Adam's Responsibility?

[Guest Biblicist]

16"You (hebrew singular) are free to eat from any tree in the garden; 17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die."

We're looking at creation to see if Adam had a spiritual responsibility over Eve. We know that he wasn't responsible for telling her, 'God told ME not to eat of the tree.' He didn't then have any authority to tell her God's command since it was given TO HIM ALONE.

*Caution: sarcasim ahead*

By this interpretation, since Adam was given the command alone and it was not shared with Eve, then we could reasonably deduce that he was the only one who was forbidden from eating of the tree.

Since it is not recorded anywhere that Adam told Eve, and it's not recorded anywhere that God told Eve, we could easily assume that no one told Eve, she just assumed. . . Maybe, being the genius that she was, she figured it out all by her self.

Why give man any responsibility over his wife? He had enough responsibility. After all, he had to take care of the garden, he had to name all the animals, he even had to name Eve. Goodness, the most we can expect of him after a hard days work is to sit in his easy chair and enjoy all his hard labor with a cold drink and his house slippers. What was Eve doing all day, sitting on the sofa eating bon bon's? She can figure out these things all by her self. She's a smart lady. Why she doesn't even need a man, she was created for HIS benefit not the other way around.

[firehill]

By this interpretation, since Adam was given the command alone and it was not shared with Eve, then we could reasonably deduce that he was the only one who was forbidden from eating of the tree.

We cannot deduce that Adam was the only one forbidden from eating of the tree because 1) in 1:29 they are told what they could eat (which encompasses what they couldn't) and also because Eve said that God told THEM the prohibition. You just want to continue to discredit Eve's testimony when you cannot even answer to the evidence. What the bible provides has got to count for something.

Since it is not recorded anywhere that Adam told Eve, and it's not recorded anywhere that God told Eve, we could easily assume that no one told Eve, she just assumed. . . Maybe, being the genius that she was, she figured it out all by her self.

God told Eve the command and here is why:

1) Eve quoted God on the prohibition.

2) There is evidence that God spoke to them both about the prohibition because it is encompassed in what they could eat, every tree that has fruit with seed in it.

3) There is evidence that God gave his prohibition more than once to Adam in different form therefore God could have given it to Eve in different form also since we know that he spoke to them both about what they could eat which encompassed what they could not eat.

4) Eve didn't speak to what God told Adam, no, because she quoted what God told THEM.

Now what you need to do is answer the above. That's the EVIDENCE.

he even had to name Eve.

He did that after the fall because he was at that point ruilng over her as God not a false prophet said would happen!

Why she doesn't even need a man, she was created for HIS benefit not the other way around.

Yes, she was created to alleviate his ALONESS. Adam needed her.

Your sarcasim wasn't that bad.

[OopsMartin]

K-plunk. Brick one:

16"You (hebrew singular) are free to eat from any tree in the garden; 17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die."

We're looking at creation to see if Adam had a spiritual responsibility over Eve. We know that he wasn't responsible for telling her, 'God told ME not to eat of the tree.' He didn't then have any authority to tell her God's command since it was given TO HIM ALONE.

What's another brick in the foundational teachings of Genesis? Maybe we wanna look at WHY the woman was created? Was she created to be led? Was she created to be under Adam's authority? What do the scriptures say? We have to begin with what the scriptures say and work from there.

K-plunk:

18 The LORD God said, "It is not good for the man to be alone. I will make a helper suitable for him."

yes, good bricks.

Ezer (azar) is the Hebrew word translated "help". Unlike our word help it's range of meanings differ just a bit as it does not mean diminuitive assistant to someone else who is in charge, which our word CAN mean. This word help as a noun (as used in Gen. of Eve) is only used approximately 21 times in the O.T. The verb occurs about 80 times.

Hebrew has other words that also mean a different sort of help; Approximately 30. There is even a specific word to cry out "help" so that hearers know you are in danger. Some examples of ezer:

Deut. 33:29

29 Happy are you, O Israel!

Who is like you, a people saved by the LORD, The shield of your help (EZER) And the sword of your majesty! Your enemies shall submit to you, And you shall tread down their high places."

