Predestination

[~candice~]

The fact is, God wants all of us, and He hates it when he has to send one of us to Hell. That's why St. Peter is at the gate, so God doesn't have to tell us that we screwed up.

Peace out

~ Beka

Where did you get this idea from? Is there scripture for it? Yes, God hates it when people are sent to Hell. God does not delight in the destruction of the wicked. But God did not place Peter at the gates of heaven so that He wouldn't have to do something painful to Him like sending people to hell. God is not a big softy so full of fluffy love that He Himself cannot deliver judgment and justice.

[humbleseeker]

This is a very metaphysical question. Another like many post No one has the answer too. But dont worry we will all find out one day. Follow Jesus Love God Love people and I think you will find yourself in the place you want to be.

[spiritman]

This is a very metaphysical question. Another like many post No one has the answer too. But dont worry we will all find out one day. Follow Jesus Love God Love people and I think you will find yourself in the place you want to be.

It doesn't seem that hard to me. Let's look at the scripture.

Romans 8:29-30 (NASB)

29 For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren;

30 and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified

The trick here is to make sure that the word predestined is read in context with the word foreknew. In other words God is Omniscient, all knowing. If we could read this simpler it would read; because God knew ahead of time who would serve him; he gave them special favor in the future. however God did not sit down and say tom is going to hell, while jill is going to heaven, because that would null and void freedom of choice, and why witness or evangelize like it says to do in Matthew 29; when the chosen are already picked. what a waste of time. Predestination in the sense of picking ahead of time who will go to heaven and who will go to hell makes no Biblical sense.

[OneLight]

The fact is, God wants all of us, and He hates it when he has to send one of us to Hell. That's why St. Peter is at the gate, so God doesn't have to tell us that we screwed up.

Peace out

~ Beka

Where did you get this idea from? Is there scripture for it? Yes, God hates it when people are sent to Hell. God does not delight in the destruction of the wicked. But God did not place Peter at the gates of heaven so that He wouldn't have to do something painful to Him like sending people to hell. God is not a big softy so full of fluffy love that He Himself cannot deliver judgment and justice.

The Pearly Gates comes from Revelation 21:21

The twelve gates were twelve pearls: each individual gate was of one pearl. And the street of the city was pure gold, like transparent glass.

The "keys to the kingdom" comes from Matthew 16:16-19

Simon Peter answered and said,

[~candice~]

The fact is, God wants all of us, and He hates it when he has to send one of us to Hell. That's why St. Peter is at the gate, so God doesn't have to tell us that we screwed up.

Peace out

~ Beka

Where did you get this idea from? Is there scripture for it? Yes, God hates it when people are sent to Hell. God does not delight in the destruction of the wicked. But God did not place Peter at the gates of heaven so that He wouldn't have to do something painful to Him like sending people to hell. God is not a big softy so full of fluffy love that He Himself cannot deliver judgment and justice.

The Pearly Gates comes from Revelation 21:21

The twelve gates were twelve pearls: each individual gate was of one pearl. And the street of the city was pure gold, like transparent glass.

The "keys to the kingdom" comes from Matthew 16:16-19

Simon Peter answered and said,

[Fez]

This is such a juicy question! And I bet not one of us comes up with the all encompassing, right answer! I will have a go at my interpretation , but need to think for awhile!

[Fez]

Eph 1:4 even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love

Eph 1:5 he predestined us for adoption as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will,

Eph 1:11 In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,

Rom 8:29 For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.

It would seem to me then, that if we are to follow the bible the issue is not if we should have a doctrine of predestination but what kind we should choose. And it is not enough to have just any view, we need to seek the correct view, or we distort the scriptures, the word of God.

The greatest minds in the history of the church have disagreed about it, so what chance do we have? Hmmm.....

Where we often make a mistake is protecting the dignity and freedom of man when we discuss predestination. But we have to, and often don

[~candice~]

Eph 1:4 even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love

Eph 1:5 he predestined us for adoption as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will,

Eph 1:11 In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,

Rom 8:29 For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.

It would seem to me then, that if we are to follow the bible the issue is not if we should have a doctrine of predestination but what kind we should choose. And it is not enough to have just any view, we need to seek the correct view, or we distort the scriptures, the word of God.

The greatest minds in the history of the church have disagreed about it, so what chance do we have? Hmmm.....

Where we often make a mistake is protecting the dignity and freedom of man when we discuss predestination. But we have to, and often don

[~candice~]

Just to tease... LOL

Here is an excerpt from this article here.

What does the Bible mean when it speaks of the "will" of God? Does God always "get his way"? Can his "will" be resisted or frustrated? Consider the following texts:

"I know that You can do all things, and that no purpose [or willing] of Yours can be thwarted" (Job 42:2).

"All the inhabitants of the earth are accounted as nothing, but He does according to His will in the host of heaven and among the inhabitants of earth; and no one can ward off His hand or say to Him, 'What have you done?'" (Dan. 4:35).

"But our God is in the heavens; He does whatever He pleases" (Ps. 115:3; cf. Eph. 1:11).

But we are also told that God "wills" that all be saved (1 Tim. 2:4) and that all "come to repentance" (2 Pt. 3:9). How do we reconcile these seemingly contradictory statements? One answer is found in a distinction between God's preceptive will and his decretive will.

Well worth a read .

[Fez]

Just to tease... LOL

Here is an excerpt from this article here.

What does the Bible mean when it speaks of the "will" of God? Does God always "get his way"? Can his "will" be resisted or frustrated? Consider the following texts:

"I know that You can do all things, and that no purpose [or willing] of Yours can be thwarted" (Job 42:2).

"All the inhabitants of the earth are accounted as nothing, but He does according to His will in the host of heaven and among the inhabitants of earth; and no one can ward off His hand or say to Him, 'What have you done?'" (Dan. 4:35).

"But our God is in the heavens; He does whatever He pleases" (Ps. 115:3; cf. Eph. 1:11).

But we are also told that God "wills" that all be saved (1 Tim. 2:4) and that all "come to repentance" (2 Pt. 3:9). How do we reconcile these seemingly contradictory statements? One answer is found in a distinction between God's preceptive will and his decretive will.

Well worth a read .

I have not yet begun to argue! However, I just know for certain that there will not be a definitive answer at the end of this discussion! So is it worth it? If we keep ourselves on track and you don't call me an airhead all the time, I guess it could be fun! (private joke folks, don't get your nickers in a twist please!)