How can one Lose Everlasting Salvation?

[Guest Calamity]

"Overcometh"

3528 // nikaw // nikao // nik-ah'-o //

from 3529 ; TDNT - 4:942,634; v

AV - overcome 24, conquer 2, prevail 1, get the victory 1; 28

1) to conquer

1a) to carry off the victory, come off victorious

1a1) of Christ, victorious over all His foes

1a2) of Christians, that hold fast their faith even unto death

against the power of their foes, and temptations and

persecutions

----------------------------------------

Rev.2

[7] He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.

[11] He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.

[17] He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.

[26] And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

Rev.3

[5] He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

[12] Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

Rev.21

[7] He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

---------------

1John.5

[5] Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

-----------------------

Does this make sense?

[tsth]

Yes, very much so calamity. It is in essence what Paul spoke of in terms of fighting the good fight, finishing the race, enduring to the end.

The seed that prevailed in seeking to understand. Get these riches, and endure to the end. Desire to seek Him and understand, all the way to the end, do not lose faith and turn away, but persevere. Believe to the end, just like Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, even if brought to the face of death, and said even if we die we will believe!

Daniel 3:16 Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, answered and said to the king, O Nebuchadnezzar, we are not careful to answer thee in this matter. 17 If it be so, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and he will deliver us out of thine hand, O king. 18 But if not, be it known unto thee, O king, that we will not serve thy gods, nor worship the golden image which thou hast set up.

3:28 Then Nebuchadnezzar spake, and said, Blessed be the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, who hath sent his angel, and delivered his servants that trusted in him, and have changed the king's word, and yielded their bodies, that they might not serve nor worship any god, except their own God.

That is what enduring, conquering, overcoming, is ALL ABOUT!

In His Love,

Suzanne

[Guest shiloh357]

Why post such garbage? You know that the everlasting part comes after you die.

Everlasting life is a present possession according to scripture. We can know that we are saved today.

1 John 5:13

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

[sagz4Christ]

Jake,

Hi Sagz! I trust that everything is going well with you!

All is not going well, my friend. Too long to get into right now. As to the eternal topic between us........

I see what you are getting at, but remember that ALL of the people in question are refered to as "virgins". These are people who are saints according to Christ. They have to be because we are the bride of Christ, thereby making us virgins.

Let's start here:

Matthew 25:1-13 (NASB)

"Then the kingdom of heaven will be comparable to ten virgins, who took their lamps and went out to meet the bridegroom. "Five of them were foolish, and five were prudent. "For when the foolish took their lamps, they took no oil with them, but the prudent took oil in flasks along with their lamps. "Now while the bridegroom was delaying, they all got drowsy and began to sleep. "But at midnight there was a shout, `Behold, the bridegroom! Come out to meet him.' "Then all those virgins rose and trimmed their lamps. "The foolish said to the prudent, `Give us some of your oil, for our lamps are going out.' "But the prudent answered, `No, there will not be enough for us and you too; go instead to the dealers and buy some for yourselves.' "And while they were going away to make the purchase, the bridegroom came, and those who were ready went in with him to the wedding feast; and the door was shut.  "Later the other virgins also came, saying, `Lord, lord, open up for us.'  "But he answered, `Truly I say to you, I do not know you.' "Be on the alert then, for you do not know the day nor the hour.

Virgins

Greek: Parthenos {par-then'-os}

Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine

Definitions:

1. a virgin

1a. a marriageable maiden

1b. a woman who has never had sexual intercourse with a man

1c. one's marriageable daughter

2. a man who has abstained from all uncleanness and whoredom attendant on idolatry, and so has kept his chastity

2a. one who has never had intercourse with women

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

It seems that Christ is refering to definition #2 in this passage, as this is the only time in Matthew this word is used except for Matt. 1:23 where the term is refering to Mary, and then it is defined as 1b.

So, as to our text, this person who is refered to as a virgin is one who has lived a life of abstainance from all uncleanness and whoredom attendant on idolatry, and so has kept their chastity. Does this nesseccarily imply that we are talking about a Christian? What about one who lives a good life, but does not have Christ as Lord and Savior? Do you know anyone who by all outward appearances lives a more "righteous" life than any Christian you know? Is that man or woman entitled to heaven?

There are a few Scriptures that bear witness to this passage;

One is Matthew 13:3-9

"Behold, the sower went out to sow; and as he sowed, some seeds fell beside the road, and the birds came and ate them up. "Others fell on the rocky places, where they did not have much soil; and immediately they sprang up, because they had no depth of soil. "But when the sun had risen, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away. "Others fell among the thorns, and the thorns came up and choked them out. "And others fell on the good soil and yielded a crop, some a hundredfold, some sixty, and some thirty. "He who has ears, let him hear."

Which seed can we surmise are the Christians?

Another one is this:

2 Peter 2:18-22

For speaking out arrogant words of vanity they entice by fleshly desires, by sensuality, those who barely escape from the ones who live in error, promising them freedom while they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by what a man is overcome, by this he is enslaved. For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them. It has happened to them according to the true proverb, "A DOG RETURNS TO ITS OWN VOMIT," and, "A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire."

