Invitation to atheists

[Ishamael]

Among my odd jobs, I`ve worked as translator.

As for my definition...

This is the definition I use.

For me, truth is a part of logic mathematics.

If you are seeking to discuss infosphere... As I said, I disagree with assertion, that it is rigid set of information. It is a packet of probabilities.

Edited June 19, 2007 by Ishamael

[methinkshe]

Among my odd jobs, I`ve worked as translator.

As for my definition...

This is the definition I use.

For me, truth is a part of logic mathematics.

If you are seeking to discuss infosphere... As I said, I disagree with assertion, that it is rigid set of information. It is a packet of probabilities.

You still need to take one step further backwards and examine what truth is as a concept. We MUST start at the beginning, not halfway through.

I cannot put it any more clearly than this:

Do you exist?

Yes.

Therefore that is truth.

Do you act, i.e. think or move?

Yes.

Then that is truth.

No more, no less. We exist, we act, and because we are here existing and acting, that is undeniable and is therefore factual, or truth.

Ruth

[Ishamael]

Not that fast.

Your examples are truth only within this particular period of time.

But after your death or before your birth, your statements were lie, regarding you.

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When you define it like this, it is entirely same, as my definition that "truth is a logical statement, which is correct at this particular moment of time".

[methinkshe]

Not that fast.

Your examples are truth only within this particular period of time.

But after your death or before your birth, your statements were lie, regarding you.

---

When you define it like this, it is entirely same, as my definition that "truth is a logical statement, which is correct at this particular moment of time".

No. In it's prime form, truth describes actual existence, and actual events that have occurred.

Ruth

[methinkshe]

The most adequate comprehension of reality that man's mind and reason make accessible to him. Man is fallible and can never become omniscient or absolutely certain that what he considers as certain truth is not error. The criterion of truth is that it works even if nobody is prepared to acknowledge it.

<www.mises.org/easier/T.asp>

I am not asking what anyone considers to be the truth, only how we can define what truth is.

Well, if you have humans in the equation, truth is limited by what we can comprehend, and since our comprehension (and understanding) is individually variable, I don't think we can get at absolute truth. In science, we actually refer to our sum total of what is known (proven) and will be known as only a closer and closer approximation of the truth.

No, truth is not limited by perception or comprehension. If you tell me you have just jumped from an aeroplane without a parachute and survived to tell the tale, the truth is not limited by my perception that you are lying if, indeed, you managed the jump and had a happy landing! Truth is a 100% accuarte record of existence (you) and events (jumped and survived!) Truth describes what IS and what HAPPENS, no more, no less. We are not yet speaking of how truth is, or can be known, only defining what truth is as a concept.

Ruth

[Ishamael]

You seem to be missing one crucial point.

Logical statement defining event that already occured is always true at any point of time after the event, including current.

Compare:

"I have cut on my finger." - this might be true today, when it had happened, but it won`t be true in a week, when the cut will heal.

"I had cut on my finger." - this statement is truth at any point of time after the cutting occured.

[methinkshe]

You seem to be missing one crucial point.

Logical statement defining event that already occured is always true at any point of time after the event, including current.

Compare:

"I have cut on my finger." - this might be true today, when it had happened, but it won`t be true in a week, when the cut will heal.

"I had cut on my finger." - this statement is truth at any point of time after the cutting occured.

Again you are attempting to define A truth instead of addressing what "truth" is.

Of course it won't be true in a week that you have a cut finger once it has healed. But we are not addressing examples of truth, only trying to agree on a definition for truth.

Ruth

[Ishamael]

For the last time, I reiterate.

Truth - logical statement, that is correct at this particular point of time.

___

If you have better definition, go ahead, and offer it. Your previous one was to ambigous to use.

[methinkshe]

Ishmael,

I have to log off, right now, so if I don't reply to any subsequent posts of yours for a good few hours, it is not because I am ducking the issue. I'll be back tomorrow, God willing.

Ruth

[Ishamael]

Relax.

Real life is more important then internet debate. Of course it can wait.