The Great Whore of the Revelation (chp 18)

[Guest shiloh357]

QUOTE

The Mystery Babylon from the text of Revelation 17:18 is a "city" that reigns over the kings of the earth. This "city" has a global dominion, and is obviously center of global commerce. John is not talking about a literal "city." He is talking about the rule of the anti-Christ.

Jerusalem has not been, nor is it prophesied to be a city that will rule the world. That is one reason it does not fit the description of "Babylon."

shiloh, the above is a little confusing to me as the 2 paragraphs seem to be contradictory. in the 2nd paragraph you say it can't be jerusalem because it is not a city that rules the world but in the 1st paragraph you say John is not talking about a literal city. could you clarify a little please?

What I am saying is that there are two-fold reasons why Jerusalem cannot be the whore of Revelation:

1. Because Mystery Babylon is not a literal "city." Babylon as used in the sense it is used in Revelation 17 is a metaphor for the one world system that anti-Christ will control and use to reign over the world.

2. The seond reason that it cannont be Jerusalem is that we do not have any OT, End Time prophetic corroboration from the prophets who spoke more about the End Times with respect to Jerusalem than the New Testament does. Not ONE OT prophet speaks of Jerusalem with respect to the last days in the terms Revelation uses to describe the whore of Babylon. The prophets consistently speak of God's restoration of Israel/Jerusalem in the Last days and the restoration of the Kingdom to Israel. There is nothing in the OT prophets that pictures Jerusalem as ruling the world in the last days.

also if you could please address the scriptural references that are pointed out by ToniR and KatyAnn it would also be appreciated by me in the interest of an even discussion. thank you

Well, I already did, but neither Toni nor KatyAnn are willing to address the points that have been raised. I responded to them in Post #30 and in Post #37. You may review those to posts as presented significant responses to what they offered to support their views.

[eric]

Hi guys I know this is a stupid question, but I will ask it anyway. Why do you surf the net for answers we can find in the word of God. God's ord is inspired where as the writings of those who are on the net are not inspired. Once again why surf the net?

I only surf the net when some kook like Richard Anthony, prints something that is anti-biblical to find out where they are coming from. We are taught to check what people write or say. Anyone who tries to put their own spin on scripture are to be exposed. That's what watchmen do.

edited to add. I don't searh the web for answers I use the bible

Edited December 3, 2007 by eric

[AnotherTraveler]

Another Traveler wrote:

And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

Rev 17:16 (KJV)

The ten horns of the beast HATE the whore, make her desolate, eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. 13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.

Rev 17:12-13 (KJV)

These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Rev 17:14 (KJV)

The ten kings hate the whore and they also make war with the Lamb.

So, I think that the ten kings are muslim arab kingdoms (nations), the false prophet is the coming false muslim prophet, they hate the whore which seams to include the Catholic church but might be of a broader application, and the fall of corrupt religious, political, military, and economic authority will cause the diminishing of the control of the world wide web to fall into the hands of the beast. All Christian-like manifestations will be attacked and the "whore" aspect will be destroyed by the beast. The Lamb will overcome them though.

So there are three main players, and they are each different one from the other. The false prophet (a living being), the beast (a living being), and the whore (likely a system of religious evil). Also there is the image of the beast, another system that controls the economy, demands worship, and forces all to take the make of the beast.

I don't know if I am understanding you right, so I guess I need to ask for clarification. Are you saying you think the ten kings is the whore of Revelation 18?

The reason I asked is because I do not think it is possible and I will tell you why. The beast, or the ten kings or the antichrist system destroys the whore.

Rev 17:16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire. KJV

The ten kings are probably Muslim kingdoms (nations). They hate the whore, they make her desolate, naked, eat her flesh, and burn her with fire, so no, they certainly are not the whore.

[Guest reader]

Hey everyone,

The other question is what is the great whore of the Revelation? I have a theory that many others also have that says that the Catholic "church" is the great whore of Revelation chapter 18, which does seem to fit the criteria pretty well considering "mystery" is another name for the sacrements, it is pretty wealthy (as many other religions are that go against doctrines of the Bible), it has a well-known and definitly accepted history of killing and persecuting Christians who opposed the beliefs of the Catholic "church", etc.

That has possibly been discussed to no-end, which is alright, we all have different interpretations of God's Word, even though the Bible says that there is only one true interpretation of it. However, I was in my Revelation class last night and the thought came "Could Islam in fact be the "great whore". Now, to say that the great whore is only the Catholic church is probably limiting that particular aspect in Scripture, and I've heard some say that it is possibly the Mormon cult, or any other cult, but I'm wondering if it coudl possibly be Islam also.

Any thoughts?

Crystal

I think that Islam is the great whore of Revelation in Chapter 18. A very good book that I have read on this is "Islam Rising" by Jim Murk.

