What is atheism?

[MorningGlory]

Where I do see a similarity is in the devout steadfastness that each holds to views that would be better if they were to give way to modern, scientific views.

If by 'modern and scientific' you mean atheist or agnostic views...there's no upside to that mindset. Christians are free to observe or practice science; after all, God created it. Muslims? Well, just figure how long it's been since muslim countries moved forward in any meaningful way. About 1400 years as far as I can tell.

For example both believe that the earth has, or will, stand still. Judaeo-Christian scripture has the sun stand still (better recognize as a legend), and Islam predicts the world will stop rotating as a sign of the end times. Both stories are understandable in terms of pre-scientific cultures but neither makes sense in the light of modern knowledge. What's it called in English lit lingo? -- suspended disbelief. It makes for great story telling but poor science. And please don't be offended.

No offense taken. The story of the earth standing still is recounted in the Bible. The Qu'ran borrows heavily from the Old Testament/Torah so it's not surprising that they believe in this as well. It is hard to conceive of such a thing happening, considering physical laws, I'll grant you that. But, you have to consider this; the One who made those laws has no difficulty suspending them.

Not knowing that Muslims were devil worshippers I could never have made that association. However, I think I must take exception with you. Despite the low regard I hold for conservative Islamic views I really don't see how anyone could call the them Satan worshippers. They now worship God. It really doesn't matter that there are some pagan influences there from the distant past; Christianity has enough such influence of its own.

No, muslims worship a god, allah, who is the modern incarnation of Ba'al, who is satan. I can dig up the history, if you'd like. Even the modern day islamic symbol envokes Ba'al; it is a crescent moon.

Yes, and from what you have said about them being devil worshippers I should think they wouldn't be happy with you either. Fanatics can be quite dangerous because they are so quick to take offence, especially if they think they must exact retribution themselves, perhaps thinking they are doing God's work.

I'm sure muslims wouldn't be happy with me at all; I loathe and despise their 'religion' but hold out hope that many of them will come to the Lord, which they are, in large numbers. A fanatic is dangerous even if he/she is a Christian or a nonbeliever (yes, they do exist!) because they are unbalanced. That's not faith; it's mental illness.

[RebekahDavid]

blessings,

1st "good people" can not be talked into genocide.

2nd it is the nature of man that is seen in the crusades and not the nature of God.

why did things change? i beleive because His Word became readily available for people to read for themselves and so could read Jesus's own words instead of relying upon what they were told:

Matthew 5

1And seeing the multitudes, he went up into a mountain: and when he was set, his disciples came unto him:

2And he opened his mouth, and taught them, saying,

3Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

4Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.

5Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

6Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.

7Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.

8Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

9Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.

10Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

11Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

12Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

13Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men.

14Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.

15Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.

16Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.

17Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

18For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

19Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

20For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

21Ye have heard that it was said of them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:

22But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

23Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee;

24Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.

25Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.

26Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.

27Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:

28But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

29And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

30And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

31It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement:

32But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

33Again, ye have heard that it hath been said by them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself, but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths:

34But I say unto you, Swear not at all; neither by heaven; for it is God's throne:

35Nor by the earth; for it is his footstool: neither by Jerusalem; for it is the city of the great King.

36Neither shalt thou swear by thy head, because thou canst not make one hair white or black.

37But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.

38Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:

39But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

40And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloak also.

41And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain.

42Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

43Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

44But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

45That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

46For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?

47And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?

48Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

a totally different perspective emerged God's truth

love your sister in Christ,

Rebekah David

[Shiloh62]

According to the Oxford Dictionary, atheism is defined as:

atheism |ˈāθēˌizəm|

noun

the theory or belief that God does not exist.

Let's look at the word 'theory' a little closer. As described by Oxford...

theory |ˈθēərē; ˈθi(ə)rē|

noun ( pl. -ries)

a supposition or a system of ideas intended to explain something, esp. one based on general principles independent of the thing to be explained : Darwin's theory of evolution.

