What would have kept Adam from giving his life as a sacrifice for Eve?

[WolfBitn]

Hebrews 10:1-12

The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming-- not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship. 2 If it could, would they not have stopped being offered? For the worshipers would have been cleansed once for all, and would no longer have felt guilty for their sins. 3 But those sacrifices are an annual reminder of sins, 4 because it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins. 5 Therefore, when Christ came into the world, he said: "Sacrifice and offering you did not desire, but a body you prepared for me; 6 with burnt offerings and sin offerings you were not pleased. 7 Then I said, 'Here I am-- it is written about me in the scroll-- I have come to do your will, O God.'" {7 Psalm 40:6-8} 8 First he said, "Sacrifices and offerings, burnt offerings and sin offerings you did not desire, nor were you pleased with them" (although the law required them to be made). 9 Then he said, "Here I am, I have come to do your will." He sets aside the first to establish the second. 10 And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. 11 Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12 But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God.

Christ was the only acceptable, perfect, and holy sacrifice. The entire Bible revolves around that fact. The animal sacrifices never removed the sin they were being offered for, they simply covered it. That is why they had to be repeated over and over again. Jesus Christ was the only acceptable sacrifice, once for all that could remove the sin. Like ServePro "like it never even happened." The question you asked is, indeed, hypothetical, and the answer is a simple one, and several others have given it to you. Adam was created in the image of God. Jesus is God. So no, Adam could not have made his death sacrificial to save Eve. Scripture is pretty plain about that.

So what would you say the requrements of a sacrifice for sin are, as lined out in scripture? Where does it say it has to be 'a' God?

Now i agree He is the perfect sacrifice given once for all... and i agree He is God... what i have a problem with is the assumption that a sacrifice had to be 'God' to be acceptable... the only requirements i see are lined out for us in scripture is that it be 'spotless, blameless, sinless, etc'

[EricH]

It is not as simple as saying that Adam was sinelss at the point that Eve sinned, so he could have served as atonement for her (and us). The scriptures state 2 reasons what Christ was able to serve as our atoning sacrifice:

1. Jesus was obedient for us and established our righteouseness before God. If all Jesus had done was die for our sins, we would still not have merited heaven. It is true that our guilt would be removed, but all that would have done was put us in a similar position to that in which Adam and Eve found themselves before they fell into sin. Namely, not having done anything good or bad yet.

In order to establish our righteouseness before God forever, Jesus had to fulfill all of the requirements of the law. This was His active obedience on our behalf. Jesus did more than just die for us. He became our righteouseness.

For just as through one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, so also through the one man's obedience the many will be made righteous. (Romans 5:19 HCSB)

That is why He said in Matthew 3:15:

Jesus answered him, "Allow it for now, because this is the way for us to fulfill all righteousness." Then he allowed Him to be baptized. (Mattew 3:15 HCSB)

Unless Jesus would have demonstrated this lifelong record of obedience, we would have no obedience to stand on before God.

2. Jesus suffered for us. In addition to obeying God on our behalf, Jesus suffered to pay the penalty for our disobedience. He became sin for us

Adam could not have filfilled all the requirements of the law for us the minute Eve sinned. Therefore he could not have been her righteousness before God.

[WolfBitn]

It is not as simple as saying that Adam was sinelss at the point that Eve sinned, so he could have served as atonement for her (and us). The scriptures state 2 reasons what Christ was able to serve as our atoning sacrifice:

1. Jesus was obedient for us and established our righteouseness before God. If all Jesus had done was die for our sins, we would still not have merited heaven. It is true that our guilt would be removed, but all that would have done was put us in a similar position to that in which Adam and Eve found themselves before they fell into sin. Namely, not having done anything good or bad yet.

In order to establish our righteouseness before God forever, Jesus had to fulfill all of the requirements of the law. This was His active obedience on our behalf. Jesus did more than just die for us. He became our righteouseness.

True... but before Adam had ate of the tree and after his wife had, he was STILL obedient and hed STILL fulfilled the requirement of the law 'thou shalt not eat of the tree'... point being Adam fulfilled your stated requirement here

For just as through one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, so also through the one man's obedience the many will be made righteous. (Romans 5:19 HCSB)

That is why He said in Matthew 3:15:

Jesus answered him, "Allow it for now, because this is the way for us to fulfill all righteousness." Then he allowed Him to be baptized. (Mattew 3:15 HCSB)

Unless Jesus would have demonstrated this lifelong record of obedience, we would have no obedience to stand on before God.

