Willa

You make a good point. Satan came to divide and conquer. He divides families and he divides churches. I am sure he played a role in the dividing of denominations, too. Certainly the reformers did not wish to split from the Catholic church but wanted to correct terrible abuses and perversion of the Gospel. They were excommunicated for it. So the forming of denomination has often been to correct and renounce heretical doctrine such as the sale of indulgences or being able to buy your way out of purgatory, which is in itself another unbiblical doctrine. But I most often see denominations as needed in our personal growth in the universal body of Christ. A certain denomination may have the very doctrine that a person needs to hear due to his experiences tipping his beliefs too far one way or another. Some people may need to hear that they are in danger of losing their salvation to keep them from abusing God's grace. Others who are fearful may need to have eternal security reinforced in their lives. And God may move us from one to another to hear the message we most need at the time. This is just one example. I know a backslider who said this very thing to me, and that he needed to hear hellfire and brimstone. God won me by His loving forgiveness. However, bitterness between denominations needs to end. We can agree to disagree. I have usually found that God's love bridges that gap among true believers. I have deep love for Aian Jade and ncn, for instance, even though I disagree with each on certain issues such as the time of the rapture and Calvinism. And, shame on me, I even like to poke them in the ribs about it occasionally. They are both gracious and put up with me. They and so many others on this forum are so beautiful in the Lord, and yet we are all very different. There will always be differences of opinion and interpretation until we get to heaven and Christ explains it more perfectly. Meanwhile we depend on the Holy Spirit to lead us into all truth, and that can be very personal in nature.

The death penalty is not about personal vengeance. In fact many of the families of those heinously murdered have forgiven the perpetrator and expressed this at the sentencing. It is about justice in a court of law as supported by God's Word. God believes in the death penalty. If we make a mistake, it is to declare sociopaths to be insane and not give them the death penalty. They are the most deserving of it. The criminaly insane are too often released from mental institiutions to kill and maime again. Level 3 sex offenders need to be included. People who are so incorigable and hardened do not need to be supported by our states in a prison or released to reoffend. Rom. 6:23 "the wages of sin is death." God did not abolish the death penalty at the cross. He reinforced the fact that we all deserve crucifixion for our sin. Jesus took our death penalty upon Himself for whomever will receive it, imparting eternal life. This does not negate the fact that sin deserves death here on earth. The God of the Old Testament has not changed. His grace is extended to those who will receive it but He is still a just and righteous God who destroys evildoers. He expects us to do the same.

They never tell the rest of the story. I know 2 women who got abortions and who live with overwhelming grief over what they have done. Even though they have since been saved, they are unable to find closure but are tomented over this. This is the case more often than not. There also is a growing movement to withhold medical care from senior citizens and the permanently disabled. At one time asking for "no heroic measures" when very ill meant that there would be no attempt to do CPR. Now it can also mean withholding food and water, starving them to death. This was done in nursing homes 30 years ago and now is being done in major hospitals. This is the best reason that I know of for going to a Catholic hospital if you don't want to die.

First, is she a born again Christian? Has she repented and asked your forgiveness as well as God's forgiveness? Has she completely broken free from the relationship with the other person. Second, were her emotional needs being met inside your marriage? She needs to answer this, not you. Most women do not leave a place where they feel beloved, secure and appreciated. In 1st Peter 3:7 you are told to love your wife and live with her with understanding. Read on to verse 12. I would recommend good bible based marriage counseling. You should fight for your marriage and do your best to be the husband she would never think of leaving. Hosea married a protistute and went after her time and again, forgiving her and cleaning her up, taking her back as his wife. That is the picture of God's attitude toward Israel. The Bible says if your wife is an unbeliever and doesn't want to remain with you, that you are to release her, grant her a divorse, and if you have not also committed adultry, you are released from bondage (your marriage vows) to marry again. If you are guilty of adultry also, you must remain celebate after divorse. 1 Corinthians 7:15 This is my understanding. I may be wrong.

