Why does God allow so much pain?

[deafcanada]

I would like to ask you: 'If there was no God, how would you live your life differently?'

If there was no God, he wouldn't have a life to live; differently or otherwise.

Maybe I didn't phrase my question the right way. I am sometimes told that if there was no God that everyone would be running amok. I live my life as if there was no God. Yet I do not live without ethics or values. I give to charity. I stop to help people in distress. I am kind to strangers and animals. I do these things not because I expect a reward in the afterlife and not because I expect to receive punishment if I don't, but just because I think this is the proper way to behave. My question is, if you unexpectedly came to the belief that there was no God after all, would you start running amok or would you continue to live life basically as you do now, but without visits to church and without taking time to pray? In short, do you think belief in God is necessary to keep people in line?

If God allow the pain for all of us, there is a reason why God is doing this to us because He is molding us i know it is hurt and painful but all pains belong to God. we have to allow God to do this in our lives no matter what. also God is discplining us the same way our parents do that to us that show God loves us so much and want to mold us and train us in many ways that we should allow God do this. If God didnt allow any pains in us, how can we grow stronger for Him and be able to help other people who are going through. I believe that God is allowing the pain for the believers who love Him dearly. i am telling truth with you all, the pain i am going through so much it is worthy to go through because I am allowing God to do this to me for His glory and help me to grow stronger in Him no matter what the situation look like. I know if you want to know why the pain is so painful. Remember God not plan to hurt you but have plans something good for you in the future. look at joseph in old Testament, he was in painful however he had to trust in God even though he was hurting, in pain Yet God was there with him whole time and he had to learn to surrender to God and allow God work in his life. same way for us, we should surrender to God. God has plans for everyone. His plans are even better than our plans.

Let you know the pain is worthy because Jesus had already experience the pain while He was beat up, was carried the cross and been crucified and Jesus didnt give up at all. Jesus was willing to die for all of us. He knew about the pains that we have to go through this. that why Jesus was so willing to die for all of us.

Dc

[Rick-Parker]

If there were no God, I would be a lying, thieving, drug addicted, porno reading jerk. I would love no one but my self. I wouldn't care less about anyone. In fact I would probably be dead from one of the crimes I would commit. Or in prison for life, being someone's ......

But thank God, He does exist and has saved me from myself!

[Guest]

Amen!

But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

Romans 5:8

[Rick-Parker]

If there were no God, I would be a lying, thieving, drug addicted, porno reading jerk. I would love no one but my self. I wouldn't care less about anyone. In fact I would probably be dead from one of the crimes I would commit. Or in prison for life, being someone's ......

But thank God, He does exist and has saved me from myself!

Thank God you believe in God! Without fear of Him to keep you in line it sounds as if you would run amok and threaten the safety of a good many good people.

Have you read my testimony? You will see what type of person I was. Even when I knew Him but kept Him on the shelf.

[Rick-Parker]

If there were no God, I would be a lying, thieving, drug addicted, porno reading jerk. I would love no one but my self. I wouldn't care less about anyone. In fact I would probably be dead from one of the crimes I would commit. Or in prison for life, being someone's ......

But thank God, He does exist and has saved me from myself!

Thank God you believe in God! Without fear of Him to keep you in line it sounds as if you would run amok and threaten the safety of a good many good people.

Have you read my testimony? You will see what type of person I was. Even when I knew Him but kept Him on the shelf.

Sorry if I affronted you. I do have a friend who before I knew him was into drugs rather heavily. He had an experience, whether drug induced or not, I don't know, but it turned him around and in his mind Jesus had made this happen. So I know that people do have religious experiences that sometimes bring them through some rather bad times. But, I also know people who are gentle and considerate, who would never deliberately harm anyone and who go out of their way to be helpful, but who don't believe in God. They are atheists. My point is not believing in God does not drive people to do the things that you and my friend did before your conversions. Both of you believed in God, but this never stopped either of you from taking part in activities that you both later regretted. The message is that one can be moral without God. That really was my only point.

No, you're fine. I didn't take offense. I was just encouraging you to read my testimony if you hadn't. I am not proud of who I was by any means. In fact, I am still ashamed of my past. I can't change it. But if God can forgive even me, than he will forgive anyone. That was my point. God bless.

Rick

[Guest shiloh357]

I'm a bit confused about something...... If God created satan, then in a sense, didn't He create evil and suffering?

No, because the Bible teaches that like men, angels have the freedom to choose. Angels were created with intelligence, the ability to reason and the ability to make a choice. Satan (Lucifer) made his choice and so did 1/3 of the angels in heaven and they rebelled against God.

Evil is not a created thing. Evil is the absence of good/righteousness.

Let me illustrate it this way. When you want to go to sleep at night, do you have to "turn on" the darkness in your room? No, you merely turn off the light. Darkness is not something we have make. We just have to take away the light, and darkness is what is left after the light is gone. In the same, evil does not have to be created, it is what is left after the goodness of God is removed.

Men without God, are by nature evil. You don't have to teach a child to fight, to lie, to be rude or selfish. Those are the natural part of fallen human nature. Faith, virtue, goodness, love, etc. have to be introduced and taught to a child so that he will live in a responsible manner.

[~~ angelique ~~]

You know, I've had a lot go on in my life since I asked this question. I have been reading all of the replies and discussions that have arisen as well. I had a meeting with a Pastor and asked him this question in person. Anyway, after thinking upon his answer to my question, I have come upon a reason and purpose in pain.

