Immigration Bill a piece of *Garbage*

[apothanein kerdos]

Can someone explain what is different now from what it was like at the turn of the century, in terms of how an immigrant enters this country? Why do so many enter illegally, rather than legally?

All 4 of my grandparents were legal aliens, who came thru Ellis Island. If it was good enough for them......

I'm admitting my stupidity here. Why don't they just do it legally? I know several Latinos, who are here legally, that are disgusted with the illegal alien problem because it reflects on them.

Peace,

Fiosh

Population caps.

At Ellis island, if you weren't a criminal or diseased, you were allowed into this country (for the most part).

Now, you have to pay thousands of dollars, wait on a list (up to 10 years), and fight just to get a worker visa into the US (which could take 2-3 years).

Basically, it's EXTREMELY hard for the lower end workers to get into the US. Much harder than it was at the turn of the century.

[ted]

Is it possible that Mr Bush believes that we NEED these extra workers to pay in to social security so that there will be enough money for the baby boomers?

Just a thought.

Bingo- with one exception:

It's not Bush that needs them, it's the whole country that needs them. We've put ourselves in a nasty hole with this SS stuff, and now we need to bring people in to make sure there's enough to draw from in the coming years.

t.

I'm not so sure. Today a caller to the Rush show suggested that those illegals using fake SS numbers don't pay into the system. Since the gov't doesn't recognize the number, they don't collect the money. The employers keep it. Not sure how true that is.

Also, the drain put on our system---Welfare, healthcare, education---many very well outweigh any benefit to the SS system.

Peace,

Fiosh

All those things are true enough, but the plan is to give instant recognition to some 20 million illegals, or so. Everyone will hem and haw for a while, and they'll pretend like that's not their plan, but it is. It may even happen in increments, but it will happen eventually.

If the Gov't can get them legal, then you have a huge number of people suddenly paying into the system as new citizens. All other considerations are secondary to that, including security.

t.

[other one]

Hummmm, 20 million...... about the same number of babies we've killed in the past years.

[Marnie]

Can someone explain what is different now from what it was like at the turn of the century, in terms of how an immigrant enters this country? Why do so many enter illegally, rather than legally?

All 4 of my grandparents were legal aliens, who came thru Ellis Island. If it was good enough for them......

I'm admitting my stupidity here. Why don't they just do it legally? I know several Latinos, who are here legally, that are disgusted with the illegal alien problem because it reflects on them.

Peace,

Fiosh

Population caps.

At Ellis island, if you weren't a criminal or diseased, you were allowed into this country (for the most part).

Now, you have to pay thousands of dollars, wait on a list (up to 10 years), and fight just to get a worker visa into the US (which could take 2-3 years).

Basically, it's EXTREMELY hard for the lower end workers to get into the US. Much harder than it was at the turn of the century.

Also at Ellis Island, we NEEDED immigrants for work. We don't today, and that's one reason why it takes a while. And it should.

As to the case of my two wranglers; they are from Mexico, naturally, and have been paying into the system for years before they came to work for me. They are now in the immigration system and it will take less than three years to get the Green Card. After that, I think it's anytime after a year and half from the date the Green Card was issued, they can apply to write the citizenship test. The do NOT have to do this; the Card renews every 10 years. Total estimated cost: without a lawyer, about $4,000 in total for the Green Card, including all Homeland Security fees, local fees, etc. Cost to write the test if they so desire, about $400.00. Now, I hired a lawyer for these guys because it is complicated and you have to meet certain deadlines and so on and I just don't have the time for all that. And my guys can't read English so well, so the lawyer comes in handy.

It is hard for "low end workers," that's why we don't usually accept "low end workers" as immigrants. The forms are very clear, we want people of higher education and people with specific training. Those who have an easy time entering this country are doctors, ministers, professionals with certain higher education and certifications. People who generally dont stand a chance would include plumbers, secretaries, waitresses. And, unfortunately, wranglers. But, we're getting it done for Jose and his brother.

[kat8585]

Is it possible that Mr Bush believes that we NEED these extra workers to pay in to social security so that there will be enough money for the baby boomers?

Just a thought.

Not if we'd just privatize it!