Psalm 20:1-2

To the Chief Musician.

A Psalm of David.

1 May the LORD answer you in the day of trouble; May the name of the God of Jacob defend you; 2 May He send you help (EZER) from the sanctuary, And strengthen you out of Zion;

Psalm 33:20-21

20 Our soul waits for the LORD;

He is our help (EZER) and our shield.

21 For our heart shall rejoice in Him, Because we have trusted in His holy name.

Psalm 70:5

5 But I am poor and needy; Make haste to me, O God! You are my help (EZER) and my deliverer; O LORD, do not delay.

Deut. 33:26-27

26 "There is no one like the God of Jeshurun, Who rides the heavens to help (EZER) you, And in His excellency on the clouds.

27 The eternal God is your refuge, And underneath are the everlasting arms; He will thrust out the enemy from before you, And will say, 'Destroy!'

Exodus 18:4

4 and the name of the other was Eliemzer (for he said, "The God of my father was my help (EZER), and delivered me from the sword of Pharaoh");

Hosea 13:9

9 " O Israel, you are destroyed,

But your help (EZER) is from Me.

The kind of help referenced with ezer is almost always help from God. It is strong delivering and rescuing help. Sometimes it is an army.

Its general meanings range from help, rescue, support, succor. It is most often used in reference to divine intervention to assist. Sometimes the help is military, strong rescuing help.

So when God declares to Adam that He is going to provide Adam with an Ezer, the implication is one of rescuing and strength. What is it that God is going to send rescuing help for?

"It is not good for the human to be alone."

BTW when I say "the human", I am using that because that is exactly what the Hebrew is saying. The name that God gave them both was merely "human" not a proper name as we think of it.

So, the picture we get thus far is that God tells the man that it isn't good to be alone; and that God would form a strong help for his aloneness. But God does not do this until after the man has observed and identified every creature and not found any that was a strong help comparable (fit, equal to) to himself. When the man gets it and sees what alone means, then is when God puts the man to sleep and performs his miraculous surgery, taking a piece of flesh and bone from his side and molding it into a female. This female is part of him because she was taken from him thus equal to and fit, comparable to; yet different on her own because she was molded into an opposite gender.

[tsth]

So are you going to imply that the gender distinction in the passages of the Word of God are in vain?

What was the point of the distinction in the following?

2 Cor. 11:3 But I am afraid that just as Eve was deceived by the serpent's cunning, your minds may somehow be led astray from your sincere and pure devotion to Christ.

1Ti 2:14 And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.

In His Truth,

Suzanne

[OopsMartin]

So are you going to imply that the gender distinction in the passages of the Word of God are in vain?

Suzanne

I have absolutely no idea what you mean. I would have absolutely no reason to say that. Women are awesome. They are men's strong help from vanity and going nutsy.

Well, except when they ask questions like that.

[tsth]

You left out the most important part of my post OopsM.

So are you going to imply that the gender distinction in the passages of the Word of God are in vain?

What was the point of the distinction in the following?

2 Cor. 11:3 But I am afraid that just as Eve was deceived by the serpent's cunning, your minds may somehow be led astray from your sincere and pure devotion to Christ.

1Ti 2:14 And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.

In His Truth,

Suzanne

[OopsMartin]

You left out the most important part of my post OopsM.

So are you going to imply that the gender distinction in the passages of the Word of God are in vain?

What was the point of the distinction in the following?

2 Cor. 11:3 But I am afraid that just as Eve was deceived by the serpent's cunning, your minds may somehow be led astray from your sincere and pure devotion to Christ.

1Ti 2:14 And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.

In His Truth,

Suzanne

Suzanne, if you had actually been reading this thread you would know that those issues have been addressed and quite sufficiently, several times. What exactly do you want to discuss that hasn't been discussed?