What are the similarities in these two sections of Scripture? Can you see a relationship between the two? I wonder who the seeds are that could be compared to the dog and the sow...

Explain to me again how this doctrine is not a license to sin?

This is caused by the misunderstanding that when I say disobedient I am refering to "willfull" disobedience. I am not refering to such. If someone is sinning, and feels no compunction whatsoever about his/her/ sin, then there is great cause to worry, for that person may not really have Christ in his heart. This person may never have been saved in the first place.

There is another parable that speaks to what I am trying to say...

Matthew 22:11-13

"But when the king came in to look over the dinner guests, he saw a man there who was not dressed in wedding clothes, and he said to him, 'Friend, how did you come in here without wedding clothes?' And the man was speechless. "Then the king said to the servants, 'Bind him hand and foot, and throw him into the outer darkness; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.'

Is this not a picture of those that are trying to get to heaven with their OWN righteousness instead of the what God intended for them to come? The man is dressed in his OWN clothes. Not those prescribed by the King. Notice what that man had to say? Nothing! He knew he got caught for trying to get in without the proper attire. What is, by the way, the proper attire for this wedding feast? Why, it is none other than the righteousness of "CHRIST." HE is our justification to our Father. It is HIS righteousness we must be wearing in order to receive eternal life. He is the only one that fits the bill for the requirements of God.

And how do we get to wear that robe of righteousness? Those clothes with which all Christians are garbbed?

[Guest Shaman]

Unless words don't mean what they say, EVERLASTING salvation must indeed refer to the LENGTH of one's salvation thru the blood of the cross. If one can lose EVERLASTING salvation, one never possessed it in the first place!

The root word for everlasting in the Greek is aion, and is translated aionos. Although I am not an expert in the science of word study, I've learned, hopefully correctly, that when the word everlasting (aion, aionos) is attached or used in biblical phrases it varies in meaning. Because the duration of aion or aionos depends on the thing to which it is connected. When aion is connected to God it becomes eternal, or everlasting. But when it is connected to man or a thing, then aion becomes the life of the man or thing. So, the words aion and aionos are indefinite times, depending on the phrase or connection. It is continued action, but only for the duration or life of the object.

Therefore, everlasting salvation for a person is only for the duration of that person's life. This is proven by the Exodus story. Israel was saved from bondage, but all perished except two. Only two reached the Promised Land out millions. That is our example of salvation. You can be saved and still not reach God's Rest.

Shaman

[His son]

Unless words don't mean what they say, EVERLASTING salvation must indeed refer to the LENGTH of one's salvation thru the blood of the cross. If one can lose EVERLASTING salvation, one never possessed it in the first place! If an individual is an AMERICAN, how can that individual NOT be an American AT THE SAME TIME?

Like someone has stated once you are an American you can leave and go to another country, say England, and then you will be an American who moved to England. So you can be saved, as the Jews were many times over until God said I will deliver you no more, and move on back to Egypt. That doesn't mean salvation doesn't exist any longer it just means that didn't choose to stay saved.

[SisterT-Enduring2TheEnd]

Everlasting life. Funny how folks miss the simple truth. Everlasting life was "everlasting" BEFORE I obtained it. Should I forfeit it, it will still be EVERLASTING. Its "everlasting-ness" has nothing to do with my possession of it. If I have a Rolex watch and I give it away, does it cease to be a Rolex watch? Of course not. Such as it is with everlasting life.

[tsth]

Everlasting life.  Funny how folks miss the simple truth.  Everlasting life was "everlasting" BEFORE I obtained it.  Should I forfeit it, it will still be EVERLASTING.  Its "everlasting-ness" has nothing to do with my possession of it.  If I have a Rolex watch and I give it away, does it cease to be a Rolex watch?  Of course not.  Such as it is with everlasting life.

Amen Sister!

I would think that there is a confusion over the wordage. It is not termed everlasting salvation........it IS however termed "everlasting life", which is intrinsically different in meaning when you take the time to stop and think about it.

In His Love,

Suzanne

[rollinTHUNDER]

Paul knew he couldn't just start the race, but he knew he must finish it to win the prize:

Philippians 3:10-14 - "I want to know Christ and the power of his resurrection and the fellowship of sharing in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, (11)and so, somehow, to attain to the resurrection from the dead. (12)Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already been made perfect, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. (13)Brothers, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, (14)I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus."

2 John 1:8-9 - "Watch out that you do not lose what you have worked for, but that you may be rewarded fully. (9)Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son."

2 Timothy 2:5-7 - "Similarly, if anyone competes as an athlete, he does not receive the victor's crown unless he competes according to the rules (obeying commands). (6)The hardworking farmer should be the first to receive a share of the crops. (7)Reflect on what I am saying, for the Lord will give you insight into all this." (emphasis added)

[Guest Shaman]

sisterT:

Excellent words of wisdom. Peace unto you!

Shaman