How do you become a pastor?

[AnotherTraveler]

How to get a headache.

Problem, car is running roughly. Solution, change the oil, plugs, and filters. Simplify answer, fix the car.

Meditate on answer....fix the car is like build a car...Ford made factory to build cars...build factory...disqualify all cars not produced in MY factory.

The leap from teach others to seminary is far larger than my example.

[Floatingaxe]

even Paul had to be anointed by a man.

NO ONE is ever anointed by a man!

[CaritateDei]

even Paul had to be anointed by a man.

NO ONE is ever anointed by a man!

God anointed him through the man. Ananias? Ring a bell?

[Floatingaxe]

even Paul had to be anointed by a man.

NO ONE is ever anointed by a man!

God anointed him through the man. Ananias? Ring a bell?

Of course. GOD does the anointing.

What was wrong with Matthias?

[Kansasdad]

Hey, EricH! You'll be waiting an eternity for that one!

Is 19 minutes an eternity?

I'm still waiting for any definitive scripture...

Then you are not reading my post. Unless you are choosing to just ignore the example scripture gives us for how to become a pastor. I guess then some scripture you can just choose to ignore.

[Floatingaxe]

2 Timothy 2:2...

You have heard me teach things that have been confirmed by many reliable witnesses. Now teach these truths to other trustworthy people who will be able to pass them on to others.

This is a command that we carry on today. It is called discipleship, building up the body by raising up leaders within it. As Christians we are all leaders.

[CaritateDei]

2 Timothy 2:2...

You have heard me teach things that have been confirmed by many reliable witnesses. Now teach these truths to other trustworthy people who will be able to pass them on to others.

This is a command that we carry on today. It is called discipleship, building up the body by raising up leaders within it. As Christians we are all leaders.

Matthew 18:18, and the way Paul chose other leaders, and the way it is chosen in Acts, and the way that Ananias, an apostolic disciple, appointed others.

2 Timothy 2:2 can be used for overseers and for a commission to all of us.

The problem is, when we ask for a single book, chapter, or verse to define our entire faith, we miss the point. There are a lot more verses in the Bible from which we should derive our faith. The entire Bible is the Word of God.

The Apostles chose Matthias. Paul chose Barnabas and Silas, Timothy, and others. They were the overseers. He also suggests talks of the qualifications for the overseer. God anointed them all.

Matthew 18:18 tell us that what the Apostles say is law above and below. If we don't follow, then we're going against the law above.

[Floatingaxe]

2 Timothy 2:2...

You have heard me teach things that have been confirmed by many reliable witnesses. Now teach these truths to other trustworthy people who will be able to pass them on to others.

This is a command that we carry on today. It is called discipleship, building up the body by raising up leaders within it. As Christians we are all leaders.

Matthew 18:18, and the way Paul chose other leaders, and the way it is chosen in Acts, and the way that Ananias, an apostolic disciple, appointed others.

2 Timothy 2:2 can be used for overseers and for a commission to all of us.

The problem is, when we ask for a single book, chapter, or verse to define our entire faith, we miss the point. There are a lot more verses in the Bible from which we should derive our faith. The entire Bible is the Word of God.

The Apostles chose Matthias. Paul chose Barnabas and Silas, Timothy, and others. They were the overseers. He also suggests talks of the qualifications for the overseer. God anointed them all.

Matthew 18:18 tell us that what the Apostles say is law above and below. If we don't follow, then we're going against the law above.

That scripture talks about all of us, not just the apostles. We are the Royal Priesthood, remember?

Spiritually, we are ALL called to pastor. Some are spiritually gifted to be so, but we are all to be doing the job of pastoring every day of our lives.

[EricH]

Hey, EricH! You'll be waiting an eternity for that one!

Is 19 minutes an eternity?

I'm still waiting for any definitive scripture...

Then you are not reading my post. Unless you are choosing to just ignore the example scripture gives us for how to become a pastor. I guess then some scripture you can just choose to ignore.