We all know Eve was deceived because the cleverest of all serpents engaged her in one on one conversation, and Eve in her naivite was drawn into his deception. We all know that Adam was not deceived and deliberately knowingly did that which he knew to be wrong. Because Adam deliberately sinned, he was the primary offender who led the whole human race into sin.

It has nothing to do with gender distinction. It has to do with the manner in which they disobeyed. One was deceived into sinning and the other deliberately sinned. What we learn from that is that no matter how we end up sinning, we are without excuse and all will suffer the consequences.

What is it you want to talk about.

[firehill]

So, the picture we get thus far is that God tells the man that it isn't good to be alone; and that God would form a strong help for his aloneness. But God does not do this until after the man has observed and identified every creature and not found any that was a strong help comparable (fit, equal to) to himself.

Exactly.

So are you going to imply that the gender distinction in the passages of the Word of God are in vain?

2:18 'The LORD God said, "It is not good for the man to be alone. I will make a helper suitable for him."

This verse is showing that since the woman was created to alleviate the man's ALONESS and God made her as a 'helper suitable for him', male-female distiction is NOT one of authority/subordination.

What was the point of the distinction in the following?

2 Cor. 11:3 But I am afraid that just as Eve was deceived by the serpent's cunning, your minds may somehow be led astray from your sincere and pure devotion to Christ.

1Ti 2:14 And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.

There is no FEMALE distinction tied to deception which you are trying to make BECAUSE 2 Co 11:3 which you have quoted is being applied to all of Paul's audience, male or female.

Regarding 1 Tim 2:14, Oops is right. It has already been explained how and why Eve fell into deception whereas Adam wasn't decieved.

[inhistime]

So, the picture we get thus far is that God tells the man that it isn't good to be alone; and that God would form a strong help for his aloneness. But God does not do this until after the man has observed and identified every creature and not found any that was a strong help comparable (fit, equal to) to himself.

Exactly.

So are you going to imply that the gender distinction in the passages of the Word of God are in vain?

2:18 'The LORD God said, "It is not good for the man to be alone. I will make a helper suitable for him."

This verse is showing that since the woman was created to alleviate the man's ALONESS and God made her as a 'helper suitable for him', male-female distiction is NOT one of authority/subordination.

What was the point of the distinction in the following?

2 Cor. 11:3 But I am afraid that just as Eve was deceived by the serpent's cunning, your minds may somehow be led astray from your sincere and pure devotion to Christ.

1Ti 2:14 And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.

There is no FEMALE distinction tied to deception which you are trying to make BECAUSE 2 Co 11:3 which you have quoted is being applied to all of Paul's audience, male or female.

Regarding 1 Tim 2:14, Oops is right. It has already been explained how and why Eve fell into deception whereas Adam wasn't decieved.

Well done!

[firehill]

While we're looking for 'Adam's responsibilty' a biblical foundation is starting to develope:

K-plunk:

2:7the LORD God formed the man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being.

Here we have God making the human.

K-plunk:

16 And the LORD God commanded the man, "You are free to eat from any tree in the garden; 17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die."

Here we have God commanding ONLY (see previous posts for the singular command's relevence) the man.

K-plunk:

18 The LORD God said, "It is not good for the man to be alone. I will make a helper suitable for him."

Here we have God purposing to create a helper suitable for him TO alieve his ALONESS, and equal to him. Adam CONFIRMS what God made her for in relation to him which was TO BE WITH him, not to be under him or ruled over:

K-plunk:

3:12 The man said, "The woman you put here with me"

K-plunk:

21 So the LORD God caused the man to fall into a deep sleep; and while he was sleeping, he took one of the man's ribs and closed up the place with flesh. 22 Then the LORD God made a woman from the rib he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man.

Here we have God having completed what He said he was going to do!

K-plunk:

27 So God created man in his own image,

in the image of God he created him;

male and female he created them.

28 God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground." 29 Then God said, "I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. 30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the ground