Ephesians 6 10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might. 11 Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. 12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. . Amen and amen!

One of my favorite battles is in 2 Chron. 20:15-22. Do not fear or be dismayed because of this great multitude, for the battle is not yours but God's." Also when Elisha opens the eyes of the servent to see that the armies of the Lord, in chariots of fire, are surrounding them in 2 Kings 6:8-20. When we pray for peoples salvation we sometimes enter into spiritual warfare by prayer.. The battlefield is the mind. 2 Cor 10:4 speaks of taking every thought captive to God's Word. We do this in our own minds, first. Psalms 34:7, Gen. 32:2, and Joshua 6 are other favorite warfare verses. Much of the Old Testamant is about warfare and it is a great training manual for us. It requires perfect obedience to His voice and instructions. God does the fighting on our behalf. We need to hold the ground while the battle goes on around us. This means keeping our heads low and in prayer. We must remain focused on God during this time. Satan came to lie, steal and destroy. Since he is the father of lies, we need to ignore him and his lies but look to God our deliverer. That means we must know God's Word very well to avoid being deceived. The enemy is intent on destroying us by those lies and on stealing our joy. Again, our chief duty is to hold our ground. So we use our shield of faith and the Word of God and the helmet of salvation to protect our minds. We focus on God and His loving faithfulness. In Galations 4:19 Paul talks of being in travail till Christ is formed in you. I believe that this intense, painful prayer is a type of spiritual warfare, too. Those who witness to unbelievers also ask for God to give them the words the person needs to hear, and wisdom to know how to answer them so as to take every thought captive to God's Word. Again, we must know God's word very well, and to be able to not be deceived especially when witnessing to cult members. In this case telling our personal testamonies of what God has done in our lives is one of the best ways to witness. They have no testamony. In Rev. 12:11 Satan was overcome by the Blood of the Lamb and the word of their testamony. There has only been one time that I had to confront a demon possessed person. She had become involved in shamenism on an Indian reservation. My back was too the wall and I felt like I was looking into the eyes of pure evil and darkness. Never has my family of believers looks so pure, bright and full of light as after seeing this woman. I hope never to have to do this again. But God was faithful because I knew Who was doing the fighting. I have no power in such situations, but I know Him who does, and He is faithful. This is not a subject I particularly enjoy discussing. I hate to think of the evil I have encountered in my lifetime. My thoughts don't dwell there. They dwell on God's perfect love that casts out fear. They dwell on His admonishment in Deut. 31:8 "And the Lord, he is the One who goes before you. He will be with you, He will not leave you nor forsake you; do not fear nor be dismayed."

I prefer a version that has words added for clarification to be put in italics. KJV, NKJV and NASV do this. I am unaware of any others. This is the first thing I look for. I also look for versions that include verses such as the last of Mark as part of the original text. They were included in the earliest letters of the Apostalic fathers as well as the Gospel of Mark found among the dead sea scrolls which dated to before 50 AD.. I am suspicious of any bible that casts doubt on God's word. As far as I know only one verse in the book of 1 John and the last of the Lord's Prayer are suspect as not being in the original text. Most are proven to be in much earlier papyrii than the "earliest manuscripts".

While we spend time with God personally, and time in His word, hubby and I are intercessors. We pray for family and friends who need Jesus in their lives, who need saving faith, who need healing, who need comfort or jobs. We also pray that we all grow to be more Christ like. So we spend a lot of time praying on behalf of others. We are told to cast all our cares on Him because he cares for us. And we care for family, friends and strangers who are hurting and in need of God's provision. Yes, our God is faithful to answer prayer. He is much more faithful to us than we could ever be to Him. We come to Him with thankful hearts. Prayer is a part of worship. It is acknowledging Him as being in control of all things, our provider, our maker, our healer, God with us, omnicient, omnipresent, omnipotent. It is acknowleding our need for Him in our lives. It is acknowledging our sin and asking forgiveness. It is part of walking with Him, asking for direction and wisdom. It is listening to Him. Sometimes it is just being quiet in His presence.