True... but we dont know how long Adam and Eve were in the garden, and at the time she ate, he too had experienced lifelong obedience to that law.

2. Jesus suffered for us. In addition to obeying God on our behalf, Jesus suffered to pay the penalty for our disobedience. He became sin for us

Adam could not have obeyed God for us the minute Eve sinned. Therefore he could not have been her righteousness before God.

What do you think kept Adam from being able to be obedient to God once Eve sinned? He wouldnt have been found guilty if Eve sinned and he didnt

[EricH]

It is not as simple as saying that Adam was sinelss at the point that Eve sinned, so he could have served as atonement for her (and us). The scriptures state 2 reasons what Christ was able to serve as our atoning sacrifice:

1. Jesus was obedient for us and established our righteouseness before God. If all Jesus had done was die for our sins, we would still not have merited heaven. It is true that our guilt would be removed, but all that would have done was put us in a similar position to that in which Adam and Eve found themselves before they fell into sin. Namely, not having done anything good or bad yet.

In order to establish our righteouseness before God forever, Jesus had to fulfill all of the requirements of the law. This was His active obedience on our behalf. Jesus did more than just die for us. He became our righteouseness.

True... but before Adam had ate of the tree and after his wife had, he was STILL obedient and hed STILL fulfilled the requirement of the law 'thou shalt not eat of the tree'... point being Adam fulfilled your stated requirement here

For just as through one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, so also through the one man's obedience the many will be made righteous. (Romans 5:19 HCSB)

That is why He said in Matthew 3:15:

Jesus answered him, "Allow it for now, because this is the way for us to fulfill all righteousness." Then he allowed Him to be baptized. (Mattew 3:15 HCSB)

Unless Jesus would have demonstrated this lifelong record of obedience, we would have no obedience to stand on before God.

True... but we dont know how long Adam and Eve were in the garden, and at the time she ate, he too had experienced lifelong obedience to that law.

2. Jesus suffered for us. In addition to obeying God on our behalf, Jesus suffered to pay the penalty for our disobedience. He became sin for us

Adam could not have obeyed God for us the minute Eve sinned. Therefore he could not have been her righteousness before God.

What do you think kept Adam from being able to be obedient to God once Eve sinned? He wouldnt have been found guilty if Eve sinned and he didnt

It is not a matter of simply remaining sinless, it was fulfilling all of the requirements for the law and God's standards of righteousness. Simply not eating of the tree did not fulfill all of God requirements if righteousness. Once sin entered the world, a whole new dynamic was intoruced necessitating the law. It is not a matter of length of time, it is a matter of fulfilling the requirments of it completely

[WolfBitn]

It is not as simple as saying that Adam was sinelss at the point that Eve sinned, so he could have served as atonement for her (and us). The scriptures state 2 reasons what Christ was able to serve as our atoning sacrifice:

1. Jesus was obedient for us and established our righteouseness before God. If all Jesus had done was die for our sins, we would still not have merited heaven. It is true that our guilt would be removed, but all that would have done was put us in a similar position to that in which Adam and Eve found themselves before they fell into sin. Namely, not having done anything good or bad yet.

In order to establish our righteouseness before God forever, Jesus had to fulfill all of the requirements of the law. This was His active obedience on our behalf. Jesus did more than just die for us. He became our righteouseness.

True... but before Adam had ate of the tree and after his wife had, he was STILL obedient and hed STILL fulfilled the requirement of the law 'thou shalt not eat of the tree'... point being Adam fulfilled your stated requirement here

For just as through one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, so also through the one man's obedience the many will be made righteous. (Romans 5:19 HCSB)

That is why He said in Matthew 3:15:

Jesus answered him, "Allow it for now, because this is the way for us to fulfill all righteousness." Then he allowed Him to be baptized. (Mattew 3:15 HCSB)

Unless Jesus would have demonstrated this lifelong record of obedience, we would have no obedience to stand on before God.

True... but we dont know how long Adam and Eve were in the garden, and at the time she ate, he too had experienced lifelong obedience to that law.

2. Jesus suffered for us. In addition to obeying God on our behalf, Jesus suffered to pay the penalty for our disobedience. He became sin for us

Adam could not have obeyed God for us the minute Eve sinned. Therefore he could not have been her righteousness before God.