[HeatherEljohari]

I dont know, Im married to a muslim. I have seen alot of feelings about this religion, as ppl feel its violent etc. But- from my husband I know this isnt so, at least with him. Hes peace loving, he likes to help other people, they help the needy. They pray to God 5x a day, he doesnt spoke, drink, gamble all coz he feels its against God, and he doesnt want to do anything to offend him. He is very God fearing. They believe in all the prophets, Moses, Abraham, to Job leading too Jesus Christ. The seperation of the religion is they dont believe hes son of God, but a aspect of God like other prophets, also they feel the bible was doctured by the churches/people in history. Which people out of Islam question due to the churches hand in the holy scripture. Also alot of what the Old testament is based on is what the religion of Islam is based on .. and it isnt just a religion of passitivty, but activity. He does everything he feels God wants him to do. People think Islam is very violent in nature... which it can be when people take the religion to extremes, like any culture or religious background. But- If we look at the Old Testament books there was ALOT of violence, and God defended his choosen ones, because they were doing Gods will getting rid of the wickedness. I mean its easy to Judge another culture, when you dont understand it.. This is just a little insight.

Love-

Heatherxoxox

[AnotherTraveler]

I dont know, Im married to a muslim. I have seen alot of feelings about this religion, as ppl feel its violent etc. But- from my husband I know this isnt so, at least with him. Hes peace loving, he likes to help other people, they help the needy. They pray to God 5x a day, he doesnt spoke, drink, gamble all coz he feels its against God, and he doesnt want to do anything to offend him. He is very God fearing. They believe in all the prophets, Moses, Abraham, to Job leading too Jesus Christ. The seperation of the religion is they dont believe hes son of God, but a aspect of God like other prophets, also they feel the bible was doctured by the churches/people in history. Which people out of Islam question due to the churches hand in the holy scripture. Also alot of what the Old testament is based on is what the religion of Islam is based on .. and it isnt just a religion of passitivty, but activity. He does everything he feels God wants him to do. People think Islam is very violent in nature... which it can be when people take the religion to extremes, like any culture or religious background. But- If we look at the Old Testament books there was ALOT of violence, and God defended his choosen ones, because they were doing Gods will getting rid of the wickedness. I mean its easy to Judge another culture, when you dont understand it.. This is just a little insight.

Love-

Heatherxoxox

911 brought understanding to the American people as to the peace loving ways of the Muslims. The recent rape victim's treatment teaches us the peace loving ways of the Muslims. The calls to kill the school teacher over the naming of a teddy bear teaches us the peace loving ways of the Muslims.

Your husband may indeed be a gentle man, but the religion he claims is bloodthirsty and evil.

This religion is of submission by force, and the death penalty is the NORMAL penalty for minor things.

[HeatherEljohari]

Yes my husband is, and hes a individual, not everyone is the same, u must remember there are some evil and cruel Christians out there as well. Also if you look in the bible hun, Old testament, They use to stone people to death. There were also laws, very extreme laws on how to handle sinful people. Than Jesus came along, with new ways on how to deal with our sistersa and brothers. I remember one part, cant remember exactly where but they were getting ready to stone a woman for her sinful nature... and Jesus said go ahead stone her the one which is not guilty of ONE sin... which meant we are all guilty, therefore a human cant condemn another. Also- we are here critisizing and condemning another culture and religious belief system.... Even IF that religion is damned, WHO are WE to decide on that, remember humble yourself before the King.... I also dont think Jesus would want anyone thinking evil or mean thoughts about another. If you dont like muslim people, or actions they do ... Doesnt Jesus speak about forgiveness????? for it is not our place to judge, "lest ye be judged." Forgive your energy, "70x7" isnt this correct? In Jesus' name, my Fathers grace, and the Holy Spirits unconditional love do i seek to understand, and help others as God has commanded me.

Love-

Heatherxoxoox

[HeatherEljohari]

enemy* sorry lol

[AnotherTraveler]

Yes my husband is, and hes a individual, not everyone is the same, u must remember there are some evil and cruel Christians out there as well. Also if you look in the bible hun, Old testament, They use to stone people to death. There were also laws, very extreme laws on how to handle sinful people. Than Jesus came along, with new ways on how to deal with our sistersa and brothers. I remember one part, cant remember exactly where but they were getting ready to stone a woman for her sinful nature... and Jesus said go ahead stone her the one which is not guilty of ONE sin... which meant we are all guilty, therefore a human cant condemn another. Also- we are here critisizing and condemning another culture and religious belief system.... Even IF that religion is damned, WHO are WE to decide on that, remember humble yourself before the King.... I also dont think Jesus would want anyone thinking evil or mean thoughts about another. If you dont like muslim people, or actions they do ... Doesnt Jesus speak about forgiveness????? for it is not our place to judge, "lest ye be judged." Forgive your energy, "70x7" isnt this correct? In Jesus' name, my Fathers grace, and the Holy Spirits unconditional love do i seek to understand, and help others as God has commanded me.

Love-

Heatherxoxoox

Can I recommend that this thread return to the topic at hand, and if anyone wants to discuss the good/evil relating to Muslims, lets have a seperate thread on it, OK?

[HeatherEljohari]

Hey, While were judging... we could look at it this way, USA is the "Whore" which is being described in revelation... Full of wealth, power, and we've misused all... and Muslim countries being poor and humbled, a majority of those nations were birth places of many influential prophets and ancient apostles, so we could speculate the acts of terrorism is God inspired and God powered and we'll (americans) be the fallen nation in the end. Just a perspective.

God bless~

Heather