The universe is ordered

[khalou]

Something went wrong. I didn't see a point.

I remember reading something about changing your mind, but the remainder of the post was kinda hard to decipher.

Sorry.

k

[CellShade]

You mean that you didn't understand my points themself, or the post itself due to the wrongly posted quotes, if so , tell me so I can try to fix this.

Blessings, Cell.

[khalou]

You mean that you didn't understand my points themself, or the post itself due to the wrongly posted quotes, if so , tell me so I can try to fix this.

Blessings, Cell.

I'm sorry. I read your post and it wasn't in a recognizable format. All of the [this or that] directions were exposed and the whole thing wasn't separated in a way that I could discern what might be new. I will try again to read it.

k

[CellShade]

You mean that you didn't understand my points themself, or the post itself due to the wrongly posted quotes, if so , tell me so I can try to fix this.

Blessings, Cell.

I'm sorry. I read your post and it wasn't in a recognizable format. All of the [this or that] directions were exposed and the whole thing wasn't separated in a way that I could discern what might be new. I will try again to read it.

k

Possibly the quotes things, try reading it again, I highlighted in bold what I said, I will try to respond it again with a quick fix

[khalou]

You mean that you didn't understand my points themself, or the post itself due to the wrongly posted quotes, if so , tell me so I can try to fix this.

Blessings, Cell.

Okay, i think your new stuff is in bold. I'll respond to the bolded stuff.

k

[CellShade]

I have heard the expression that birth is a miracle. It is of the sort that says that a flower is a miracle, yet there are lots of flowers. It is a poetic expression and a good one as far as that goes.

But I don't suppose that the Vatican, or the protestants, or the Isalmics, or the Judaists, or the pagans would officially deem the birth of my daughter as a miracle.

I wonder, though, why you are being so cryptic in your posts? You seem to want to sound like you know something that no one else knows, and are patiently getting around to it over time. You also don't seem to be particularly well read in history. How can you dispute ancient writings that still exist today by simply saying that the history of those writings were commented on by atheists?

I don't see you as being curious in the least about where the truth might lead. You are proud of the fact that you rely on the Bible for all of your information on the ancient world.

I wouldn't suggest that you investigate further than your own truth. I've said here that I'm not out to convert anyone, and I'm not. Some people need Christianity to keep them from sinning in all sorts of awful ways, and for all I know, you are one of those, so go ahead and believe what you believe.

But, yes, I was a Christian for over forty years and lived by the Bible and had Jesus by my side all that time. I really wish it were all true and if you still believe it, then you probably don't want to study things and should probably just stick to the Bible.

k

Bad ol' sin.

Life isn't about being just good or bad, it's about having Christ in your heart or not .

Now, what if it's a good person that is a christian? While I can't honestly explain correctly how God thinks( hey, He is God, I am a single human being) , God did address some part of this subject in The Bible, or at least something you might find interesting .

1Pe 3:17 For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing.

Also,

1Pe 3:14 But and if ye suffer for righteousness' sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled;

I need to state something, when we accept God as our Savior, while most of us expect life to be easy, it will not be easy, God didn't promised(that I know of) an easy life, He did promised however, to be there with Us, also He's main promess(that He will fulfill) is that whoever believed in Him, will have everlasting life in Heaven.

What you spoke was erroneous. You were wrong. You were not only wrong, but you were wrong based on some idea you have about faith that obviously isn't true.

Look at it from another Christian's perspective. Maybe another Christian would like to find out what happened to me. Maybe they don't pretend to know the mind of God and are more interested in saving my soul than accusing me of being a liar. "Love them where they are" comes to mind. "Judge not etc, etc..." comes to mind.

Yet there you are telling me that even if I DID decide to try it again, I could never be certain whether I was fooling myself or not. Is there any value to that? Is your purpose here to tell atheists that they are evil? or is it to win souls to Christ by the same means that Christ won souls?

Do you love me or not?

I want to know what happened to you, by the way it looks like, something very bad must have happened, I and most of us are willing to hear you. While maybe we won't fully understand you, we will try to with God's help.

Great! So I get the only person in the western world that never believed in Santa!