The best way to witness to cultists is to tell them what Jesus has done in your life, that of your family and to truly testify of the things you yourself have seen and heard. They have no testamony like this. All they can tell about is their church-- Why they think it is right and why they think yours is wrong. Sometimes I go into who the Scriptures say Jesus is. But I know my bible fairly well. Just can't remember where to find verses. So I pray when I see them coming, that God would give me the words that they need to hear. From then on it is kind of fun to hear what comes out of my mouth. It often surprises me and I think hay, that was pretty good! I learn as much as they did because it wasn't from me but from God.

I believe that a backsliding person may allow his heart to grow so cold by the deceitfulness of unrepentant sin that he no longer cares about his relationship with God. Otherwise there would not be so many warnings in the Bible about this. "Today, if you hear His voice, do not harden your hearts as the rebellion, in the day of trial did in the wilderness. Heb 3:7-8, 12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; but exhort one another daily, while it is called TODAY, lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. However, I also believe that we can trust God to keep us. I don't believe that we need to get saved again each time we sin. We do need to repent and confess our sins to God, and sometimes to others we have wronged. The Holy Spirit is great at doing His job. He will not give up on us till we die. Jesus left the 99 to find the one lost sheep. I don't believe that fully committed Christians will fall away. I worry about those who are double minded, partially committed, and the stubborn or unsubmitted to God.

We are told that some get weak and sick and even die because they do not discern the body of Christ in communion by not examining themselves, but have made it a profane feast. 1 Cor 11:27-30, 20-22. 1Cor 5:1-5 tells them to deliver people who are in gross sexual immorality over to satan for the destruction of the flesh, that their spirit might be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. Such activity should never be condoned in the Church. Sickness was sometimes a sign of God's judgement, but in the book of Job it was a sign of the trying of his faith, proving his righteousness. The worst thing we can do is become one of Job's 3 friends and try to figure out what they did to deserve this. I nearly always pray for healing. But I also pray that God would use illness for His glory till He completes that healing. I do not think that sin, pain and sickness are God's perfect will for our lives. No, I do not think that God will heal everyone, and I don't know all the answers on this subject. But I do trust in a loving God who has compassion on those who come to Him; and we have a great High Priest who has been tried in all ways like we have, and who is able to intercede for us in heaven. He suffered on a cross, and knew real pain. Heb. 4:14-16. Isaiah 53:4-6

The basic confessions of faith are pretty well universally accepted: the Apostles Creed and the Nicene Creed. The acceptance of the pre existant Godhead, that they are Creator of heavens and earth, Christ's virgin birth, substitutionary death for our sins, ascension, and return for His Church are fundamental. The person and work of the Holy Spirt: to enlighten, to give power to do God's will, to comfort and be an advocate, to indwell believers sealing us as God's kids and making us part of the invisible body of Christ. Salvation by faith alone is the cornerstone of Protestantism. This is where some bitter arguments still arise. The Spirit of God put a spotlight on Eph. 2:8. and set Martin Luther free from the bondage of trying to be good enough to go to heaven. This same verse set me free, too. But there are people who need to hear that if their faith lies unproductive it is dead. Perhaps the person is backslidden or only has an intellectual belief, and needs to know that saving faith produces faith love and joy that cannot be contained and must be expressed. God's Spirit moves us to reach out to others and to obey parents, husbands and God's Word. These works are not necessary for salvation. They are only natural expressions of our salvation that we grow in. A belief in the inspiration of the Bible, the accuracy, the need to interpret it litterally where ever possible also points the way to a good church. We must see God as He is expressed in Scripture and not toss out passages that disagree with our philosophy. The 66 books remain our canon, and no other writings are to be accepted. Traditions and man's "prophecies" are not basis for doctrine, but are not necessarily evil in themselves unless they contradict Scripture. Most other controversies can become bitter because of the immaturity of the people involved. But they are not foundational to Christianity. So my policy is to avoid foolish and sensless controversies, whether is be about food, holidays, music (but I still like Godly rock and roll). If it is fun to talk about these without people getting upset, it may be OK. Otherwise, just avoid them. They are not necessary for a person's salvation. For instance, baptism should be left to the guidance of the Holy Spirit. When in doubt about a doctrine, check the Bible. I always thought that there are many beautiful genuine Christians in most denominations, and I have been a member of a few that I disagreed with about non essentials. In fact, before joining I told the pastors that I didn't agree with certain doctrines. Two told me "that's OK, you are still saved". I baptised our babies in the Lutheran Church because I wanted to dedicate them to the Lord. I figured after they had accepted Jesus for themselves, they could take part in a believers' baptism. All churches accept believers baptism by immersion. Meanwhile, I loved the Lutheran Church and God sent me there to be grounded in the basics of Christianity. I found their rituals to be meaningful expressions of worship. Nearly every church has special strengths to offer us what we as individuals need in growing into the likeness of Christ. 1 Thess 5:21-22 Test all things; hold fast to that which is good. Abstain from every sort of evil.

