What would have kept Adam from giving his life as a sacrifice for Eve?

[WolfBitn]

My posts are being ignored. I showed you the scriptural proof.

I addressed your post... your post didnt address the scenario of Adam NOT eating of the tree

its only proof of the situation where he did, which no one argues this

Tell me something... in the OT in the days of Joshuah... were animal sacrifices acceptable to God as a sin sacrifice? What would happen if a man sacrificed his animal in faith, it was accepted and he died... did the blood of the animal not cover his sin?

Only because the animal sacrifice foreshadowed the sacrifice of Jesus. Nothing in that animal sacrifice itself could atone for their sins.

Ok... a foreshadowing, BUT animal sacrifice was nonetheless accepted and this blood was NOT the blood of Christ, YET... it was accepted of God... Now... wasnt Adam himself a foreshadowing of Christ? The first of MANY?

What were the requirements of the animal sacrifice for sin?

The bible doesnt speak of a lot of factual events. Why would it speak of things that are way out there as you propose here? The verse in Revelation does speak about pre-fall, in that Jesus was meant to be our sacrifice even then.

REvelation 13 is of course written form the point of view that God already knew what would happen with Adams fall.. we are asking what would have happened had he NOT fallen....

Someone walking in Agape love and offering himself a sacrifice for sin is NOT way out there at all... we trust our salvation to one who did that... dont you think more people than Christ too have laid down their lives for their friends or family?

[WolfBitn]

In the OT, those who died believing in God went to a place called Paradise, or Abraham's Bosom. They were then freed when Christ died and spend three days in the belly of the earth, becoming victorious over sin, taking with Him the keys of hell and death. Hell is also Hades.

Would they have ever been there had Adam laid down his life instead of eating from the tree?

[ayin jade]

My posts are being ignored. I showed you the scriptural proof.

I addressed your post... your post didnt address the scenario of Adam NOT eating of the tree

its only proof of the situation where he did, which no one argues this

Tell me something... in the OT in the days of Joshuah... were animal sacrifices acceptable to God as a sin sacrifice? What would happen if a man sacrificed his animal in faith, it was accepted and he died... did the blood of the animal not cover his sin?

Only because the animal sacrifice foreshadowed the sacrifice of Jesus. Nothing in that animal sacrifice itself could atone for their sins.

Ok... a foreshadowing, BUT animal sacrifice was nonetheless accepted and this blood was NOT the blood of Christ, YET... it was accepted of God... Now... wasnt Adam himself a foreshadowing of Christ? The first of MANY?

What were the requirements of the animal sacrifice for sin?

Human sacrifice is an abomination to the Lord, except for the one He freely chose to give for us.

Animal sacrifices were ordained by Him. Covered by His blood. Adam could not have covered the blood of animal sacrifices instead of Jesus. To say he could is to equate Adam to Jesus. That is blasphemy.

[WolfBitn]

My posts are being ignored. I showed you the scriptural proof.

I addressed your post... your post didnt address the scenario of Adam NOT eating of the tree

its only proof of the situation where he did, which no one argues this

Tell me something... in the OT in the days of Joshuah... were animal sacrifices acceptable to God as a sin sacrifice? What would happen if a man sacrificed his animal in faith, it was accepted and he died... did the blood of the animal not cover his sin?

Only because the animal sacrifice foreshadowed the sacrifice of Jesus. Nothing in that animal sacrifice itself could atone for their sins.

Ok... a foreshadowing, BUT animal sacrifice was nonetheless accepted and this blood was NOT the blood of Christ, YET... it was accepted of God... Now... wasnt Adam himself a foreshadowing of Christ? The first of MANY?

What were the requirements of the animal sacrifice for sin?

Human sacrifice is an abomination to the Lord, except for the one He freely chose to give for us.

Animal sacrifices were ordained by Him. Covered by His blood. Adam could not have covered the blood of animal sacrifices instead of Jesus. To say he could is to equate Adam to Jesus. That is blasphemy.

No one is comparing Jesus to Adam but the bible itself AJ... Jesus IS the 2nd Adam... why is this?

I see no blasphemy in saying Adams blood was untainted from sin before he ate of the tree... nor do i see blasphemy in saying that he COULD have walked in agape offering his life for Eves...

I just would like to see a passage giving ANY QUALIFICATION other than sinless/spotless... do you know of any?

[~candice~]

My posts are being ignored. I showed you the scriptural proof.

I addressed your post... your post didnt address the scenario of Adam NOT eating of the tree

its only proof of the situation where he did, which no one argues this

Tell me something... in the OT in the days of Joshuah... were animal sacrifices acceptable to God as a sin sacrifice? What would happen if a man sacrificed his animal in faith, it was accepted and he died... did the blood of the animal not cover his sin?

Only because the animal sacrifice foreshadowed the sacrifice of Jesus. Nothing in that animal sacrifice itself could atone for their sins.

Ok... a foreshadowing, BUT animal sacrifice was nonetheless accepted and this blood was NOT the blood of Christ, YET... it was accepted of God... Now... wasnt Adam himself a foreshadowing of Christ? The first of MANY?

What were the requirements of the animal sacrifice for sin?

Human sacrifice is an abomination to the Lord, except for the one He freely chose to give for us.