I've come to the conclusion that people are people and people hurt people. That hurt is not caused by God but by people choices. But, I've discovered that God can "use" the hurt, pain, disappointment, and all manner of things to help others who are in the same place.

2Co 1:3-4 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort, who comforts us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort those who are in any trouble, with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God.

I thought about what Paul was relating about God. Paul was saying that God doesn't cause our pain and trouble but God comforts us so that we can comfort others who have been were we are. I have been horribly abused (emotionally, physically, sexually) and very deeply hurt by church but if someone comes to me who has been hurt like I have, I can understand what they are going through. If someone came to me and said, I understand, but they have not been in my shoes, I might wonder, "How would you know anything about how a feel?"

But, later this week, something hit me. I was asking God how he comforts us because the aforementioned verse says God comforts us in all our troubles.

Hebrews 4:14-16, Seeing then that we have a great High Priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin. Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.

We go to God and God comforts us but the missing link was Jesus. I had always talked with God as the Source but didn't understand that Jesus was the path to God. I can go to Jesus who feels everything and knows my hurts better than anyone, including my husband.

Romans 8:34- 37, Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died, and furthermore is also risen, who is even at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?

As it is written: "For Your sake we are killed all day long; We are accounted as sheep for the slaughter." {#Ps 44:22} Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us."

I thought if Jesus is praying and thinking about me then that's the biggest comfort ever.

Psalms 139:17-18, How precious also are Your thoughts to me, O God! How great is the sum of them! If I should count them, they would be more in number than the sand; When I awake, I am still with You.

For someone who used to believe with all of my heart that God hated me, to discover that he thinks about me (and everyone else, good thoughts) just really made a difference.

Jer. 29:11, For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, saith the LORD, thoughts of peace, and not of evil, to give you an expected end. {expected

[jehovah Nissi]

You know, I've had a lot go on in my life since I asked this question. I have been reading all of the replies and discussions that have arisen as well. I had a meeting with a Pastor and asked him this question in person. Anyway, after thinking upon his answer to my question, I have come upon a reason and purpose in pain.

I've come to the conclusion that people are people and people hurt people. That hurt is not caused by God but by people choices. But, I've discovered that God can "use" the hurt, pain, disappointment, and all manner of things to help others who are in the same place.

2Co 1:3-4 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort, who comforts us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort those who are in any trouble, with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God.

I thought about what Paul was relating about God. Paul was saying that God doesn't cause our pain and trouble but God comforts us so that we can comfort others who have been were we are. I have been horribly abused (emotionally, physically, sexually) and very deeply hurt by church but if someone comes to me who has been hurt like I have, I can understand what they are going through. If someone came to me and said, I understand, but they have not been in my shoes, I might wonder, "How would you know anything about how a feel?"

But, later this week, something hit me. I was asking God how he comforts us because the aforementioned verse says God comforts us in all our troubles.

Hebrews 4:14-16, Seeing then that we have a great High Priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin. Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.

We go to God and God comforts us but the missing link was Jesus. I had always talked with God as the Source but didn't understand that Jesus was the path to God. I can go to Jesus who feels everything and knows my hurts better than anyone, including my husband.

Romans 8:34- 37, Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died, and furthermore is also risen, who is even at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?

As it is written: "For Your sake we are killed all day long; We are accounted as sheep for the slaughter." {#Ps 44:22} Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us."

I thought if Jesus is praying and thinking about me then that's the biggest comfort ever.

Psalms 139:17-18, How precious also are Your thoughts to me, O God! How great is the sum of them! If I should count them, they would be more in number than the sand; When I awake, I am still with You.

For someone who used to believe with all of my heart that God hated me, to discover that he thinks about me (and everyone else, good thoughts) just really made a difference.

Jer. 29:11, For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, saith the LORD, thoughts of peace, and not of evil, to give you an expected end. {expected

[Guest]

I thought if Jesus is praying and thinking about me then that's the biggest comfort ever.

Hallelujah!

Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.

Hebrews 7:25

[Resting in Christ]

If there were no God, I would be a lying, thieving, drug addicted, porno reading jerk. I would love no one but my self. I wouldn't care less about anyone. In fact I would probably be dead from one of the crimes I would commit. Or in prison for life, being someone's ......

But thank God, He does exist and has saved me from myself!

Thank God you believe in God! Without fear of Him to keep you in line it sounds as if you would run amok and threaten the safety of a good many good people.

Have you read my testimony? You will see what type of person I was. Even when I knew Him but kept Him on the shelf.

Sorry if I affronted you. I do have a friend who before I knew him was into drugs rather heavily. He had an experience, whether drug induced or not, I don't know, but it turned him around and in his mind Jesus had made this happen. So I know that people do have religious experiences that sometimes bring them through some rather bad times. But, I also know people who are gentle and considerate, who would never deliberately harm anyone and who go out of their way to be helpful, but who don't believe in God. They are atheists. My point is not believing in God does not drive people to do the things that you and my friend did before your conversions. Both of you believed in God, but this never stopped either of you from taking part in activities that you both later regretted. The message is that one can be moral without God. That really was my only point.

Hi Cycel, I don't want the title "Christian Cynic", but my experience of people has been that the non-believing "gentle", "considerate", "helpful', 'moral" folks are either trying to get approval or are trying to impress others and/or themselves with their morality. My point is that "morality" without Christ seems rather hollow to me. I actually like a lot of these nice moral people, but I still feel a deep sorrow for them.