Drivers licence emerges as "crime fighting" tool

[buckthesystem]

You can fight this all day everyday but it's still going to happen.

It wasn't too long ago that the idea of cameras everywhere sounded stupid.....but they're there.

Cameras at intersections....nobody wanted them...but they're there.

It's technology.....you can't stop it. You can scream as loud as you want, but it's still going to happen.

The end is coming and in order for it to get here, things gotta go bad...very bad.

Hard times are coming and all this new technology is going to play a part in it. You can't stop it.

All you can do is get right with God and warn those who will listen about the things to come.

Don't let the cares of this world steal that which has been bestowed upon you by God. It's not worth it.

No, the idea of cameras everywhere, intersections also, doesn't sound stupid - it sounds INTRUSIVE AND SINISTER.

It is not just "technology", it is using technology for violating peoples' rights and interfering with peoples' lives. Cameras at intersections may be some places, but they're not in NZ, and I hope there would be an outcry if ever government tried to introduce them here. Technology in itself is not evil, why do we have to accept that it is used for evil?

As for "don't let the cares of the world....." We are not all sheep, or "eeloys" (have you read "the Time Machine"?) If we are to have this attitude, why don't we just use the internet for swapping knitting patterns and talk about sports events, and not even try to save others' souls? Don't you believe that the obligation that comes with Christianity is to do rather more than sit back and bask in the knowledge that we are all OK?

[buckthesystem]

Quote, Axxman: "

I firmly believe that God allows certain gov't for certain reasons. I believe God allows communism, I don't know why, but he does. The same way He allowed Pharoah to rule over His people the Israelites. God admittedly hardened Pharoah's heart so that He could show His power. I don't always understand why God allows the things He does...but I am quite certain he allows it. I also NEVER said that "everything they do is for my own good." Thats simply not true. I don't think Social Security is run for my own good. I don't think the tax system is run for my own good. But I DO THINK that I am obligated to obey the system that God has put me in."

What would be the point of "free will" if God did not "allow" (for instance) communism or Pharoah's rule? No I believe that these things are entirely down to man going astray, making dumb mistakes, and God leaving man "to wallow in his misfortune" because he (man that is) was stupid enough to live under such systems without attempting to change or overthrow them. There is a saying that "people get the government they deserve", that is quite true, and they sure can't blame it on "God allowing it". And no, I believe that you are certainly NOT obligated to obey "the system that God has put you in" because God sure didn't "put you in it", you voted for it, or didn't protest enough about it, or didn't take up arms against it. That last sentence sounds like a real "cop out" to me. If you believe what you said, this gives you perfect permission to do nothing and blame God for it.

Quote, Axxman: "I agree, I cannot obey two masters. That includes myself. I am not the master of my own desires. I try to place God as the master of my desires. God's desires may not always be my first choice, but when I place myself under His will I find that my life is far better. Jesus did NOT break gov't laws...Pontius Pilate found "no fault" in Jesus when He was on trial. Jesus broke religious laws and traditions, and thats why the religious leaders wanted Him dead. The gov't would have released Jesus, but they took Jesus to appease the religious leaders. Jesus obeyed the laws of the gov't. I look forward to ANY scriptures you have to support the notion that God and gov't are "diametrically opposed."

Again, "free will" exists, that means that you ARE master of your own desires. Otherwise you would be a puppet controlled by God as puppeteer. It is nice if you always put what you believe is God's will first, but do we always know what that is?

Was Jesus overturning the money tables in the temple not breaking any law?

Quote, Axxman: "Not true...there are plenty of people like me, who don't really care. I give my consent. They don't even have to ask. America is not some fantasy land where you have this big right to privacy. The gov't can walk into your home ANYTIME they feel the need, all they have to do is convince a judge that its necessary. I have an open door policy...lol. They can come over whenever they want. i have NOTHING to hide, and NOTHING to fear. One, because I am a law abiding citizen. Two, because they cannot do anything to me that God doesn't allow. I am not afraid."

So you "don't care", hmm "I'm alright Jack, I don't care about you" is it? You may "give your consent" but an awful lot of other people wouldn't if they were even asked.

And you don't think that your right to privacy is important and therefore you are denigrating the idea that anybody else should have any privacy.

If you look back in history, some of the most cruel events started with giving up privacy and being encouraged to spy on others. Nazi Germany is a good example for that.

Once you have to give up your privacy, a vicious circle of fear and mistrust starts. People who are spied upon by whoever (state, say) tend to spy on others as well, out of fear, shame, revenge, whatever. Then, because they are afraid, they tend to get rather violent, narrow-minded, strict (ever seen a person who gave up smoking? Most of them you could use for the strictest anti-smoking campaigns, they'd be more than glad to help!).

