Support Our Troops???

[OneAccord]

I will not be a part of a systematic machine whose only concern is oil profits. If thats your only angle on this stuff, then you have yet still to hear what is actually going on.

I know there are lots of spin off effects and to maintain support at home and win world opinion America has to do some good in these places and try to maintain an appearance of this being all for the good, but it really is ultimately more about American military, political, and economic power and dominance.

If that were true, why is our government/military working towards building Iraqi self-governance?

If you want to bring up the past of WWII like you did before, look at how much America poured into Europe to free and rebuild it. We gave lives, resources, lots of money, and such. Our country did not have to do that. We could have let them rot, but we didn't.

If our government was about military, political, and economic power, we could have taken out the world a long time ago with the resources and technology we have. Iraq could have been conquored in one day, but our government and military wanted to preserve as many innocent civilians as possible.

I do believe your bitterness has gotten out of hand, and it is very disheartening.

To maintain it's strength America depends heavily upon oil and therefore they (the government) will do whatever is necessary to secure the oil supplies. If there were no oil in Iraq or Saudi Arabia, America wouldn't pay any attention at all to them and would not have gone to war. Oil in the middle east is referred to as "America's national interest" and that is what they go to war for.

Err, what did oil have to do with Bosnia? Or Israel? Sheesh, standing by Israel is making it more difficult for us to work with the oil producing nations. If oil was all we cared about, why haven't we turned Israel over to the Arabs like they keep edging us to do? You think freedom and democracy mean nothing to us?

And I'm going to ask you AGAIN. How much oil do you and your country use in a day? What would happen to you and your country if oil supplies were not secured?

The only thing I can add is this; I still believe that this nation can return to it's foundation and be a nation that is used of God.

And do you think this can be achieved militarily???

Umm, the person you quoted is talking about an internal issue. Your response is dealing with an external issue. Like our troops staying home would have anything to do with a revival occuring!

:upsided:

You want to be mad at America, why don't you attack Hollywood? Talk about evil!

I don't think America would have any problem with a self-governing Iraqi government, but when it comes to dividing the spoils, that's a different story.

You have to understand that it's the corporate business executives and elites that stand to profit the most from this war, and their business dealings tend to be done in corporate boardrooms, not in a democratic fashion.

The multi-national corporations and investors are responsible for a lot of the war games, but the government tends to take the heat for it, when they are in reality puppets on a string. BUT some of the top goverment officials have huge investments in some of these corporations, such as Becthel, that stand to profit immensely from the reconstruction efforts.

It is extremely complicated and very difficult for the little guy to understand what's going on.

The military is mostly a machine or tool used to carry out the agendas of the powerful elite, hence are just pawns in the game. It is unfair to place the burden of blame entirely on the military, but they are the most obvious players for those being invaded. They see the tanks and the guns, not the guys in suits behind closed doors drinking their martinis and shuffling paper.

What is really at issue in the original post in this thread is the behaviour that results from the horrors of war.

[Guest idolsmasher]

You have no idea of who I am or what I am like! Don't be so quick to judge people you know practically nothing about!

Thousand upon thousand of brave American lives have been destroyed from the horrors of war

That's right, and that is one reason why it is reprehensible for the elites to sit in their corporate offices and state buildings misleading and manipulating the masses to support unjust wars where they send these people off as pawns in their political games to be destroyed in the horrors of hellish wars for their own political ambitions. It's not my fault so don't complain to me.

That one statement tells me everything that I need to know about you. I tell you that thousands of brave American lives have been destroyed from the horrors of war and your response is, "It's not my fault so don't complain to me."

I don't need to know anything more. Your cruel, cold-heartedness shines through brightly.

Goodbye.

Have it your way then if that's what you want, but it wouldn't hurt you to do a little research into the past actions of your government to discover that all is not as it seems on the surface. If you only knew!

Lamentations!

[Guest LadyC]

nor would it hurt you to do some research on history to see how generous america has been to other countries when they don't deserve a dime from us. this political machine brings about far more good world wide than any other country on earth. i bet your glass is always half empty, never half full.

[Guest yod]

I don't think America would have any problem with a self-governing Iraqi government, but when it comes to dividing the spoils, that's a different story.

ah but that is a mistake!

What do you think the real reason for going to UN before this war was? We were offering to share the spoils with anyone who wanted to help. Everyone agreed UNANIMOUSLY that Saddam would pay dire consequences if he didn't come clean by...what? 12 different deadlines???? Or was it 14????

I lost count at about 8.

Everyone was given a chance to be a part of rebuilding Iraq. Just like Europe and Japan after WWII, we would rather have a trading partner than an enemy. We don't want all the administrative costs of running a government, though.

We WILL give the country to the citizens when we are sure that they aren't extensions of global terrorism. Then we will leave them to interpret democracy whatever way they want and our companies will do business with their companies and everyone makes money and smiles.