We all hope to not hinder others from coming to Christ. However, unbelievers make up their own rules about what a Christian should or should not do, and they are not based on Scripture. For instance, 35 years ago my hubby would refuse to come to the table when dinner was ready and insist we start without him; then he would eat what was left. It aggrevated me, but it was his insistance. His sister accused me of not being a Christian because I did not serve him first at the table. The point is that they have their own ideas of right and wrong that they hold us to. It may involve common courtesy, such as hand written thank you notes. It may involve child raising such as putting a binding around a prodruding umbilicle of an infant. Their bible may be Emily Post or old wives tales and traditions. It may be Ben Franklin or Shakespear. Or it may be "everyone is doing it" and "there is no black and white--only shades of gray", The only way to reach people is to continue to extend Christ's loving forgiveness to them over years, and to pray for them. The very people who accuse us of being judgemental or discriminating against others are usually the ones who are themselves doing those very things. So we pray that God would remove their blindness, soften their hearts, and receive Him in spite of us.

The second part of your question, what kind of commitment is involved. Most churches as you at the time of your baptism if you have accepted Jesus as your Savior and Lord. Rom. 10:9 NASV That if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. Savior: This means that you have turned away from yours sins and turned toward Jesus , asking Him to forgive you. You confess that you believe Jesus died for your sinfulness and that because of His death, your are granted forgiveness. It is more than an intellectual belief about who Jesus is. It is also trusting in His death to make possible your forgiveness; He makes you a clean new person in Him. When we start to realize all that Jesus has done for us and what it cost Him, in gratitude we want to identify with Him and His true believers. That is why we are baptized;, in thanksgiving and love we wish to become more like Him and learn to follow Him. This is the part where we want to make Him Lord of our lives. Lord is not just a title like "Lord Baltimore" or mister, it is more like pledging Him allegiance as we do to our flag or our country when we call Him Lord. Many people want to do this immediately, but Jesus tells us to count the cost. It means giving up our miserable self centeredness, our selfishness, and becoming Christ like in our thinking. He puts in our hearts a desire to obey Him and become like Him, and to read His Word. He changes our desires. Lord is also another name for God or Jehovah. When we receive Him as our Lord, we also receive Him as our God. The Lord our God is one. He is Father, Son and Holy Spirit. One God and one Lord.