We'll hve to get as whole new crew of people in Washington for that to happen. And that won't happen if this bill gets passed as it is. It will destroy the Republican party, for good, probably.

[kat8585]

Is it possible that Mr Bush believes that we NEED these extra workers to pay in to social security so that there will be enough money for the baby boomers?

Just a thought.

Bingo- with one exception:

It's not Bush that needs them, it's the whole country that needs them. We've put ourselves in a nasty hole with this SS stuff, and now we need to bring people in to make sure there's enough to draw from in the coming years.

t.

But that's just it. So many aren't paying into SS, or paying taxes, and it's going to bankrupt us. The ones who are pay $1 in taxes for every $3 they get in services, that we can't get, by the way, but we are paying for, for them. All they are doing is draining the system, taking our jobs, and flouting our laws and we're not only letting them, we're encouraging and rewarding them.

Fiosh and Marnie, you are right.

[apothanein kerdos]

Is it possible that Mr Bush believes that we NEED these extra workers to pay in to social security so that there will be enough money for the baby boomers?

Just a thought.

Bingo- with one exception:

It's not Bush that needs them, it's the whole country that needs them. We've put ourselves in a nasty hole with this SS stuff, and now we need to bring people in to make sure there's enough to draw from in the coming years.

t.

But that's just it. So many aren't paying into SS, or paying taxes, and it's going to bankrupt us. The ones who are pay $1 in taxes for every $3 they get in services, that we can't get, by the way, but we are paying for, for them. All they are doing is draining the system, taking our jobs, and flouting our laws and we're not only letting them, we're encouraging and rewarding them.

Fiosh and Marnie, you are right.

How many times am I going to have to show you that about 60% pay taxes, with 68% putting money into social security?

[kat8585]

Is it possible that Mr Bush believes that we NEED these extra workers to pay in to social security so that there will be enough money for the baby boomers?

Just a thought.

Bingo- with one exception:

It's not Bush that needs them, it's the whole country that needs them. We've put ourselves in a nasty hole with this SS stuff, and now we need to bring people in to make sure there's enough to draw from in the coming years.

t.

But that's just it. So many aren't paying into SS, or paying taxes, and it's going to bankrupt us. The ones who are pay $1 in taxes for every $3 they get in services, that we can't get, by the way, but we are paying for, for them. All they are doing is draining the system, taking our jobs, and flouting our laws and we're not only letting them, we're encouraging and rewarding them.

Fiosh and Marnie, you are right.

How many times am I going to have to show you that about 60% pay taxes, with 68% putting money into social security?

Even if it were true, does that make it right? I don't really care if it's true or not, it still isn't right, and this bill would still bankrupt us.

[apothanein kerdos]

Is it possible that Mr Bush believes that we NEED these extra workers to pay in to social security so that there will be enough money for the baby boomers?

Just a thought.

Bingo- with one exception:

It's not Bush that needs them, it's the whole country that needs them. We've put ourselves in a nasty hole with this SS stuff, and now we need to bring people in to make sure there's enough to draw from in the coming years.

t.

But that's just it. So many aren't paying into SS, or paying taxes, and it's going to bankrupt us. The ones who are pay $1 in taxes for every $3 they get in services, that we can't get, by the way, but we are paying for, for them. All they are doing is draining the system, taking our jobs, and flouting our laws and we're not only letting them, we're encouraging and rewarding them.

Fiosh and Marnie, you are right.

How many times am I going to have to show you that about 60% pay taxes, with 68% putting money into social security?

Even if it were true, does that make it right? I don't really care if it's true or not, it still isn't right, and this bill would still bankrupt us.

Right or not, it shows that one of the reasons you hold up against immigrants simply isn't true and is based on fear and not facts.

I have no problem with people being against something, so long as their reason is logical, factual, and well thought out.

[kat8585]

Right or not, it shows that one of the reasons you hold up against immigrants simply isn't true and is based on fear and not facts.

I have no problem with people being against something, so long as their reason is logical, factual, and well thought out.

Well, if you don't think my opinion is, I don't know what to tell you. Part of my opinion is based on the fact that illegal is illegal. What part of that is not logical, factual, or well thought out?

You need to listen to the posts in my other thread, Former A. G. Ed Meese. Watch his video and listen to the one by Mark Levin on immigration.