Okay, so you're going to have to imagine what everyone else around you went through. As children in the west, we were told that Santa Claus (you know OF him, correct?) comes down the chimney, even though you might not have one, and leaves gifts for the good children.

We don't have a "sort-of" belief, we absolutely believe.

Once we get an idea of the size of the world, and the difficulty of delivering presents to each and every house in one night, we tend to realize that this belief is perhaps based on iffy ground.

If you never believed in Santa, then perhaps our conversation is over.

Add another person to the list , I never believed in Santa Claus.

But hope the conversation is not over though, I am interested in this discussion.

GBU All.

This is the rephrase, hope that helps out, if you don't understand what I said, I would be more than happy to redo it again .

GBY All, Cell.

[khalou]

I have heard the expression that birth is a miracle. It is of the sort that says that a flower is a miracle, yet there are lots of flowers. It is a poetic expression and a good one as far as that goes.

But I don't suppose that the Vatican, or the protestants, or the Isalmics, or the Judaists, or the pagans would officially deem the birth of my daughter as a miracle.

I wonder, though, why you are being so cryptic in your posts? You seem to want to sound like you know something that no one else knows, and are patiently getting around to it over time. You also don't seem to be particularly well read in history. How can you dispute ancient writings that still exist today by simply saying that the history of those writings were commented on by atheists?

I don't see you as being curious in the least about where the truth might lead. You are proud of the fact that you rely on the Bible for all of your information on the ancient world.

I wouldn't suggest that you investigate further than your own truth. I've said here that I'm not out to convert anyone, and I'm not. Some people need Christianity to keep them from sinning in all sorts of awful ways, and for all I know, you are one of those, so go ahead and believe what you believe.

But, yes, I was a Christian for over forty years and lived by the Bible and had Jesus by my side all that time. I really wish it were all true and if you still believe it, then you probably don't want to study things and should probably just stick to the Bible.

k

Bad ol' sin.

Life isn't about being just good or bad, it's about having Christ in your heart or not .

Now, what if it's a good person that is a christian? While I can't honestly explain correctly how God thinks( hey, He is God, I am a single human being) , God did address some part of this subject in The Bible, or at least something you might find interesting .

1Pe 3:17 For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing.

Also,

1Pe 3:14 But and if ye suffer for righteousness' sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled;

I need to state something, when we accept God as our Savior, while most of us expect life to be easy, it will not be easy, God didn't promised(that I know of) an easy life, He did promised however, to be there with Us, also He's main promess(that He will fulfill) is that whoever believed in Him, will have everlasting life in Heaven.

What you spoke was erroneous. You were wrong. You were not only wrong, but you were wrong based on some idea you have about faith that obviously isn't true.

Look at it from another Christian's perspective. Maybe another Christian would like to find out what happened to me. Maybe they don't pretend to know the mind of God and are more interested in saving my soul than accusing me of being a liar. "Love them where they are" comes to mind. "Judge not etc, etc..." comes to mind.

Yet there you are telling me that even if I DID decide to try it again, I could never be certain whether I was fooling myself or not. Is there any value to that? Is your purpose here to tell atheists that they are evil? or is it to win souls to Christ by the same means that Christ won souls?

Do you love me or not?

I want to know what happened to you, by the way it looks like, something very bad must have happened, I and most of us are willing to hear you. While maybe we won't fully understand you, we will try to with God's help.

Great! So I get the only person in the western world that never believed in Santa!

Okay, so you're going to have to imagine what everyone else around you went through. As children in the west, we were told that Santa Claus (you know OF him, correct?) comes down the chimney, even though you might not have one, and leaves gifts for the good children.

We don't have a "sort-of" belief, we absolutely believe.

Once we get an idea of the size of the world, and the difficulty of delivering presents to each and every house in one night, we tend to realize that this belief is perhaps based on iffy ground.

If you never believed in Santa, then perhaps our conversation is over.

Add another person to the list , I never believed in Santa Claus.

But hope the conversation is not over though, I am interested in this discussion.

GBU All.

This is the rephrase, hope that helps out, if you don't understand what I said, I would be more than happy to redo it again .

GBY All, Cell.

Excellent! and thank you!

I could have gotten by just by reading the bolded parts, and I'm grateful that you went to the trouble of cleaning it up.