Anger, wrath, and chastening: I have to admit that while I am being chastened by God, I definitely feel like He has directed His wrath toward me. But that is not the case. I feel estranged from Him, without the fruit of His Spirit, and definitely wondering, like Job, what I had done. And when all is done, while I usually obey eagerly and out of love, there are occasions when I obey out of the fear of the Lord, which, after all, is the beginning of wisdom. I don't want to be outside of His favor again. I want to remain in the center of His will. No, I don't believe that Christians who seek God's face and continue in His grace will ever experience His wrath, which is directed at His enemies. Psm 17:8 NKJV: Keep me as the apple of Your eye, hide me under the shadow of your wings. NASV translates this as the pupil of Your eye, which is much more meaningful to me. I can imaginine someone poking God in the eye. He has reserved His wrath for those who poke Him in the eye, and for those who persecute His kids. He is a righteous, just God. God tells us to train up a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he will not depart from it. Training involves teaching, rewarding good behavior, and firm correcting. But I do not believe it should involve anger on our part but should always be for the good of our child whom we love. Heb 12:6. v. 10 says God's correction is for our profit , that we may be partakers of His holiness. That should be the aim of our correction of our kids, as well. But He instructs fathers to not PROVOKE your children to WRATH, but to biring them up in the training and admonition of the Lord. Eph 6:4. I believe this is referring to punishment that does not fit the crime. Perhaps it is abusive, harsh and unjust, more to vent the father's anger than to correct the child. This not God's nature. He is just, fair, forgiving, righteous, good and merciful. Gal. 6:20, Eph. 4:26 God's anger is without sin. A broken and a contrite heart He will not dispise. Psm 51:17 In Matt 25:24-25 the unrighteous servent claimed he saw God as hard so he was afraid. This should not be the attitude of kids toward their parents. Our Heavenly Daddy is not hard or abusive, and we should not be terrified of Him either. God directs anger toward those who have done evil in His sight, who are ungrateful and complaining, but most of all for those who are without faith after He has demonstrated Himself over and over to be faithful. Heb. 3:8-11, 19. The sin was unbelief.

Not long after Pres. Obama took office an elderly lady in our church who corresponds with several millatary chaplains was asked for prayer. The chaplains had been told that they could no longer pray in Jesus' name or present the Gospel. Lord, we ask you to protect Your servents in our millitary who love you. Please help them to be as wise as serpents and as innocent as doves. Please save those who are in our government (who act as advisors as well), who are in bitter opposition to You and your Kingdom, just as you did Saul of Tarsus. Please use them for Your glory. In the Name of Jesus Christ our Lord, Amen

Jesus promeised "another comforter" or advocate. He, the Holy spirit, continues to give us light. He sheds light on God's Word and He glorifies Jesus, pointing us to Him just as Jesus came to glorify the Father, pointing us to Him. Jesus Himself embodies Truth. and His Truth sets us free from the bondage of sin and death. He said "I AM the way, the TRUTH and the life. No man comes to the Father but by Me." According to Ephesians 1, when we have Jesus living in us by His Spirit, we have all of the above, so to speak. Eternal Life, Light, love, and all the benefits of being an adopted child of God are ours by virture of Him living in us. It is mind boggeling. It is humbling.

Expository Bible preaching, going through a whole bood of the Bible. Joyful Praise and worship in psalms, hymns and spiritual songs. Thanksgiving. God focused, not people focused. Prayer, which can be a part of the above. The above should equip us to lead others to Christ and disciple them. We should be bringing them to church with us, helping them learn how to use their Bibles, answer their questions, and equiping them to begin their walk with God. Small group studies also help with this, as do Bible studies such as Bible Study Fellowship. Some of the best "soul winners" are just baby Christians, themselves.

Nope. Never heard any of that stuff till nearly 15 years after I was saved. By thay time I was well grounded in the Word. I also watched those who practiced this dieing in spite of their faith, not unlike my aunt who was a Christian Science adherant who died of cancer believing God had healed her. I saw some who believed the prosperity gospel getting credentials as ministers as a tax dodge. I do believe that God heals. But it is due to His Mercy and Grace and not due to my faith. I also believe that God is faithful to us in financial matters when we put Him first in our lives and trusted His Word concerning His providing our basic needs.. Again, it is not so much due to my obedience. It is due to His mercy and grace. My obedience in titheing is just an act of surrender. He also blessed me when I surrendered by submitting to baptism. His greatest blessings have been spiritual rather than physical..

