Abortion Doctor shot at CHURCH????

[Fez]

I do not sanction murder, I do not sanction abortion (same thing), but the first question I ask myself in such a tragic, devil driven, unbelievable situation, with so many questions, many of them without answers I am capable of finding, is:-

What would Jesus have done? (and that should be the first thing we always ask ourselves)

What would He have said about abortion? - I think we all know the answer

What would He have said about the abortion doctors murder? - I think we all know the answer

What would He have said to the church allowing the doctor to attend? - here I have no answer. I don't know if this is a church, or one that professes to be one. I don't know the heart of the people in the church. I don't know if the church, guided by the Holy Spirit was trying to change the doctors sinful ways. I don't know if the church accepted him as he was and ignored the fact of what he was doing, and stood for (that would be wrong in any situation). I am not the judge, the Lord is.

What would Jesus have said about forgiveness?

But I really think that our only recourse as Christians is to study the Word, and to pray over this terrible thing. And ask the Spirit to lay the answers on our hearts without letting our anger (justifiable anger), or judgemental attitude (He is the ultimate judge, not us) getting in the way.

Keeping in mind that if governments and some churches did not ignore the Word of God, or twist it to fit their own agenda, incidents like this one would be few and far between. And if people who profess to be Christians walked the walk Jesus teaches us to, no one professing to follow Him would pick up a gun and kill someone in the name of our Faith.

Because the damage this does to the Bride of Christ is huge.

[AnnaMoodley]

Was this guy a fully-fledged member of the congregation or was he just at the service?

[nebula]

I wonder why the guy didn't just shoot the doc in front of his office?

His office was heavily guarded. It's in the article.

Church was probably the only place the guy could get to him.

[nebula]

Ummm....Ok shoot me down now (no pun intended), but the best place for this doctor to be was in a church! If the church, through the Lord, was working to change his positon, where better to do it than in a church?

But considering that he was considered by the congregation to be a "good Christian" and a member for many years . . . are you sure by this point his heart had not grown callous?

I saw a video clips with some interviews, and the members thought of him this way, and that he provided excellent medical care to women.

Conviction?????

But have you stopped to think that maybe Jesus was working on this mans heart,

The Bible talks about those who have had their conscious seared. Can you say with certainty, based on the evidence above, that his conscious was not seared?

I don't know if you can read countenances or not, but when I saw the pictures of him in the news articles - his countenance was anything but warm and friendly.

I appreciate your heart for mercy, and I can understand your position from where you are coming from, but consider how many years he's been doing this, how many years he's been a church member . . . and what the Lord says in the Bible about the sacrificing of children. There's a kind of outrage that is expressed in that practice that is not expressed in other sins the Lord held against the people.

and to say he deserved to die, is in itself a sin!

What punishment does a mass murderer of babies deserve then?

Again, I am not saying the man was right for gunning the doctor down. But consider the blood of these babies crying out to the Lord (ref. gen. 4:10).

Yes, "The Lord, the Lord, the compassionate and gracious God, slow to anger, abounding in love and faithfulness, maintaining love to thousands, and forgiving wickedness, rebellion and sin."

But "He does not leave the guilty unpunished; he punishes the children and their children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation."

(Ex. 34:6,7)

There is a balance in this. While you are upset about the lack of mercy, please also do not forget that the Lord is also just

Can we be too quick to judge. Sure. But does it please the Lord to let the guilty go unpunished? I do not see evidence for this in Scripture.

There is a balance. Lord grant that we all find Your balance.

[Guest yod]

I'll say it. That church is as guilty of murder as this guy was.

God hates the wicked and there little doubt about him and this "church"

I'm glad he's dead. He deserved worse....like all of us do...but this will save a few childrens lives.

Where is the mercy for them?

[anitarose]

You know, when I started this post, I never ever dreamed it would hit 15 pages....

My thoughts when I saw this article was the fact that the doctor not only attended church, but that he was an ACTIVE PARTICIPANT (i.e. usher, responsible for a variety of things) in it. Did his fellow congregants know what he REALLY did to provide that "excellent medical care"? Or did they, like he, turn a blind eye and develop that seared consciousness?

I too think that it was horrendous that the man was shot down. But the Scriptures do say "eye for eye", I'm afraid. This man was responsible for probably millions of aborted babies in Kansas. Poetic justice would have been sucking his brain out. But, his family is now suffering because of the act. The pro-life movement is now suffering as well.

I think prayer right now would be an excellent thing, rather than condemnation. Prayer that the family finds peace, that the person that shot the doctor would find peace, and that his church would find peace as well. The peace that passes all understanding---G-d's peace---would be a wonderful thing in this world.

a.

