints". The saints at Ephesus, the saints at Philippi, etc. It's in the bible. We didn't make it up.

Consider:

Ephesians 1:1 - Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints at Ephesus, and faithful in Christ Jesus:...

Philippians 1:1 - Paul and Timothy, bondservants of Jesus Christ, To all the saints in Christ Jesus who are in Philippi, with the bishops and deacons:

Colossians 1:1 - Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timothy our brother, To the saints and faithful brethren in Christ who are in Colosse:

Ephesians 3:8 - To me , who am less than the least of all the saints, this grace was given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ,...

Jude 3 - Beloved, while I was very diligent to write to you concerning our common salvation, I found it necessary to write to you exhorting you to contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all delivered to the saints.

If "saints" is referring only to your St. Thomas, St. Jude, etc., who are these people specifically, and who made them saints? In the case of Jude 3, and the Catholic ascription to the naming of sainthood after death, how can something be delivered to the saints if they aren't here to receive it? Why is there no statement of qualifications for sainthood...after all, shouldn't there be a biblical basis to that?

Or is this more "early church father" teaching that became part of the canon in the Catholic church?

BTW, remind me to tell you sometime how this teaching...the teaching of sainthood...along with transubstantiation and the "veneration of Mary"...convinced me that there is untruth being taught in the Catholic church.

[artsylady]

Island Rose:

EXCELLENT post.

No, my church DID not make that up.

It is written in scriptures.

[artsylady]

Bill: Another good post. Keep those scriptures coming! Truth WILL prevail.

[sagz4Christ]

If "saints" is referring only to your St. Thomas, St. Jude, etc., who are these people specifically, and who made them saints?  In the case of Jude 3, and the Catholic ascription to the naming of sainthood after death, how can something be delivered to the saints if they aren't here to receive it?  Why is there no statement of qualifications for sainthood...after all, shouldn't there be a biblical basis to that?

Or is this more "early church father" teaching that became part of the canon in the Catholic church?

It is because they were delivering something to dead people?

[Anonymous]

LIAR!!!

Often when people feel they are losing a debate, they will attack the person rather than the argument.

Take a deep breath and then keep praying for wisdom.

I forgive you.

Whoa Douay, that wasn't a very nice thing to say....

AP