What if the Anti-Christ was not a person at all?

[forrestkc]

It just does not fit scripture. How is the computer going to be wounded to near death and then ressurrected by the false prophet. Christ was a literal person in His earthly manifestation, Anti-Christ will be also. The anti-christ is to be seen by the Jews as their Messiah. They are specifically looking for a man born from the lineage of David. A computer does not quite fit that bill.

Furthermore, the Beast and the False Prophet will be cast into the lake of fire.

2 Thessalonians 2:3-12

Revelation 19:19-20

Revelation 20:10

Matthew 10:28

A computer could not be cast into a lake of fire?

[minnow]

The anti-christ will not have The Holy Spirit.

That is for certain. 1 John 4:1-3, Ephesians 2:1-3

[minnow]

Furthermore, the Beast and the False Prophet will be cast into the lake of fire.

2 Thessalonians 2:3-12

Revelation 19:19-20

Revelation 20:10

Matthew 10:28

A computer could not be cast into a lake of fire?

It has NO SOUL given to it by GOD. (Matthew 10:28)

[forrestkc]

Furthermore, the Beast and the False Prophet will be cast into the lake of fire.

2 Thessalonians 2:3-12

Revelation 19:19-20

Revelation 20:10

Matthew 10:28

A computer could not be cast into a lake of fire?

It has NO SOUL given to it by GOD. (Matthew 10:28)

What determines what recieves a soul or not? What is the mental capacity needed for a soul? For example, does a few cells in a petri dish have a soul? Does an individual born brain dead have a soul?

It is not that I don't see your point, because I do. I just think this thread is more of a thought experiment, so I am playing the devils advocate here.

[followerofjesus]

The antichrist is w/in. You only have to look into mans' soul.

[Metin]

i think we can all see technology growing very rapidly in fact it is quite frightening when you think about it and i am sure it will have some part to play in events leading upto Christs return. but the antichrist himself? i dont think so.

someone said evil is when we do something against the will of God, surely man can program a computer to do something evil it doesnt have to be concious but even if the antichrist does turn out to be a computer there will be man or men behind it programming or creating it. i think that it is those men or man that have done the wrong not the computer. even if they program it to adapt or 'learn'.

[Smalcald]

Ok first off, I probably should point out that the entire End Times / Biblical Prophecy stuff has no appeal to me at all. I am just not into it. The way I see it, the world may end tomorrow, or it may go on for another 4 billion years. So I don't spend my time looking for signs of the end or a coming rapture and all that.

Just the same I got to thinking: What if the Anti-Christ was not even a human? What if it were a super computer instead. I work in I.T. and computers are literally trillions of times more powerful today than the original computer in the 1940s. Today, parallel processing is becoming very common place. In the last year or so, almost every computer sold contained a dual-core processor. For reasons that I will not go into for fear of boring most people, this trend will only continue. This year we will probably see quad-core processor home computers as common place and next year, probably 8 or more cores per processor and so on and so forth. Artificial intelligence is contingent on parallel processing. Basically, a computer must be able to do more than one operation at the exact same time. In the past it might have appeared that your home computer was doing this, but it was in effect faking it by implementing what is referred to as task switching.

With all these multi-core machines being common place, the world's community of developers will aquire the skills nessisary to take advantage of multiple cores. This is basically called parallel tasking and multiple threading. Granted, this type of programming has been around for a long time, but until recently it was largely relegated to higher end server applications. Now that it will be common place in the desktop world, hundreds of thousands of developers will be adding this type programming to their skill sets.

Now, multi-threading and parallel tasking is the basic foundation of artificial intelligence programming. Thus, the logical conclusion is that as new hardware and programming technologies are developed and adopted, we are going to see more and more "thinking" done by computers in the home and business place. At some point in the fairly near future it will be quite possible that the technology will exist to develop truly "intelligent computers". In our lifetimes, it is quite possible that computers could actually exceed the intelligence of man, especially super computer clusters. Of course, along the way, as computers became even more capable, we would give them even more responsibilities in our societies and economies.

So, it seems to me at least, that the Anti-Christ, if he were to show up, could actually be a super intelligent computer, not a man. This seem at all plausible to anyone?

I kind of like that idea. If you combine supercomputing strength with say cloning you could really be on to something. We see nothing in the bible that would indicate that the anti-Christ has a human soul. Also it would make it more feasible into being a false God. Think of it, what we all really worship at some level, technology. Technology will solve our every problem, and for the sake of technology we clone, we kill, we make better weapons, and on and on.

Also with the advent of international monetary flows, and the removal of a cash economy, once again a creature which could control that would be able to control who bought and who sold.

Your idea has some appeal.