[Believer1997]

I know with all my heart that we do, indeed, serve and worship a Merciful God. I pray that He forgives all the ugliness people do and say in the guise of "His" name. Murder is murder. Of the born or the unborn. God help us when we rejoice in anyone's death who may have died without repentence of their sins. I don't believe that God sent an angry and unstable man to kill that doctor. There is no 'acceptablility' label on one murder over another one. Only God shall judge. Praying. Praying for all those little ones whose lives are cut short by apathy, hate, and all the other things that I know nothing about to cause this... Praying that those doctors who abort these little lives will be burdened by God to stop the insanity and save lives instead of taking them Praying for all of us, as Christians, to love and have the faith that God is in His Heaven and will forgive us for our anger, our ugly thoughts, our words that are full of hate. Thank You God for Your Grace and Mercy to us.... Amen.

[BlindSeeker]

and Christ used Saul/Paul, a murder of his children to become one of the apostles and a good portion of our New Testament is in our hands through Paul....

this is a subject that can be talked about both ways..... should we keep them in our church buildings? so that maybe, must maybe that the Holy Spirit will convict them of their sins?

or

should we ban them from entering in?????

good question.....

let's look at it from another view point....

the woman at the well, 5 husbands, 5 divorces, living with a man that is not her husband, shunned by many... yet, Christ used her to bring a village to Him.....

how about me?

I have lied, stolen, coveted, used the Lords name in vain, not even having used it as a curse word, it was used in vain.....

I was thought of, and was called long before i repented.... I was in church and fellowshiping even before I accepted my salvation (before being saved)..... I was working in the church fellowship, still living in sin (unrepentant) and yet, I was used by God before.....BEFORE..... I gave my life over, and then through the conviction of the H.S., I accepted the Gift of Salvation.

should we allow an abortionist in our midst?

should we allow an adulteress in our midst?

should we allow a liar in our midst?

should we allow a thief in our midst?

should we allow a murder in our midst?

should we allow any sinner in our midst?

mike

1Co 5:1 It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife.

2 And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.

3 For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed,

4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,

5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?

7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:

10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.

11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?

13 But them that are without God judgeth.

Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

[BlindSeeker]

Well it is far more than a matter of allowing an abortionist in their midst. The major mainline Protestant denominations are ALL pro-choice. Of course they allow him in their midst, they agree with him.

For example here is a doctrinal statement of the Presbyterian Church USA the largest Presbyterian group.

http://www.pcusa.org/101/101-abortion.htm

They "may not know when life begins"??????? This is a doctrinal statement of a church? I'm appalled; I had no idea.

Oh yeah, all of those groups I mentioned above are on the same wavelength. They are all pro-choice, they are totally down with that and have been for many decades, simply pick a radical liberal social view, be it gay marriage, ordaining women, abortion and they will be right there agreeing that its all cool.

So when we here this guys church say he was a good Christian, they would simply be following thier own doctrines. You can't throw a guy out who is doing something that you as a church do not believe is wrong.

He was just a tare in a tare gathering church . . . the kind true believers are to be separate from.

[BlindSeeker]

An abortion doctor was shot (and presumably killed) during a church service, and all you can say is, "He should not have been there in the first place." Did that abortion doctor deserve to die like that, in the one place where everyone should feel safe?

This kind of thing makes me physically ill and I can't stand it anymore.

The Christian church was never and is not a safe place. God is dangerous and very scarey if your on the wrong side. The Bible speaks of the Lord being a terror in the night to the wicked.

Amen.

Ac 5:3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?

4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.

5 And Ananias hearing these words fell down, and gave up the ghost: and great fear came on all them that heard these things.

Nu 25:6 And, behold, one of the children of Israel came and brought unto his brethren a Midianitish woman in the sight of Moses, and in the sight of all the congregation of the children of Israel, who were weeping before the door of the tabernacle of the congregation.

7 And when Phinehas, the son of Eleazar, the son of Aaron the priest, saw it, he rose up from among the congregation, and took a javelin in his hand;

8 And he went after the man of Israel into the tent, and thrust both of them through, the man of Israel, and the woman through her belly. So the plague was stayed from the children of Israel.

9 And those that died in the plague were twenty and four thousand.

10 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

11 Phinehas, the son of Eleazar, the son of Aaron the priest, hath turned my wrath away from the children of Israel, while he was zealous for my sake among them, that I consumed not the children of Israel in my jealousy.

Heb 10:31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

Heb 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.