Spirit Baptism Vs. Water Baptism

[Guest sanctification]

I don't get it.

I understand the information you are sharing but I don't understand what the practices of people who it sounds like are lost have to do with worshiping God in the truth about baptism.

Who cares if people baptize in certain ways, even in an extreme polar reaction to the extreme mistakes of their religious inheritance? As long as it is biblical and as long as it is done with pure intentions in the heart, it counts for God.

I am just saying that I don't understand what you are trying to inform me about. Thanks stevehut...

[stevehut]

I understand the information you are sharing but I don't understand what the practices of people who it sounds like are lost have to do with worshiping God in the truth about baptism.

Like I said, just check out the books I listed. Some of the highlights, in various places:

Frequently, they baptize unbelievers, in the belief that the ceremony will have some mystical effect.

The water must be sanctified and "holy"

The minister and the candidate must wear special garments.

The officiant must recite a long, complicated verbatim prayer.

All kinds of pomp and pageantry are required.

Kinda hard to summarize with the full effect in this forum, but that's the general idea. Do all of these things really make a baptisn more valid? Does it make the person more "holy"?

I say no.

And to think that they do, is nothing short of idolatry. If you think baptism is valid in a vacuum of faith, you're dealing in a "magic potion"; almost borders on witchcraft, if you ask me.

[ray]

I don't understand the intial statement that started this forum.

I don't get that water and spirt baptism are different.

When I was baptized I was baptized only once for God the Father, God the son and God the Holy Spirt. So i see it all as one and don't understand the debate.

As I stated in another forum on Tongues, Why is that when those who claim to have this gift of Tounges must seem to boast about it and condem other to feeling bad because they don't speak in tounges. Don't condemm me lest you be judged.

When I say that my niece has been baptized it should not turn into an argumenet of what age she is. The Bible state only that you be able to confess with your own mouth. So it does not matter the age.

And as far as water and spirt my niece did all at once based on my understanding of the scriptures.

I don't see why everything has to turn into an arguement.

I would think when someone tells you wonderful news it is more Praise the Lord, Good job, awesome. Not, lets make a debate about this issues.

When you don't congradulate it sounds like you are condemming the baptism as worthless and that I or my niece will never make to heaven because we come to an understanding of the scriptures differently. Who are you to determine what is right and wrong and who made you God to condemm such a beutiful thing?

Sorry if I'm not in agreement with some of you on this issue. Before I say any more I'm just gonna stop here.

May the peace of the Lord Bless us all,

ray

[Guest sanctification]

stevehut,

thanks for the email explaining your point of view.

the rite can be given only by a minister who possesses genuine apostolic succession from Peter.  The building must be consecrated, and the water must be

consecrated.  (Certain bodies of water, such as the Jordan or Lourdes, are already

[Guest mcm42]

Your salvation or whatever is dependent upon men, isn't it? What if a man screwed up and didn't do it right? What if your heart wasn't pure? What if the minister's heart wasn't pure? Wouldn't that make your baptism invalid? Wouldn't that mean that you would have to redo it, in reality an endless number of times? Why? Because no matter how much we make the effort, we simply are not perfect. How could God use something imperfect to usher in the perfect? No, our salvation, reception of the Holy Spirit, or being washed clean from sin to be made ready for the reception of the Spirit, has to be done by God; the holy one, alone.

It has never been so well articulated...

Amen and Amen

:t:

[stevehut]

What if a man screwed up and didn't do it right? What if your heart wasn't pure? What if the minister's heart wasn't pure? Wouldn't that make your baptism invalid?

One word: Grace.

But just because God is generous with his grace, that doesn't mean we have no part to play. (Rom. 6:1-4)