Non-cessationist Calvinists

[7cworldwide]

Incredulous. One point is quite clear: it's certainly not based on plain biblical declarations concerning, real, national, earthly dialects. Surely you must be aware that the very word, "tongue" refers to meaningful human speech. The very word "interpretation" (used seven times in 1 Cor.12-14) in such a context refers to translation of intelligible human languages. Modern glossolalia (since 1901) out of Azusa, California, can be rejected on this very basis alone.

First off, thanks a lot for hijacking the thread which had been a decent conversation.

Let me ask you a this: Would Arabic have been an intelligible language to the church at Corinth? How about Urdu or Cantonese? So what difference does it make to the church in Corinth if the need for an interpreter is from one of these unintelligible (to them) earthly languages or if it's the heavenly tongue (cf. 1 Cor. 13:1)? And why, pray tell, is it a requirement that the interpretation be of and by the Spirit? ...the answer is in the Scriptures. The gift of tongues is a supernatural, Spiritual gift. Interpretation of tongues is a supernatural, Spiritual gift. And if you will allow yourself a thorough and honest study of 1 Cor. 14 you will see that this gift has several different applications.

Your reference to the misrepresentations and false manifestations of the gifts in the modern charismatic movement does not prove or disprove anything. There are liars and false prophets in most every flock these days.

If you disagree with me, fine. But again, your condescension, mockery, and sarcasm absolutely turn my stomach. You should, as a Christian (exhibiting the fruits of the Spirit, cf. Gal. 5), should at least start out introducing your dissenting opinion with some love and respect. I respect the fact that you cannot be convinced with my personal empirical evidence. But the biblical evidence, whether or not you will see it and admit it, is conclusively on the side of the non-cessationist.

[CSLewis]

I have some friends who are Reformed Charasmatics. They started a chapel about 30 members. I was going there for a couple Sundays. I disagree with sola scriptura though. I think the early church was both liturgical and apostolic. I think Calvin was completely wrong in his interpretation of Romans 9, along with the anullment of the Deuterocanonical books.

peace be with you

CSLewis

[7cworldwide]

Interesting. Thanks for your reply, CSLewis.

Shalom,

[Arthur Durnan]

Again. of course, our Pentecostal/charismatic friend appears quite upset - to the very point of, what? actually "stomach-turning" yet! - due to the fact that others quite succinctly do not agree with him. Sad. Truth to tell, my friend, ANY earthly, national language would have been unintelligible to those who didn't personally know that particular earthly, national language save for an interpreter in the early church - or for that matter, in any church today! One thing the Holy Scriptures do NOT underscore is u(edited by moderator)unintelligible speech UNKNOWN in Holy Writ, unless, of course, you can specifically pin-point for us your unintelligible mutterings (in Holy Scripture) such as the aforementioned (edited by moderator)" I surmise biblical understanding re national, earthly & biblically-underscored (Acts 2:8-11 with national language-groupings NAMED!) may not be your strong suit, but come on, my dear charismatic friend, "(Edited by moderator) when God, Creator of us all, surely understands & answers in ANY of our 3000 national dialects INCLUDING your Urdu, Arabic, Greek, Dutch, whatever! Amen! And thank You, Lord Jesus for accepting our worship and hearing our prayer & praise & answering us whether African, Arabic, Greek, English, Russian, Espanol, En Francais, whatever!!

http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com

[Floatingaxe]

Again. of course, our Pentecostal/charismatic friend appears quite upset - to the very point of, what? actually "stomach-turning" yet! - due to the fact that others quite succinctly do not agree with him. Sad. Truth to tell, my friend, ANY earthly, national language would have been unintelligible to those who didn't personally know that particular earthly, national language save for an interpreter in the early church - or for that matter, in any church today! One thing the Holy Scriptures do NOT underscore is (edited by moderator) unintelligible speech UNKNOWN in Holy Writ, unless, of course, you can specifically pin-point for us your unintelligible mutterings (in Holy Scripture) such as the aforementioned (edited by moderator) I surmise biblical understanding re national, earthly & biblically-underscored (Acts 2:8-11 with national language-groupings NAMED!) may not be your strong suit, but come on, my dear charismatic friend, (edited by moderator) when God, Creator of us all, surely understands & answers in ANY of our 3000 national dialects INCLUDING your Urdu, Arabic, Greek, Dutch, whatever! Amen! And thank You, Lord Jesus for accepting our worship and hearing our prayer & praise & answering us whether African, Arabic, Greek, English, Russian, Espanol, En Francais, whatever!!

http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com

Whatever, Arthur.

[Arthur Durnan]

Yes, indeed, Canadian Steel City! Except for your CFL Tiger-Cats, the non-scourge of Canadian Football, yes?

http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com

[Floatingaxe]

Yes, indeed, Canadian Steel City! Except for your CFL Tiger-Cats, the non-scourge of Canadian Football, yes?

http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com

Si, senor.

[Arthur Durnan]

I read you. So you may discuss it, but not others who may indeed disagree? Hmm. Isn't sauce for the...........?

http://arthurdurnan.freeyellow.com

[Guest bhccguy]

Hi Lane!

I usually don't take time for forums, but this is an exception.. Back to your initial post, before it got hijacked...

I would have to ID myself as a non-cessationist calvinist. I've been a Calvinist for almost 30 years and had one problem - I could not find biblical warrant for the cessationist position. I started scouring the web on a different research topic and discovered a wealth of like-minded folk. Strongly theological folk, whom I deeply admire who also hold to the non-cessationist calvinistic position. The two I have in mind most are John Piper (http://www.desiringgod.org/ResourceLibrary/Articles/ByTopic/87/1498_Signs_and_Wonders_Then_and_Now/) (Piper is absolutely the most profoundly influential Christian I have ever been familiar with. Check out his website. His teaching will blow your mind) and Martyn Lloyd-Jones who went to be with the Lord in 1981 (http://www.desiringgod.org/ResourceLibrary/Biographies/1462_A_Passion_for_ChristExalting_Power/). Martyn Lloyd-Jones preached for nearly 30 years at Westminster Chapel in London. the link on him is actually a biography Piper did on him. so Lane, you're not alone!

[7cworldwide]

bhccguy,

Thank you, bro!! I appreciate you taking the time to share that.

Another is Wayne Grudem. I just bought his Systematic Theology and I'm really looking forward to reading what he has to say on continuationism.

...I believe J.I. Packer is on our list, too.