[nebula]

Rev. 13

1 Then I stood on the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast rising up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and on his horns ten crowns, and on his heads a blasphemous name. 2 Now the beast which I saw was like a leopard, his feet were like the feet of a bear, and his mouth like the mouth of a lion. The dragon gave him his power, his throne, and great authority. 3 And I saw one of his heads as if it had been mortally wounded, and his deadly wound was healed. And all the world marveled and followed the beast. 4 So they worshiped the dragon who gave authority to the beast; and they worshiped the beast, saying, "Who is like the beast? Who is able to make war with him?" 5 And he was given a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies, and he was given authority to continue for forty-two months. 6 Then he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme His name, His tabernacle, and those who dwell in heaven. 7 It was granted to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them. And authority was given him over every tribe, tongue, and nation. 8 All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. 9 If anyone has an ear, let him hear. 10 He who leads into captivity shall go into captivity; he who kills with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

In the book of Daniel, the beasts were Empires.

I think there is room for debate over whether the "Anti-Chirst" is indeed a person or an empire of sorts. I do not see a computer fitting this description.

In any event, I have doubts that man can create a machine with a soul and spirit. That would mean man can create a soul and spirit. That I do not believe can happen.

[forrestkc]

I kind of like that idea. If you combine supercomputing strength with say cloning you could really be on to something. We see nothing in the bible that would indicate that the anti-Christ has a human soul. Also it would make it more feasible into being a false God. Think of it, what we all really worship at some level, technology. Technology will solve our every problem, and for the sake of technology we clone, we kill, we make better weapons, and on and on.

Also with the advent of international monetary flows, and the removal of a cash economy, once again a creature which could control that would be able to control who bought and who sold.

Your idea has some appeal.

That was kind of what I was getting at. The way I see it, the question of whether or not a computer could have a soul is kind of irrelevant. The question is only whether or not computers will be capable of actual thought at some point, and if that that thought and the learning associated with it could result in those future thinking computers being able to be self aware and grasp ethics and thus be capable of rationalization and even evil.

The building blocks are already there. Supercomputers that are used for things like long term climatic modeling already "think". Anti-Spam software generally utilizes basic forms of artificial intelligence. So does most anti-virus and threat detection software. These are all "learning" packages. Games are really beginning to utilize artificial intelligence concepts, and games are only now beginning to be multi-threaded. It is quite possible if not likely that we will have actually intelligent super computers within 20 years. It is also quite possible that soon after we reach that milestone, that there will be computers that actually exceed the intellect of man. Think about it. At that point, we will have computers that can comprehend concepts that are well beyond human comprehension. They would be able to provide answers to questions that humanity on its own could never hope to grasp. If that would not be akin to a false God, then I am not sure what would be. Think about it, say these super computers could comprehend things about the origin of the universe that are well beyond the capability of man. They might be able to tell us how to create life simply from molecular origins.

[Smalcald]

I kind of like that idea. If you combine supercomputing strength with say cloning you could really be on to something. We see nothing in the bible that would indicate that the anti-Christ has a human soul. Also it would make it more feasible into being a false God. Think of it, what we all really worship at some level, technology. Technology will solve our every problem, and for the sake of technology we clone, we kill, we make better weapons, and on and on.

Also with the advent of international monetary flows, and the removal of a cash economy, once again a creature which could control that would be able to control who bought and who sold.

Your idea has some appeal.

That was kind of what I was getting at. The way I see it, the question of whether or not a computer could have a soul is kind of irrelevant. The question is only whether or not computers will be capable of actual thought at some point, and if that that thought and the learning associated with it could result in those future thinking computers being able to be self aware and grasp ethics and thus be capable of rationalization and even evil.

The building blocks are already there. Supercomputers that are used for things like long term climatic modeling already "think". Anti-Spam software generally utilizes basic forms of artificial intelligence. So does most anti-virus and threat detection software. These are all "learning" packages. Games are really beginning to utilize artificial intelligence concepts, and games are only now beginning to be multi-threaded. It is quite possible if not likely that we will have actually intelligent super computers within 20 years. It is also quite possible that soon after we reach that milestone, that there will be computers that actually exceed the intellect of man. Think about it. At that point, we will have computers that can comprehend concepts that are well beyond human comprehension. They would be able to provide answers to questions that humanity on its own could never hope to grasp. If that would not be akin to a false God, then I am not sure what would be. Think about it, say these super computers could comprehend things about the origin of the universe that are well beyond the capability of man. They might be able to tell us how to create life simply from molecular origins.

Right. The essence of mimicking God would be a thing that is a creator.

Yet, it would not have love, nor faith, it could not understand love in particular agape love. It is the one thing it might not ever "get" as love itself truly disinterested love is irrational. It could mimic love surely though.

Who could stand against such a brilliant thing? Only those who have faith in Christ.

If we look at the movement of our world, how we are progressing I see technology as something not good or evil, but I see it as something we worship, and thus this worship is the essence of idolatry. So yes I am warming to your concept!

The other idea would be that the anti-Christ could be an alien being with omnipotent like powers. Someone like Q on star trek. He would come to earth at a point of great disturbances and pertubations, and provide a lot of answers.