England, australia, Romania, Micronesia, Italy, Spain, and all the other nations who help us will be given help. This is what France & Germany resent. It is diminishing their influence over these nations and they no longer have any place to sell their chemicals for nerve gas and other former staples of Iraqi life.

You have to understand that it's the corporate business executives and elites that stand to profit the most from this war, and their business dealings tend to be done in corporate boardrooms

Money has always made the world go around...and the poor you have with you always. Complaining will never change that.

Adapt.

[Guest yod]

Just ask LadyC or Yod --- they'll tell ya that they take about 1/2 what I say and toss it out with the bathwater 

that's not true with me!?

I value your perspective...even when I think it's wrong it is still a perspective that I want to understand.

You are intellectually honest and I respect that greatly.

Even if you do think you are a dern yellow-belly democrat, there is still hope for your "salvation"

how do you like Dennis Miller waking up to smell the coffee???

Can't wait to see his new show.

[OneAccord]

You have to understand that it's the corporate business executives and elites that stand to profit the most from this war, and their business dealings tend to be done in corporate boardrooms

Money has always made the world go around...and the poor you have with you always. Complaining will never change that.

Adapt.

You mean, mutate or die???

What do you think the real reason for going to UN before this war was? We were offering to share the spoils with anyone who wanted to help.

Aha! Are you confessing here that we went in after the spoils? We knew even before we went in there that there were spoils to be had, eh? And of course we'll share.....if________ (fill in the blank)

[Guest LadyC]

Eii Yi Yi! Me thinks you give me WAY too much credit. My opinions on the media isn't likely to influence anyone's own.  Just ask LadyC or Yod --- they'll tell ya that they take about 1/2 what I say and toss it out with the bathwater   

only half? :baa: :LOL: :LOL: :LOL:

just kidding! actually, i only throw out about half of your political views. we usually see eye to eye on everything else!

[Guest idolsmasher]

nor would it hurt you to do some research on history to see how generous america has been to other countries when they don't deserve a dime from us. this political machine brings about far more good world wide than any other country on earth. i bet your glass is always half empty, never half full.

Oh brother!

More lamentations!

nor would it hurt you to do some research on history to see how generous america has been to other countries when they don't deserve a dime from us.

Whatever good America has done does not provide an excuse and cover for the evil she has done and for which she is accountable before God. Since you seem to think you know well enough America's good points, it would be equally eye opening for you to make a study of the evil she has done if you are brave enough to consider it. Maybe you don't want to know?

We WILL give the country to the citizens when we are sure that they aren't extensions of global terrorism. Then we will leave them to interpret democracy whatever way they want and our companies will do business with their companies and everyone makes money and smiles.

That's one way to look at it but in reality it is American rule by proxy, a client state that has to bow to the will of the central government in Washington.

This is what France & Germany resent. It is diminishing their influence over these nations and they no longer have any place to sell their chemicals for nerve gas and other former staples of Iraqi life.

Why do you think that report to the UN way back about Iraq was seized by the US and many pages omitted before being distributed to the other UN members. What does America have to hide? Could it be that American sales of weapons and chemicals and other of their nefarious deeds during the years Saddam was their bosom buddy would have been revealed? America is certainly not innocent on this count so I find it odd you would point the finger at France and Germany and not your own goernment as well.

Adapt.

I think she has by voicing her opposition. What you really mean is conform and become a convert to Mammon.

What do you think the real reason for going to UN before this war was? We were offering to share the spoils with anyone who wanted to help.

Exactly, and the major spoil is two letters removed, oil!

[Guest LadyC]

Whatever good America has done does not provide an excuse and cover for the evil she has done and for which she is accountable before God. Since you seem to think you know well enough America's good points, it would be equally eye opening for you to make a study of the evil she has done if you are brave enough to consider it. Maybe you don't want to know?

i'm well aware that this country has done evil deeds. but this war is not evil. the man who ruled over iraq WAS evil. yes, some innocent blood has been shed, but far more innocent blood has been spared as a result of this war. maybe you think it isn't worth the cost. but have you asked any of the iraqi citizens how they felt about it?

before the war was launched, many americans were going over to act as human shields. i "met" one of these human shields on another message board once. she said while she was taking her place in front of a percieved target, an iraqi woman came up to her and asked her why she was trying to hurt her people. the american told her she wasn't, she was trying to prevent innocent lives from being lost at the hands of our military. the iraqi proceeded to emphatically set her straight, telling her that if some innocent lives must be lost, it was far better than living in constant fear of being raped, tortured, or murdered at the hands of that mad man. the iraqi woman went into such elaborate details that the american woman left her post and caught the first flight home to america, in tears for the despair those people felt over there.

you'd think in all your compassion, you could have a little for those who are grateful that they are free of tyranny.

[Guest LadyC]

by the way, if our main objective for this war was their oil, then why aren't we over their drilling it? and why on earth are we offering to help rebuild their country? and why on earth are we allowing other countries to have a part in the "spoils" of war?