Animal sacrifices were ordained by Him. Covered by His blood. Adam could not have covered the blood of animal sacrifices instead of Jesus. To say he could is to equate Adam to Jesus. That is blasphemy.

No one is comparing Jesus to Adam but the bible itself AJ... Jesus IS the 2nd Adam... why is this?

I see no blasphemy in saying Adams blood was untainted from sin before he ate of the tree... nor do i see blasphemy in saying that he COULD have walked in agape offering his life for Eves...

I just would like to see a passage giving ANY QUALIFICATION other than sinless/spotless... do you know of any?

The fact that Jesus is the second Adam, in no way places Adam on the same level as Jesus. Adam is a man, Jesus is the Son of God! Adam points to Jesus.

[ayin jade]

No one is comparing Jesus to Adam but the bible itself AJ... Jesus IS the 2nd Adam... why is this?

A type is not always exact. Certainly Hagar isnt really the old covenant, or Sarah really the new covenant, as Paul speaks of in Galatians 4, but merely allegories, types.

I just would like to see a passage giving ANY QUALIFICATION other than sinless/spotless... do you know of any?

Been there and done that.

[WolfBitn]

The fact that Jesus is the second Adam, in no way places Adam on the same level as Jesus. Adam is a man, Jesus is the Son of God! Adam points to Jesus.

yanno andy i think one thing that would help our discussion would be if we just took each other for what we are actually putting into type lol

I made it clear Adam is not equal to Jesus, and yet, Adam was sinless, clean, spotless, without guile, without blemish, and your challenge would be to find any passage at all giving the qualifications of a sacrifice that would go past 'sinless/spotless'... otherwise theres no way to pronounce Adam unacceptable that i can see

[canuckamuck]

Heres what God demanded of a sacrifice

1. sinless/spotless

When Eve fell in her transgression, Adam hadnt yet fallen. He was sinless... spotless... in a glorified situation without internal death working against him.

Christ became our sacrifice because since ADAMS fall, death was pronounced over all mankind. Man therefore since adams fall couldnt live a sinless life. Therefore it was neccessary for Christ to do so...

Hypotheticly... WHAT would have happened had Adam not ate fo the tree, fell on his face before God pleading for Eve? What if he had said FATHER PLEASE... i love her... you gave her to me... please dont destroy her, please take my life and restore her to you?

It seems to me that this is what the bible teaches us... that Christ lived that perfect life, never sinned, He was spotless and sinless and only in this was could He have been our true sacrifice...

What would have kept Adam from being Eves sacrifice for sin, had he never ate of the tree and offered his life for mercy toward Eve?

I am not sure if Eve would have needed a sacrifice. If Adam did not eat of the Tree, God could have worked with it. Because Eve was deceived, But when Adam ate of it and he blamed God and Eve for it, then that set the ball game into a new direction. So, when Adam ate of it and they both did not own up to it, that set the ball rolling in the direction we have now.

I like this post

[~candice~]

The fact that Jesus is the second Adam, in no way places Adam on the same level as Jesus. Adam is a man, Jesus is the Son of God! Adam points to Jesus.

yanno andy i think one thing that would help our discussion would be if we just took each other for what we are actually putting into type lol

I made it clear Adam is not equal to Jesus, and yet, Adam was sinless, clean, spotless, without guile, without blemish, and your challenge would be to find any passage at all giving the qualifications of a sacrifice that would go past 'sinless/spotless'... otherwise theres no way to pronounce Adam unacceptable that i can see

Show me in scripture where it says that a triangle has four sides? What... you can't? Oh well, I must be forced to accept that a triangle has four sides.

Show me in scripture where it says that unicorns don't exist? According to your thinking, if you can't find a counter in scripture, then you assert that your statement is true. This is poor debating!

My point in the above silly examples is that just because something in not found in scripture, doesnt mean it is true.

The onus is not on me to prove that Adam could not have been a perfect sacrifice, but the onus IS ON YOU to prove that he could have been. And you can't find that because, as AyinJade pointed out in Revelations, Jesus was the planned sacrifice before Adam was even created, thus Adam could not be.

Edited July 30, 2009 by ~andy~

[WolfBitn]

Heres what God demanded of a sacrifice

1. sinless/spotless

When Eve fell in her transgression, Adam hadnt yet fallen. He was sinless... spotless... in a glorified situation without internal death working against him.

Christ became our sacrifice because since ADAMS fall, death was pronounced over all mankind. Man therefore since adams fall couldnt live a sinless life. Therefore it was neccessary for Christ to do so...

Hypotheticly... WHAT would have happened had Adam not ate fo the tree, fell on his face before God pleading for Eve? What if he had said FATHER PLEASE... i love her... you gave her to me... please dont destroy her, please take my life and restore her to you?

It seems to me that this is what the bible teaches us... that Christ lived that perfect life, never sinned, He was spotless and sinless and only in this was could He have been our true sacrifice...

What would have kept Adam from being Eves sacrifice for sin, had he never ate of the tree and offered his life for mercy toward Eve?

I am not sure if Eve would have needed a sacrifice. If Adam did not eat of the Tree, God could have worked with it. Because Eve was deceived, But when Adam ate of it and he blamed God and Eve for it, then that set the ball game into a new direction. So, when Adam ate of it and they both did not own up to it, that set the ball rolling in the direction we have now.

I like this post

both you guys just made me LOL