I'll try to get to it tomorrow, it's late.

k

[khalou]

I have heard the expression that birth is a miracle. It is of the sort that says that a flower is a miracle, yet there are lots of flowers. It is a poetic expression and a good one as far as that goes.

But I don't suppose that the Vatican, or the protestants, or the Isalmics, or the Judaists, or the pagans would officially deem the birth of my daughter as a miracle.

I wonder, though, why you are being so cryptic in your posts? You seem to want to sound like you know something that no one else knows, and are patiently getting around to it over time. You also don't seem to be particularly well read in history. How can you dispute ancient writings that still exist today by simply saying that the history of those writings were commented on by atheists?

I don't see you as being curious in the least about where the truth might lead. You are proud of the fact that you rely on the Bible for all of your information on the ancient world.

I wouldn't suggest that you investigate further than your own truth. I've said here that I'm not out to convert anyone, and I'm not. Some people need Christianity to keep them from sinning in all sorts of awful ways, and for all I know, you are one of those, so go ahead and believe what you believe.

But, yes, I was a Christian for over forty years and lived by the Bible and had Jesus by my side all that time. I really wish it were all true and if you still believe it, then you probably don't want to study things and should probably just stick to the Bible.

k

Bad ol' sin.

Life isn't about being just good or bad, it's about having Christ in your heart or not .

Now, what if it's a good person that is a christian? While I can't honestly explain correctly how God thinks( hey, He is God, I am a single human being) , God did address some part of this subject in The Bible, or at least something you might find interesting .

1Pe 3:17 For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing.

Also,

1Pe 3:14 But and if ye suffer for righteousness' sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled;

I need to state something, when we accept God as our Savior, while most of us expect life to be easy, it will not be easy, God didn't promised(that I know of) an easy life, He did promised however, to be there with Us, also He's main promess(that He will fulfill) is that whoever believed in Him, will have everlasting life in Heaven.

There is only one promise I've ever found in the Bible as far as life on this earth is concerned.

That we will be granted peace. The reason that peace passes all understanding is because it is not based on circumstances. A Christian who finds him (or her) self in the midst of horrible suffering will be granted this peace, and others will marvel and wonder where this peace comes from. I understand that.

What you spoke was erroneous. You were wrong. You were not only wrong, but you were wrong based on some idea you have about faith that obviously isn't true.

Look at it from another Christian's perspective. Maybe another Christian would like to find out what happened to me. Maybe they don't pretend to know the mind of God and are more interested in saving my soul than accusing me of being a liar. "Love them where they are" comes to mind. "Judge not etc, etc..." comes to mind.

Yet there you are telling me that even if I DID decide to try it again, I could never be certain whether I was fooling myself or not. Is there any value to that? Is your purpose here to tell atheists that they are evil? or is it to win souls to Christ by the same means that Christ won souls?

Do you love me or not?

I want to know what happened to you, by the way it looks like, something very bad must have happened, I and most of us are willing to hear you. While maybe we won't fully understand you, we will try to with God's help.

And I thank you for that. Something did happen, and it has lots to do with my last statement in this post. I may get to it sometime, but I have never been able to explain it sufficently to Christians in a way that they would understand. I'm therefore reluctant to do so here. It isn't a lack on the part of the Christians, I'm sure. It must be a lack of my ability to convey the concept. But even so, it wasn't what made me an atheist.

Great! So I get the only person in the western world that never believed in Santa!

Okay, so you're going to have to imagine what everyone else around you went through. As children in the west, we were told that Santa Claus (you know OF him, correct?) comes down the chimney, even though you might not have one, and leaves gifts for the good children.

We don't have a "sort-of" belief, we absolutely believe.

Once we get an idea of the size of the world, and the difficulty of delivering presents to each and every house in one night, we tend to realize that this belief is perhaps based on iffy ground.

If you never believed in Santa, then perhaps our conversation is over.

Add another person to the list , I never believed in Santa Claus.

But hope the conversation is not over though, I am interested in this discussion.

GBU All.

Me too.

[khalou]

I have heard the expression that birth is a miracle. It is of the sort that says that a flower is a miracle, yet there are lots of flowers. It is a poetic expression and a good one as far as that goes.

