nebula Posted October 2, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.76 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted October 2, 2008 As with most prophecies, we will know a lot more after it has been fulfilled Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted October 2, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.76 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted October 2, 2008 Moses did die...Elisha and Elijah did not I believe you mean Enoch, not Elisha. Elisha did die and was placed in a tomb. At the burial some men got into a fight, one was killed, and thrown onto Elisha's bones, and the man came back to life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irishcowboy Posted October 2, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 127 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 3,248 Content Per Day: 0.88 Reputation: 13 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/23/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted October 2, 2008 my personal thoughts are that they are Elijah and Enoch..... while others believe it is Moses (as like upon the Mount Transfiguration)..... It really does not say, and it really does not matter, for Who Gets The Glory is what matters..... GOD, OUR FATHER..... mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trusting Jesus Posted October 2, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 66 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,050 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 22 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/12/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/09/1952 Share Posted October 2, 2008 I have heard various ideas of who the two witnesses are. Moses (representing the Law) and Elijah (representing the prophets), or Enoch and Elijah (the two who were "raptured"). I've heard others, too, but these are the most common. I really don't know and the arguments I hear for each are good. I'm not really sure why they have to be people whose names are know to us. But, whoever they are, they will appear after the rapture. <>< ><> Nathele The witnesses are come during the Tribulation not the Millennium. Yes, I know the witnesses are during the Tribulation. This isn't a "when will the rapture happen" thread. So I won't say any more. I do like to hear the various opinions on who the witnesses will be, though. <>< ><> Nathele Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawkins Posted October 2, 2008 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 289 Content Per Day: 0.05 Reputation: 45 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/25/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted October 2, 2008 (edited) My answer is like this, the prophecy is somehow two-folded. It bears a standard, and it describes a scenario. The two lampstands are Moses and Elijah, they symbolically represent the 2 series of prophets sent and to be sent. John the Baptist belongs to the Elijah series, especially to the Son of Man. Paul is thus Moses, especially to the Son of Man. It sets a standard here for the end time prophets to follow, alternatively speaking, end time prophets are destined to follow this standard, - They belong to either of the 2 series. - They will die but will be raised back. - They will confront the devil in a more direct sense (even a face to face encounter). - They will torment the world with Truth, that some people will be driven crazy and will be more than happy to see them killed. - They will prophesy/reveal in a period of time. Amongst them, there will be 2 extraordinary Witnesses, and they will come just as described. Moreover, one appears to be physical dead might not have actually tasted death. Edited October 2, 2008 by Hawkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cymba22 Posted October 2, 2008 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 22 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 588 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 5 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/14/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/06/1967 Share Posted October 2, 2008 Moses did die...Elisha and Elijah did not I believe you mean Enoch, not Elisha. Elisha did die and was placed in a tomb. At the burial some men got into a fight, one was killed, and thrown onto Elisha's bones, and the man came back to life. That's who I meant DOH ME remind me not to post at about midnight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
being molded Posted October 2, 2008 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 62 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/25/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted October 2, 2008 My understanding is this: The symbolism in the Revelation will be 100% consistent with Biblical (Old Testament) symbolism: Zechariah chapter 4 is prophetic of Jesus and His Church: "Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of Jehovah unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my Spirit, saith Jehovah of hosts . Who art thou, O great mountain? before Zerubbabel thou shalt become a plain; and he shall bring forth the top stone with shoutings of Grace, grace, unto it. Moreover the word of Jehovah came unto me, saying, The hands of Zerubbabel have laid the foundation of this house; his hands shall also finish it; and thou shalt know that Jehovah of hosts hath sent me unto you ." (Zec 4:6-9) It's prophetic of Jesus building His church after He Himself laid its foundation. What has this got to do with "the two witnesses" of Jesus? Check the symbolism: "And he said unto me, What seest thou? And I said, I have seen, and, behold, a candlestick all of gold , with its bowl upon the top of it, and its seven lamps thereon; there are seven pipes to each of the lamps, which are upon the top thereof; and two olive-trees by it , one upon the right side of the bowl, and the other upon the left side thereof... "And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these are? And I said, No, my lord. Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth ." "[b ]These are the two olive trees and the two candlesticks, standing before the Lord of the earth ." (Zech.4: 2-3, 13-14; Rev 11:4) Zerubbabel (the governor) and Joshua (the High priest) are both biblical types of Jesus, and Zerubbabel was busy building the house (temple) of God and was being assisted by Joshua. "The two witnesses" are the witnesses of Jesus and they speak with ONE MOUTH (Rev.11: 5), unlike the beast, false prophet and dragon. "...the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy". (Rev.19: 10c) "And I will give unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth." (Rev 11:3) "The Spirit of fire" proceeding from their mouth could be a reference to the Spirit of Truth against which the arguments of atheists, agnostics, evolutionists etc cannot stand. The blessing of the Holy Spirit from heaven is symbolized as "waters from heaven" (rain: Hebrew "mayim mi shamayim") in the Old Testament. "And the third poured out his bowl into the rivers and the fountains of the waters; and it became blood. And I heard the angel of the waters saying, Righteous art thou, who art and who wast, thou Holy One, because thou didst thus judge: for they poured out the blood of the saints and the prophets, and blood hast thou given them to drink: they are worthy . (Rev 16:4-6) "These have the power to shut the heaven, that it rain not during the days of their prophecy: and they have power over the waters to turn them into blood, and to smite the earth with every plague, as often as they shall desire." (Rev 11:6). False doctrine/heresy is a (spiritual) plague. "And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and there was given to him authority over every tribe and people and tongue and nation." (Rev 13:7) "I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;" (Dan 7:21) "And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that cometh up out of the abyss shall make war with them, and overcome them, and kill them. And their dead bodies lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also their Lord was crucified. And from among the peoples and tribes and tongues and nations do men look upon their dead bodies three days and a half, and suffer not their dead bodies to be laid in a tomb. And they that dwell on the earth rejoice over them, and make merry; and they shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwell on the earth. And after the three days and a half the breath of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them that beheld them. And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they went up into heaven in the cloud; and their enemies beheld them . (Rev 11:7-12) Well, that's just my post-tribulation rapture of the saints way of understanding who "the two witnesses" of Jesus refers to - and I could be wrong. being moulded Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nebula Posted October 2, 2008 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 5,823 Topics Per Day: 0.76 Content Count: 45,870 Content Per Day: 5.95 Reputation: 1,897 Days Won: 83 Joined: 03/22/2003 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/19/1970 Share Posted October 2, 2008 That's interesting, Being Molded. BTW, do I understand correctly that shamayim is the Hebrew word for Heaven? Interesting that the word for Heaven has in it the word for water (mayim). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
being molded Posted October 2, 2008 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 62 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/25/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted October 2, 2008 That's interesting, Being Molded. BTW, do I understand correctly that shamayim is the Hebrew word for Heaven? Interesting that the word for Heaven has in it the word for water (mayim). Hi, nebula. Yes, (I'm not an expert on Biblical Hebrew and I don't speak any Hebrew), but it seems so: "In the beginning (H7225) God (H430) created (H1254) (H853) the heaven (H8064) and the earth. (H776) " (Gen 1:1) "And he built (H1129) altars (H4196) for all (H3605) the host (H6635) of heaven (H8064) in the two (H8147) courts (H2691) of the house (H1004) of the LORD. (H3068)" (2Ki 21:5) H8064 שׁמה שׁמים shâmayim shâmeh shaw-mah'-yim, shaw-meh' The second form being dual of an unused singular; from an unused root meaning to be lofty; the sky (as aloft; the dual perhaps alluding to the visible arch in which the clouds move, as well as to the higher ether where the celestial bodies revolve): - air, X astrologer, heaven (-s). "And the earth (H776) was (H1961) without form, (H8414) and void; (H922) and darkness (H2822) was upon (H5921) the face (H6440) of the deep. (H8415) And the Spirit (H7307) of God (H430) moved (H7363) upon (H5921) the face (H6440) of the waters . (H4325 " (Gen 1:2) H4325 מים mayim mah'-yim Dual of a primitive noun (but used in a singular sense); water; figuratively juice; by euphemism urine, semen: - + piss, wasting, water (-ing, [-course, -flood, -spring]). Biblical Hebrew is beautiful, I think - and praise God for the translation work of people like Strong! being molded Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terter Posted October 16, 2008 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 14 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 473 Content Per Day: 0.07 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/14/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted October 16, 2008 I vote for Enoch and Elijah b/c 1Co 15:22 "For as in Adam all die even so in Christ shall all be made alive." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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