What do you think kept Adam from being able to be obedient to God once Eve sinned? He wouldnt have been found guilty if Eve sinned and he didnt

It is not a matter of simply remaining sinless, it was fulfilling all of the requirements for the law and God's standards of righteousness. Simply not eating of the tree did not fulfill all of God requirements if righteousness. Once sin entered the world, a whole new dynamic was intoruced necessitating the law. It is not a matter of length of time, it is a matter of fulfilling the requirments of it completely

Eric, i like your name... thats my name too lol

Let me point out that where this is no law, sin is not imputed the NT tells us.

What this says then in the case of Adam, was that since he and Eve were under ONLY 1 law, as long as they remained obedient to the law, they were fulfilling all righteousness, because there was no other law to break at the time. Sin cannot be charged where there is no law.

[EricH]

It is not as simple as saying that Adam was sinelss at the point that Eve sinned, so he could have served as atonement for her (and us). The scriptures state 2 reasons what Christ was able to serve as our atoning sacrifice:

1. Jesus was obedient for us and established our righteouseness before God. If all Jesus had done was die for our sins, we would still not have merited heaven. It is true that our guilt would be removed, but all that would have done was put us in a similar position to that in which Adam and Eve found themselves before they fell into sin. Namely, not having done anything good or bad yet.

In order to establish our righteouseness before God forever, Jesus had to fulfill all of the requirements of the law. This was His active obedience on our behalf. Jesus did more than just die for us. He became our righteouseness.

True... but before Adam had ate of the tree and after his wife had, he was STILL obedient and hed STILL fulfilled the requirement of the law 'thou shalt not eat of the tree'... point being Adam fulfilled your stated requirement here

For just as through one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, so also through the one man's obedience the many will be made righteous. (Romans 5:19 HCSB)

That is why He said in Matthew 3:15:

Jesus answered him, "Allow it for now, because this is the way for us to fulfill all righteousness." Then he allowed Him to be baptized. (Mattew 3:15 HCSB)

Unless Jesus would have demonstrated this lifelong record of obedience, we would have no obedience to stand on before God.

True... but we dont know how long Adam and Eve were in the garden, and at the time she ate, he too had experienced lifelong obedience to that law.

2. Jesus suffered for us. In addition to obeying God on our behalf, Jesus suffered to pay the penalty for our disobedience. He became sin for us

Adam could not have obeyed God for us the minute Eve sinned. Therefore he could not have been her righteousness before God.

What do you think kept Adam from being able to be obedient to God once Eve sinned? He wouldnt have been found guilty if Eve sinned and he didnt

It is not a matter of simply remaining sinless, it was fulfilling all of the requirements for the law and God's standards of righteousness. Simply not eating of the tree did not fulfill all of God requirements if righteousness. Once sin entered the world, a whole new dynamic was intoruced necessitating the law. It is not a matter of length of time, it is a matter of fulfilling the requirments of it completely

Eric, i like your name... thats my name too lol

Let me point out that where this is no law, sin is not imputed the NT tells us.

What this says then in the case of Adam, was that since he and Eve were under ONLY 1 law, as long as they remained obedient to the law, they were fulfilling all righteousness, because there was no other law to break at the time. Sin cannot be charged where there is no law.

You seem to be confusing not sinning with fulfilling all of God's requirements for righteousness. God's requirements of righteousness have always existed (even before the law was given to Moses). Baptism was not part of the law, but Jesus obeyed it to fulfill all righteousness. Not sinning is not the same as fulfilling all of God's requirements of righteusness. So Adam could have been offered for sin (just as spotless animals were). But he was not able to fulfill all of the requirements God's righteousness.

Romans makes a very interesting statement along the lines of the partial passage you have quoted:

In fact, sin was in the world before the law, but sin is not charged to one's account when there is no law. Nevertheless, death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those who did not sin in the likeness of Adam's transgression. He is a prototype of the Coming One. (Rom

[EricH]

It is not as simple as saying that Adam was sinelss at the point that Eve sinned, so he could have served as atonement for her (and us). The scriptures state 2 reasons what Christ was able to serve as our atoning sacrifice:

1. Jesus was obedient for us and established our righteouseness before God. If all Jesus had done was die for our sins, we would still not have merited heaven. It is true that our guilt would be removed, but all that would have done was put us in a similar position to that in which Adam and Eve found themselves before they fell into sin. Namely, not having done anything good or bad yet.

In order to establish our righteouseness before God forever, Jesus had to fulfill all of the requirements of the law. This was His active obedience on our behalf. Jesus did more than just die for us. He became our righteouseness.