But I don't suppose that the Vatican, or the protestants, or the Isalmics, or the Judaists, or the pagans would officially deem the birth of my daughter as a miracle.

I wonder, though, why you are being so cryptic in your posts? You seem to want to sound like you know something that no one else knows, and are patiently getting around to it over time. You also don't seem to be particularly well read in history. How can you dispute ancient writings that still exist today by simply saying that the history of those writings were commented on by atheists?

I don't see you as being curious in the least about where the truth might lead. You are proud of the fact that you rely on the Bible for all of your information on the ancient world.

I wouldn't suggest that you investigate further than your own truth. I've said here that I'm not out to convert anyone, and I'm not. Some people need Christianity to keep them from sinning in all sorts of awful ways, and for all I know, you are one of those, so go ahead and believe what you believe.

But, yes, I was a Christian for over forty years and lived by the Bible and had Jesus by my side all that time. I really wish it were all true and if you still believe it, then you probably don't want to study things and should probably just stick to the Bible.

k

Bad ol' sin.

Life isn't about being just good or bad, it's about having Christ in your heart or not .

Now, what if it's a good person that is a christian? While I can't honestly explain correctly how God thinks( hey, He is God, I am a single human being) , God did address some part of this subject in The Bible, or at least something you might find interesting .

1Pe 3:17 For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing.

Also,

1Pe 3:14 But and if ye suffer for righteousness' sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled;

I need to state something, when we accept God as our Savior, while most of us expect life to be easy, it will not be easy, God didn't promised(that I know of) an easy life, He did promised however, to be there with Us, also He's main promess(that He will fulfill) is that whoever believed in Him, will have everlasting life in Heaven.

There is only one promise I've ever found in the Bible as far as life on this earth is concerned.

That we will be granted peace. The reason that peace passes all understanding is because it is not based on circumstances. A Christian who finds him (or her) self in the midst of horrible suffering will be granted this peace, and others will marvel and wonder where this peace comes from. I understand that.

What you spoke was erroneous. You were wrong. You were not only wrong, but you were wrong based on some idea you have about faith that obviously isn't true.

Look at it from another Christian's perspective. Maybe another Christian would like to find out what happened to me. Maybe they don't pretend to know the mind of God and are more interested in saving my soul than accusing me of being a liar. "Love them where they are" comes to mind. "Judge not etc, etc..." comes to mind.

Yet there you are telling me that even if I DID decide to try it again, I could never be certain whether I was fooling myself or not. Is there any value to that? Is your purpose here to tell atheists that they are evil? or is it to win souls to Christ by the same means that Christ won souls?

Do you love me or not?

I want to know what happened to you, by the way it looks like, something very bad must have happened, I and most of us are willing to hear you. While maybe we won't fully understand you, we will try to with God's help.

And I thank you for that. Something did happen, and it has lots to do with my last statement in this post. I may get to it sometime, but I have never been able to explain it sufficently to Christians in a way that they would understand. I'm therefore reluctant to do so here. It isn't a lack on the part of the Christians, I'm sure. It must be a lack of my ability to convey the concept. But even so, it wasn't what made me an atheist.

Great! So I get the only person in the western world that never believed in Santa!

Okay, so you're going to have to imagine what everyone else around you went through. As children in the west, we were told that Santa Claus (you know OF him, correct?) comes down the chimney, even though you might not have one, and leaves gifts for the good children.

We don't have a "sort-of" belief, we absolutely believe.

Once we get an idea of the size of the world, and the difficulty of delivering presents to each and every house in one night, we tend to realize that this belief is perhaps based on iffy ground.

If you never believed in Santa, then perhaps our conversation is over.

Add another person to the list , I never believed in Santa Claus.

But hope the conversation is not over though, I am interested in this discussion.

GBU All.

Me too.

Wow. It happened again.

I suppose you could read my responses that occur right after your bolded statements?

k

[CellShade]

Yes, I was able to read the response .

Also, it's ok if you don't want to state what happened, though it would be good for our understanding, but, if it's something you rather not speak about, we understand.

But now, I want to know, if this event wasn't what changed your mind about God (but I think it might have influenced to it a bit, did it?), what changed your mind then?

GBY All.