The children of Isreal were no different than we are today. They heard and saw what they wanted to hear and understand. They wanted the Lion of Judah, a conquering king who would deliver them from the ungodly, oppressive Roman rulers. They did not want the Lamb of God Who would take away the sin of the world, the Suffering Servent of Isaiah 42, 52 and 53. Mt.11:16-17 says they piped but you did not dance; He did not perform as they expected so they felt He was not the Messiah. Because they rejected the light that they had, and rejected the Godly , humble Man Who was given them, their understanding was darkened even more. And that happens today to all of us , do. When we reject what light we do have, even that is taken from us. When we embrace the little light we have on the subject, more light is given us. Mt. 25:29. Eph 4:18 Rom. 11:25-27 says that because of Isreal's rejection of the Christ, God has blinded them in part till the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. At that time all of Israel shall be saved. But at the time Christ came to the earth, they had the same chance that we do today. Then they had Christ in the flesh and God's proophets. Today we have the Holy Spirit and the New Testament.

Backto the Bible, The rest of us just need to have God's light to recognize how ugly and putrid our sin is in His eyes. So a person "just" stole a piece of candy from a grocery store as a child, or "only" cheated on their taxes one time; even the fact that we consider our sin less abhorant than the sin of others is in fact self righteousnes and and a gievous offence in God's eyes. We are all sinners saved by grace. God extended His hand to all who recognize their need for a Savior. But He especially reached out to those who are scorned by the rest of society: the poor, the outcasts, the lepers, the prisoners to sin, the brokenhearted; God has chosen the foolish, weak and base people according to the world's standards. 1 Cor 1:27. And only when we consider ourselves to be those things can we truly welcome other outcasts into our midst. No one is basicly a "good" person who just needs forgiveness for a few mistakes. We must compare ourselves to the perfection of Jesus and not to other men. Only God is good. Matt 19:17

I have gone through this many times. Once I had a board member of my church threaten me with his fist my face. He was red faced and in a rage. I was to pay him for work he had done on our house when it sold.. He somehow learned that we had received the check, but it had come on the week end and had not yet even cleared the bank. I wrote him a check but warned him it would not be good till the next day. When I talked to my pastor he had gone before me with a story. I don't know what was said but my pastor would not listen to me. Others had also gone to him accusing me of being an alcoholic or a drug user, neither of which were true but were in fact laughable they were so rediculous. I suspect my accurser in this case was in fact an alcoholic, because once when we were at their home her husband asked her if she wanted some of her wine that she kept in her bedroom. I managed to forgive them because Jesus hung on a cross and said "Father forgive them, they know not what they do". However, I have never trusted them since then. As said, the bibical way to handle this is to go to them, then confront with a Christian friend if they do not listen, then go to the elders or a pastor and ask them for help. Sometimes the system breaks down. Paul warned the Christians to avoid Alexander the Coppersmith because he had done him much harm. Some people try to divide friends, homes, churches, and cause others to follow them. Factious people are to avoided as well. Titus 3:10 There may have been times that I inadvertedly started a rumor or some gossip. I hope not.

Amen! I don't plan on being here. By God's grace I will be with Jesus. Best of luck to those of you who do plan on being here.

People in our church have actively been engaging in adoption from other countries, especially China. They choose children who are disabled and cast offs; some are downs syndrome, one has muscular dystrophy, one is deaf, one has congenital heart defects, that I know of alone. These people are fairly wealthy and also have good insurance so that they can provide the medical needs of these children. They are doing this out of compassion and because they feel that God is directing them to do so. Yes, we are evangelical Christians. I can't help but wonder what satan will attack next to limit the freedom of Christians.

I always thought of it as the shepherd's staff that was used for grabbing ahold of sheep by the hook. The rod is for correcection. Thy rod and thy staff, they somfort me.