True... but before Adam had ate of the tree and after his wife had, he was STILL obedient and hed STILL fulfilled the requirement of the law 'thou shalt not eat of the tree'... point being Adam fulfilled your stated requirement here

For just as through one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, so also through the one man's obedience the many will be made righteous. (Romans 5:19 HCSB)

That is why He said in Matthew 3:15:

Jesus answered him, "Allow it for now, because this is the way for us to fulfill all righteousness." Then he allowed Him to be baptized. (Mattew 3:15 HCSB)

Unless Jesus would have demonstrated this lifelong record of obedience, we would have no obedience to stand on before God.

True... but we dont know how long Adam and Eve were in the garden, and at the time she ate, he too had experienced lifelong obedience to that law.

2. Jesus suffered for us. In addition to obeying God on our behalf, Jesus suffered to pay the penalty for our disobedience. He became sin for us

Adam could not have obeyed God for us the minute Eve sinned. Therefore he could not have been her righteousness before God.

What do you think kept Adam from being able to be obedient to God once Eve sinned? He wouldnt have been found guilty if Eve sinned and he didnt

It is not a matter of simply remaining sinless, it was fulfilling all of the requirements for the law and God's standards of righteousness. Simply not eating of the tree did not fulfill all of God requirements if righteousness. Once sin entered the world, a whole new dynamic was intoruced necessitating the law. It is not a matter of length of time, it is a matter of fulfilling the requirments of it completely

Eric, i like your name... thats my name too lol

Let me point out that where this is no law, sin is not imputed the NT tells us.

What this says then in the case of Adam, was that since he and Eve were under ONLY 1 law, as long as they remained obedient to the law, they were fulfilling all righteousness, because there was no other law to break at the time. Sin cannot be charged where there is no law.

You seem to be confusing not sinning with fulfilling all of God's requirements for righteousness. God's requirements of righteousness have always existed (even before the law was given to Moses). Baptism was not part of the law, but Jesus obeyed it to fulfill all righteousness. Not sinning is not the same as fulfilling all of God's requirements of righteusness. So Adam could have been offered for sin (just as spotless animals were). But he was not able to fulfill all of the requirements God's righteousness. Not eating from the tree is not synonymous with fufilling all righteousness.

Romans makes a very interesting statement along the lines of the partial passage you have quoted:

In fact, sin was in the world before the law, but sin is not charged to one's account when there is no law. Nevertheless, death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those who did not sin in the likeness of Adam's transgression. He is a prototype of the Coming One. (Rom

[ayin jade]

God would have forgiven both of them. The logic is,

(1) God loves Eve and doesn't want her to die or stay apart from Him. He had to send her out not because He wanted to, but because He had to.

(2) How has God forgiven us? Because a person (Christ) who has committed no sin has given up His life willingly as a sacrifice. Now both He and we are saved. Adam, technically was as pure as Christ before He ate the apple. So had He willingly given up His life,Eve too would have been forgiven.

Gerda, you do realize Jesus is more than man?

[WolfBitn]

How is all righteousness NOT fulfilled in sinlessness Eric?

If one is sinless what righteousness remains unfulfilled in them?

[WolfBitn]

Eric, i like your name... thats my name too lol

Let me point out that where this is no law, sin is not imputed the NT tells us.

What this says then in the case of Adam, was that since he and Eve were under ONLY 1 law, as long as they remained obedient to the law, they were fulfilling all righteousness, because there was no other law to break at the time. Sin cannot be charged where there is no law.

The Bible does not say that that was the only law given to Adam and Eve. It is simply the only one we are told about and the one which they broke. It may have been the only one, it may not have, but any conclusion either way on that point is pure conjecture. You cannot argue a position from silence.

Once again, the Bible is abundantly clear from Genesis to Revelation that Jesus Christ, and Jesus Christ only, was and is the only sacrifice that would be accepted by God. Period. So any other line of thought is theological wheel-spinning. Could Adam have been that sacrifice? No. The Bible has already told us that.

I would like to see a scripture qualifying a sacrifice that disallows it being anything but God... just one please... otherwise i have to consider your opinion unfounded

Also Cobalt, We CAN argue what we are given... and this we know... NO ONE walked in sin until Eve ate of the tree, therefore from the time Eve ate of the tree, to the time Adam ate of the tree, Adam had been fulfilling all righteousness and lacked nothing in it