Now if you really believe that privacy is something that belongs in a "fantasy land where they have this big right to privacy" please post all your family history, names, addresses, DOBs, all your bank acct information, income details, credit card details, any debts, every address you've had since birth, and shoe size. All just in case any reader of this site might be interested. After all you are not interested in any privacy, so this would be a good example of how far you are prepared to go. But you won't because "it is none of my flippin' business", is it?

Quote, Axxman: "DNA is unreliable? Fingerprints are unreliable? You got to be kidding. Fingerprinting is highly reliable. The article you posted DOES NOT show that fingerprinting is inaccurate. It shows that a lady perjured herself and lied on the stand about fingerprints. That young man was put in jail because of the lie, not because of the fingerprint. Also, NOBODY has ever been convicted of a crime based SOLELY on a fingerprint. The man in your article had a tin full of money in his room....like the tin full of money stolen from the house. Fingerprints are NOT infallible, everyone knows that, but they are accurate. Now that new fingerprint technology is being used (computers and lasers) it removes almost all elements of human error, which in the days of ink printing, was more common. I am a licensed live scan operator and I also use retinal imaging...I know from first hand experience the reliability of these methods.

Yep, DNA evidence sure is unreliable, for a start (completely apart from things like possible contamination of samples, and "accidentally" getting one dna sample confused with another) its success relies on the honesty and competence of government laboratory staff who are famous for their incompetence and lack of honesty. And it is the easiest thing in the world to use to "set someone up" with, to plant, at the scene of a crime or on an article of clothing or something.

And as for fingerprinting being "highly reliable", I think you probably read the wrong article. I meant the one about Shirley McKie, the policewoman, who was wrongly convicted on "fingerprint evidence". However, that is not the point, the point is that ordinary drivers on the DML database are NOT criminals, and so should NOT be treated as such and subjected to being fingerprinted, DNA tested, face recognition technologyed etc.

The thing is, just because we CAN do these things, it doesn't mean that we SHOULD.

Quote, Axxman: "I am certainly NOT worried about what may, or may not, happen in 20 years. I am more worried that personal freedoms will never be limited. I am for a constitutional review...because I don't think the framers of the constitution wrote the document to conform to our modern society. Thomas Jefferson would agree. He was in favor of constitutional conventions in order to make sure the document was meeting the needs of society appropriately".

So what about the freedom of your children when they are adults, or your grandchildren, or their children? Do you feel you have the right to make "freedom limiting" decisions for them.

Let me set the scene for you: "It is 2030 and Axxman's grandson says to him "Granddad tell me about the days when a kid could ride his bike down to the store to buy an icecream without being DNA tested by a policeman on the way, have his dad's bank account stripped of a 'fine' which would automatically be taken out of the kid's future earnings, and then he would be subjected to "face recognition software" and an "iris scan" when he entered the store".

An exaggeration perhaps, but this just might be the world that is being created with out complacency. And it will not be God's fault, but ours.

As for Romans 13, and whether or not Jesus advocated "breaking the law", I'll have to do a bit more reading on that, but I still maintain that yours is a very dangerous interpretation.

[Axxman]

Bro...First let me offer a quick disclaimer. Being fairly new here I don't know some of you guys that well (I hope to change that). I have been writing my posts assuming you are from the U.S., but I now see you are from NZ. My apologies on any confusion.

What would be the point of "free will" if God did not "allow" (for instance) communism or Pharoah's rule? No I believe that these things are entirely down to man going astray, making dumb mistakes, and God leaving man "to wallow in his misfortune" because he (man that is) was stupid enough to live under such systems without attempting to change or overthrow them. There is a saying that "people get the government they deserve", that is quite true, and they sure can't blame it on "God allowing it". And no, I believe that you are certainly NOT obligated to obey "the system that God has put you in" because God sure didn't "put you in it", you voted for it, or didn't protest enough about it, or didn't take up arms against it. That last sentence sounds like a real "cop out" to me. If you believe what you said, this gives you perfect permission to do nothing and blame God for it.

I don't believe in universal free will. I don't believe that God treats us a science experiment that he placed in the back of the closet to run amock. I believe God is VERY active in our every day lives. While there is a certain extent of "free will" in our lives, for the most part it is just human arrogance and pride to think that we have some effect on the world outside of God's influence. If people get the gov't they deserve then there would be no America, because there are VERY FEW people that deserve the luxuries, freedoms, and opportunites that the USA provides. Why do I deserve America? Based on what I deserve...I should be the mayor of a town called "Hell." But because of God's mercy and grace, I have been chosen to be a son in His Kingdom. Everything I have, and everything I am is because God allowed it. I also don't "blame" God, nor should anyone. God is not the focus of my blame, God is the focus of my praise. I praise Him for everything He provides. The good and the bad. The easy and the hard. We are really in no position to question God's motives.

Romans 9:20,21 who are you to reply against God? Will the thing formed say to him who formed it,