America and sin

[Gerioke]

What does scripture say about those who know the Lord but turn their backs, compared to those who never knew the lord?

Is that germane to this topic?

Isn't Germane one of the Jacksons?

It ties in with my first post.

When Israel turned their backs on God and followed pagan dieties, they met with God's judgement.

Romans 3

9 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;

However

2 Peter 2

21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them.

[Marnie]

What does scripture say about those who know the Lord but turn their backs, compared to those who never knew the lord?

Is that germane to this topic?

Isn't Germane one of the Jacksons?

It ties in with my first post.

When Israel turned their backs on God and followed pagan dieties, they met with God's judgement.

Romans 3

9 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;

However

2 Peter 2

21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them.

lol OK. But then there was the time Abraham pleaded with G-d to spare Sodom for the sake of but 20 righteous people, so there is a Biblical precedent for the putting off a judgment for the sake of the righteous. Anyway, without Christ, individuals or nations will be judged period.

[ayin jade]

I guess this topic is for Americans only, but I voted anyway.

The question is for everyone. I did not mean for it to be limited to americans.

Good responses so far. Thoughtful and without rancor. Please keep posting on this topic.

[nebula]

The Scriptures say that judgment begins with the house of God.

Now we can argue about America being a "Christian nation" - at least at one time it was more so than it is now. If judgment falls on the world, I wouldn't be surprised if America got hit first for this reason.

[Gerioke]

The Scriptures say that judgment begins with the house of God.

Now we can argue about America being a "Christian nation" - at least at one time it was more so than it is now. If judgment falls on the world, I wouldn't be surprised if America got hit first for this reason.

That's pretty much what I was trying to say.

[Marnie]

The Scriptures say that judgment begins with the house of God.

Now we can argue about America being a "Christian nation" - at least at one time it was more so than it is now. If judgment falls on the world, I wouldn't be surprised if America got hit first for this reason.

Yeah, but Neb, America is hardly the house of G-d! The Church worldwide is the house of G-d. Not to be argumentative, but let's not confuse what Peter is saying with what Jade was asking.

The complete text is 1 Peter 4:16-18--

However, if you suffer as a Christian, do not be ashamed, but praise God that you bear that name. For it is time for judgment to begin with the family of God; and if it begins with us, what will the outcome be for those who do not obey the gospel of God? And,

"If it is hard for the righteous to be saved,

what will become of the ungodly and the sinner?"

[Smalcald]

But really when you think of it what does a "sinful" nation even mean. What I mean by that is that we are a country with 1/3 of a billion people spread across thousands and thousands of square miles and broken into distinct states and municipalities. So what does it mean to aggregate such a huge and diverse place? What does a small town in say Iowa or Texas have in common with Los Angeles or Las Vegas?

There is huge diversity within the US so making aggregate comparisons is hard particularly about things like sin. I mean I know I have done it on this board and I throw numbers around, but really I don't think it is valid in many respects. I live in a community of 5000 people; it is the county seat the biggest place in a rather large county. Our crime rate is almost zero, most people don't lock their homes (I do but I am a security nut). We have some Domestic Violence, some drunken instances, a minor drug problem, but really on the whole things are good. We only have one bar, no porn or strip joints, and you can't get an abortion in this county. So comparing my community (and thousands of other communities around the nation) with some city makes these kinds of statistics meaningless.

This is my problem with some sort of

[dakota190]

i couldn't fit my answers into the boundaries of the poll. so i just wanted to say.

i don't see where the U.S. is the MOST sinful, but it seems living here that we have become the most blatant and offensive. in many countries people with deviate desires and ways of life still hide and try to control their exposure to the light of the knowledge of the world.

it seems in America, the society that we see the most often portrayed on the news and in movies and lifestyles held up before our kids by movie and music stars (???) is so hedonistic that the more deviant and vile the activity the people desire the more they are driven to shove it in our faces and dare us to say anything about it.

are we more sinful? i doubt it. is our society more wretched in its deviancy? i believe so. do we deserve to be punished more than other nations? sometimes i think so, because we have fallen much faster from a greater height with little fight.

HOWEVER, we don't seem as base as some countries in other ways, so we may be no more deserving of punishment for our sins than they, but we definitely do not deserve a free pass.

in responding to the original questions my reply may seem alittle out of context with where you have taken the discussion, but i wanted to add this.

[Openly Curious]

'Ayin Jade'

On a thread that deserved to be closed, someone cast doom and gloom on the US for its sin. I would like to know what people think. Is the US any more or less sinful than any other nation? Is the US any more or less deserving of judgment than any other nation? Why?

I do not see the U.S. as any different in the way of sin goes as I think all nations have sin in their midst in one form or another. I think some countries have more heathenistic practices more openly in their idol worship like in India they serve the monkey god and have a big statue of a monkey they bow down to in the open and so forth like that. We here in America have not gotten that bad yet as we still are a nation that believes in God even though we have sin in our midst. As far as the judgment goes the Bible is plain that it will come upon the wicked during the end-times according to the divine plan of God so in that regards the wicked are the ones who will get what the Lord says and determines is right for them during that time period as judgment has been recorded to come upon the whole earth not just one nation above another but all will be equally judged. In my opinion the U.S. is still the most righteous nation on the face of the earth. And a world who will eventually keep denying the Lord Jesus Christ will one day run out of time and the things foretold will become reality in the entire world as all will be fullfilled in the end-times but until then we all must keep the faith.

I do not see the US as any more sinful and certainly not less sinful than other nations. We may have different sins than other nations, but I dont see them as better or worse than the sins of other nations. We deserve judgment just as much as other nations

ye said it well and I agree

OC

[Guest]

Rejoice evermore. Pray without ceasing. In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.

1 Thessalonians 5:16-18