[rstrats]

SoulGrind,

re:

[Samthing]

As I understand it, atheism is simply the denial of God's existence. It isn't a faith in itself (that would be somewhat ironic).

I know some people who believe in atheism because they don't like the idea that they're not in control of their life, or because they believe that it's possible to be a good person without God. I'm not going to criticise either here, because I don't believe that I - as an imperfect human being - has the right to find faults with another, but on the latter point, I will say that I don't think being an atheist inherently makes you evil. It may not be correct, but it doesn't make you evil.

I know that some people think that atheists are friends with the devil. I knew one girl who was an atheist and yet she treated me with kindness and never looked down on me because I believed in God. I think people who are atheists are on that trail of thought because, for them, there isn't enough evidence to say that God exists so they assume that He doesn't. Atheism does seem to take pride in things like the laws of reason, rationality and logic. Indeed, several atheists don't believe in anything supernatural or that cannot be explained in logical terms, while some don't believe in God, but may accept the belief in some kind of supernatural power.

Either way, as a former atheist myself, I didn't believe in God partially because I felt science had "disproved" Him, and partially because I was afraid that I would be punished for my sins in Hell and wanted to deny that by choosing atheism. However, one of the things that turned my viewpoint around was what I like to call, as silly as this may sound to some, "The Almighty Franchise's Idea". There are two lines in Bruce and Evan Almighty which I have found to be truer than people think.

"A single mother who has two jobs and works seven days a week, but still finds the time to take her child to soccer practice. That

[Botz]

I do not really think anybody can call themself an Atheist unless they make a deliberate choice not to believe in the existence of G-d or any gods...they do not really want proof of the exisitence of G-d in the way He has chosen to reveal Himself...they want G-d to appear before them and tell them face to face about Himself and the mysteries of the Universe...In a way I think they believe G-d owes them this much...after all He supposedly created mankind.

Is this disingenuous? I don't think so...I used to be in that position.

Atheists vary widely in their beliefs or personal definition of their lack of belief in any G-d or gods...the type of Atheist that does not exist is the one that not only says he is convinced that no G-d or gods exist...but states that he knows this to be true.

There are not many Believers who have slunk back into the ranks of unbelief...but there are multitudes who have come to a position of belief in the Living G-d, and obviously never look back to their formal spiritual status.

"Blessed are those who have not seen, and yet believed."

[rstrats]

Botz,

re:

[Botz]

Botz,

re:

[Guest HIS girl]

"I do not really think anybody can call themself an Atheist unless they make a deliberate choice not to believe..."

I would argue that for some there may seem no reason to believe. That would certainly be the case from my perspective on the God question. I don't feel that I am so much rejecting the idea of God as much as I just don't see that the idea has any substance.

How's that Hitch?

[MorningGlory]

"I do not really think anybody can call themself an Atheist unless they make a deliberate choice not to believe..."

I would argue that for some there may seem no reason to believe. That would certainly be the case from my perspective on the God question. I don't feel that I am so much rejecting the idea of God as much as I just don't see that the idea has any substance.

How's that Hitch?

Actually, before I climbed out of bed this morning I was thinking about this question. I have never had the sense that I rejected God, or made a decision not to believe. It is more like life no longer sustained the belief. Picture a fruit withering on the vine. The vine no longer gives sustinance and the fruit drops off. There is not a conscious decision in this action. One just no longer supports the other and in a similar way I discovered one day that I didn't believe. True, I was asking myself questions about God, but I started out believing and one day made the realization that I no longer did. I don't know when that change happened, I only know that it did. I think that for many believers God seems obvious and so they think that there must be a point at which a conscious decision is made to reject the obvious. But if God is not obvious for an individual then there is nothing to sustain that belief. If nothing sustains the belief it just withers and falls away, sometimes without us even noticing.

While I don't understand how that could happen, I know it does. It's just SO sad; looking at it from my own point of view, of course.