No, you have ignored the exact nature of the request. I am waiting for a scripture that is prescriptive in nature. Prescriptive means that it is stated in the form of a command. All you have provided is an example from Acts that was descriptive. A prescriptive text would be in the imperative tense. Still waiting

[EricH]

Very good, more examples where the Bible shows us that the pastors of the church from its beginning were taught by the Apostles. Further these men then taught others, and so on. The pastors of the church were never just anyone who claimed to have inspiration or knowledge. They were appointed and taught by the church fathers before them. We see the Apostles laying on of hands to appoint such men. Can your pastor trace his/her teaching back to the Apostles. Is there any other formula prescribed by the Bible. All other methods are traditions of men.

thats why Im a believer of seminary schools.

Paul was trying to organize, preach, and teach the good news.

He did this without a bible, on foot under a time constraint.

If he would of lived another 200 years he may be would of opened one.... 3xR0c|<stAr

How does an institution become a seminary school. Who are the teachers. Would not those same teachers also need to be able to trace their teaching back to the Apostles. Who taught the teachers?

If the seminary school does not have its roots in the progression described from the Bible would this not be a tradition established by man?

I think it would be important to know a little about the seminary. What is its history?

No, the teachers would need to be able to demonstrate that they know the word of God which was handed down to us thru the Apostles directly from God himself

Show me scripture that tells us this or demonstrates this..Otherwise it is just your opinion, and a tradition created by man. I would rather follow a tradition started by the Apostles who were indwelled by the Holy Spirit. You can follow whatever example you want, I will choose to follow the example given to us by the Apostles through scripture.

God Bless,

K.D.

So, do you choose your overseers by lot then?

Being that Kansasdad does not claim to be an apostle, he does not.

You seem to be letting on that the only thing the apostles did was cast lots to see which apostle would be chosen. Barsabbas and Matthias were the top two candidates, and after much prayer, the Apostles asked for a sign. They threw the lots to find the sign on which person would be given the Apostolic seal of approval from the almighty. I'm sure we do not do this anymore, but it sounds like you are criticizing the Apostles method of asking God for a sign. I do not believe that lots was the important thing here, but the fact that these Apostles of God were getting together in prayer and devotion in order to ask God above which should be the proper choice.

If they used lots, a spinner, a witchdoctor's watering stick...it is safe to believe that these Apostles were the ones to choose this man...and were the only ones guided by the spirit enough to appoint that overseer.

You don't seem to have grasped the point here.

Those who argue for a requirement of apostilic succession, do so on the basis of historical descriptions of what the Apostles did in the Acts narrative. They can provide no prescriptive texts that list this as a requirement. If they are using historical texts that are descriptive to develop a doctrine of who can lead, they must be consistent in this approach. The passage in Acts that describes the way the Apostles chose Judas' successor list several considerations and a methodology. If one is going to be consistent, they cannot pick and choose through which they will accept as normative. So, it one is going to use the choosing of Judas successor as a model (and normative for the church today) of how one selects leadership, they must include the casting of lots as part of the requirement, or state a good reason for not doing so from the text.

The guiding principle in good hermeneutics for discovering what is normative is only develop doctrine from historical texts, when one can find a supporting command from hortatory documents.

No one is criticizing what the apostles did. We are questioning if it was intended to be normative for the church for all time. So, still waiting for a passage that lists apostolic succession as an ongoing requirement for leadership.

Again, though...you miss the point. Paul, an apostle, is the one who has the prescriptive text of the overseers. No one but him, and obviously, through the descriptions of the process by which the apostles chose, could really make those same conclusions of those qualifications. Matthew 18: 18 also tells us that it is the Apostles who truly have that authority to do so, given them by God.

There is no stretching here.

You really have not made any argument of substance here. I agree that Paul (an apostle) was the one who laid out the prescriptive text). Matthew 18:18 simply describes a role for the 12 apostles. There is no discussion of that role being handed down in a chain.

The bottom line is that the only prescriptive texts we have do not indicate apostolic succession as being a requirement. We haver no texts that indicate that any special role the apostles had, was to be handed down to others.

So, we are wtill waiting for definitve prescriptive texts that support your contentions