Women's Role in worship

[Shelby]

Gina I am with you on most of what you said.

But, I just don't understand the issue. I am a woman and I AM called to be a minister. I have known for years. There are many women in my church who are ministers. Thousands. They are just as effective as any man. They both bring strengths and weaknesses. I revert back to keslc's post. She and I agree on most all things and she is a Godly woman, who I believe is called too. She is in charge of a daycamp and afterschool program, she has a man working under her, and so do I in my position. I don't see where God said a man could do it better, or it was more fitting for him to be here. I am no women's activist by any means, but I am called, to which I believe is not up for discussion. I am called, I am a woman, and I am a minister, as is my mother-in-law, keslc's mother, as are alot of our friends. All amazing women who have been wonderful examples of grace and faithfulness through their service.

I find it hard to believe that God would be so oppressive. He's not.

(BTW I am not upset or heated, I know it is hard to read tone, I just feel strongly about this subject and about people picking apart the Bible. God speaks to my heart and I listen. He has spoken, and I am called, no ands, ifs, or buts.)

[salt and light]

I think what God said is not up for discussion,and his word says that women are to remain silent in the churches, and they are not to usurp authority over the man.

[ray]

I think what God said is not up for discussion,and his word says that women are to remain silent in the churches, and they are not to usurp authority over the man.

I think what God said is not up for discussion

Salt and Light

Where does God say that it is not up for discusion salt and light? If the scriptures indacte that women are to be silent where they not before?

I'm not trying to take apart the Bible at any point but I'm trying to look at the whole picture. When I examine only that passage about being silent my focuss is not compelete there is more to it than that one passage.

If I only take one passage of the Bible and claim it to be complete than everyone should be over weight too because the scripture in psalms tell us to "Delight thyself in fat"

Just because the New Testment does not mention about instruments in worship does not mean its wrong either. But this is an issues for another fourm.

IF we examine the scripture in its context as well as just one verse at a time we can also get ourselves in to trouble. We need to examine the context and look at the whole picture.

Thanks

ray

[keslc]

I think what God said is not up for discussion,and his word says that women are to remain silent in the churches, and they are not to usurp authority over the man.

I think what God said is not up for discussion

Salt and Light

Where does God say that it is not up for discusion salt and light? If the scriptures indacte that women are to be silent where they not before?

I'm not trying to take apart the Bible at any point but I'm trying to look at the whole picture. When I examine only that passage about being silent my focuss is not compelete there is more to it than that one passage.

If I only take one passage of the Bible and claim it to be complete than everyone should be over weight too because the scripture in psalms tell us to "Delight thyself in fat"

Just because the New Testment does not mention about instruments in worship does not mean its wrong either. But this is an issues for another fourm.

IF we examine the scripture in its context as well as just one verse at a time we can also get ourselves in to trouble. We need to examine the context and look at the whole picture.

Thanks

ray

Ray, I guess I feel the same as you. As I said in an earlier post, I feel that that scripture is speaking to the idea of not causing conflict in church or within the worship, not about females in their roles per se. The theme of conflict and avoiding it comes up time and time again in Pauls writings, the theme of women remaining silent does not. Also, the idea of women not ministering through evangelizing, preaching, leading is NOT thematic throughout the Bible, rather evidence that God uses women in those roles is. Like you said, we need to look at the scriptures as a whole and not just pulling verses here or there that fit our needs.

BTW, I want to make clear that my feelings have NOTHING to do with women's rights or women's lib or feminism or anything like that. I said previously that I agree women are to be modest and submissive to God and their husbands. I don't feel that is demeaning and I'm not all riled up thinking everyone is a bunch of chauvenists. Please understand that my feelings are based on scriptures not a feminist agenda.

[salt and light]

Ray,

You misunderstood me. I didn't say that God said that what He said wasn't up for discussion. Of course God didn't say that, BUT, if God says something, it SHOULDN'T be up for discussion. My wife even says that.

[ray]

Ray,

You misunderstood me. I didn't say that God said that what He said wasn't up for discussion. Of course God didn't say that, BUT, if God says something, it SHOULDN'T be up for discussion. My wife even says that.

if God says something, it SHOULDN'T be up for discussion.

Salt and Light

I'm sorry if I missunderstood but I guess I'm still misunderstanding you. So if God says something I should except it as final and can not discuss it with anyone.

I don't understand that thinking. At least that what I understand from your coment

if God says something, it SHOULDN'T be up for discussion So since God has a lot to say in the Bible it is not up for discussion. OR if it not mentioned in a part of the Bible I can't discuss it I just don't get that.

But I agree with you on your earlier coment

Ray, I guess I feel the same as you. As I said in an earlier post, I feel that that scripture is speaking to the idea of not causing conflict in church or within the worship, not about females in their roles per se. The theme of conflict and avoiding it comes up time and time again in Pauls writings, the theme of women remaining silent does not. Also, the idea of women not ministering through evangelizing, preaching, leading is NOT thematic throughout the Bible, rather evidence that God uses women in those roles is. Like you said, we need to look at the scriptures as a whole and not just pulling verses here or there that fit our needs.

Now I'm just confussed on the coment you stated above that I made bigger that you made.

ray

[Shelby]

keslc said the second comment you quoted, not salt and light.

[salt and light]

Ray,

I'm sorry. Let me explain it this way. God says something in his word {the bible},we shouldn't discuss if we should or shouldn't,because God said,and who are we to question it. I hear some people say, "why"? and I'll say, "Because God says so" Now, discussing a particular piece of scripture of what it means, that is ok. If God says that no fornicator will inherit the kingdom of God,there is no discussing it,because God says,and what He says is final, and that is what I meant. It is ok to discuss something that we aren't sure of that's in the bible. I hope I cleared that up. God Bless

[keslc]

Ray,

You misunderstood me. I didn't say that God said that what He said wasn't up for discussion. Of course God didn't say that, BUT, if God says something, it SHOULDN'T be up for discussion. My wife even says that.

I'm sorry, I don't understand this.

Can you please clarify? Thanks!

[Shelby]

Salt & Light,

I hear what you are saying. I actually believe it for the most part. I just believe that it is good to have healthy discussion. I have faith that the Holy Spirit is able to work in us when we delve into understnading God and his reasons for what he says, and his purpose for us doing, or not doing things. That is why he convicts us. I think that, to use your illustration, "fornication", It is very important to read the context and not just the whole chapter, but learn about the author, the times, the culture, before you go and decide "it is written and that is it". I believe every word of the Bible is true. I believe that they were given by the inspiration of God and they are God's Word. I just get really perterbed when we begint o pick and choose scripture to back our stance. I would just encourage everyone to read up and pray up on issues.

Again, I feel very differently than you on this subject. I won't resay my stance, but I also know that God moves in me and my life, and he has called me to be a minister, there is no question in my mind regarding that. God confirms everyday His will for my life. I happen to be a pretty good preacher, and love what he has called me to. Since God has called me, why shold anyone second guess His decision? Only God is my judge and I am very comfortable knowing that God is pleased with me. I strive every day to keep it that way.

GBU