The danger in believing Pre or Mid trib

[whatsitmean]

The parable of the sower tells us there are always some who fall away because of persecution and such. That is regardless of eschatology. Are trying to stir the mind to an eschatological point of view or to a deeper commitment and closer walk with the Lord. If it is the latter, I may suggest some other approach. This leads to the assumption that an eschatological view implies a shallow relationship and that one is serving the Lord for the things he gets and not for the grace of God in his life.

[Guest LCPGUY]

Sis Sabrina, as a firm pre-tribber, it would not shake my faith at all if were wrong. However since the scriptures clearly and literally point to two comings of Christ, one unexpected, and the other easily computed once the tribulation starts, I seriously doubt I am wrong.

In His Love,

Bro John

[whatsitmean]

I really believe this will be the great falling away when Christians who have been taught that they will not see tribulation find themselves in the middle of Great Tribulation.  They will feel they have been lied to and reject there belief in God and the Church.

This is a great contradiction. During the tribulation there will be large numbers saved, but there will be a great falling away at the exact same time? So what do you think happens? Those who are believers before the anti-Christ appears fall away and the unbelievers get saved? Just a big religious flip flop you say?

[ted]

I'm confused. How do you think that ANYTHING God did would shake my Faith in Him?

t.

[whatsitmean]

I'm confused. How do you think that ANYTHING God did would shake my Faith in Him?

t.

Cheers Ted.

[Trinity]

It sounds like you are a little confused with the who are the Tribulation saints, not the Church, they are the "Followers Of God" during the Tribulation, thus given the name "Tribulation saints."

Revelation 7

13Then one of the elders asked me, "These in white robes--who are they, and where did they come from?"

14I answered, "Sir, you know."

15And he said, "These are they who have come out of the great tribulation; they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Therefore,

"they are before the throne of God

and serve him day and night in his temple;

and he who sits on the throne will spread his tent over them.

We are the Bride of Christ, the Tribulation saints are not.

The Marriage of the lamb is During the Tribulation. How can we be being married in heaven and still being on earth?

The timing of the Rapture is unknown. Paul writes in his letter to the Thessalonian church:

Now, brothers, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. While people are saying, "Peace and safety," destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape. But you, brothers, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. You are all sons of the light and sons of the day. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness. So then, let us not be like others, who are asleep, but let us be alert and self-controlled. (1 THESSALONIANS 5:1-6)

In the previous chapter, Paul was comforting those in the Thessalonian church who feared that those who are dead in Christ will not get raptured (I THESSALONIANS 4:13-15). But Paul said that they will be resurrected (1 THESSALONIANS 4:16) and will precede those who are alive in Christ. Finally those who are alive in Christ will be "CAUGHT UP together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. (1 THESSALONIANS 4:17)" So we can deduce from 1 THESSALONIANS 5:1-2 that Paul is talking about the Rapture. So the Rapture CAN HAPPEN AT ANY MOMENT. Jesus WILL COME LIKE A THIEF IN THE NIGHT. Jesus himself said, "Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. (MATTHEW 24:42)" Jesus also said that no one knows the day or the hour of the Lord's coming. No man, no angel and not even the Son, Jesus Christ knows but only the Father (MARK 13:32). Paul in 1 THESSALONIANS 5:1 didn't need to tell about date-setting for it is pointless because the Lord will come like a thief in the night at an hour unexpected just like in the days of Noah when they were eating, drinking, partying, and SINNING (MATTHEW 24:37-38). Those people LIVED FOR TODAY but for the wrong reasons. Instead of living for God they lived for themselves and it was until the rain started that they realized THEY WERE WRONG. Paul says that we have the light which is Jesus Christ and we should always be watchful, alert, and of self-control lest we be caught unaware when that day comes. Since the Rapture is PRE-TRIBULATION, it causes Christians to lead holy lives in expectation and preparation that the Lord will COME AT ANY MOMENT! When the church loses focus of this then it becomes carnal and spiritually dead. Other rapture views say that the Pre-Trib Rapture gives believers a false security BUT on the contrary it makes believers lead right lives before God or else they will be LEFT BEHIND! Live for God NOW not when you realize it is too late and you have to live during the dreadful seven year Tribulation. John 3:2-3 says, "Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when he appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is. Everyone who has this hope in him purifies himself, just as he is pure." THIS IS THE BLESSED HOPE, THE RAPTURE WHICH PURIFIES THE BELIEVER BY HAVING HIM/HER LIVING FOR JESUS NOW INSTEAD OF IN THE TRIBULATION WHEN FACING PLAGUES, THE MARK, AND MARTYRDOM.

[Guest LCPGUY]

Well stated Trinity

In His Love,

Bro John

[whatsitmean]

The rapture question is first one of ecclesiology, then eschatology. If you understand who the church is, it is not hard to understand why it is not part of the seventieth week.

[Jedi4Yahweh]

The pre-trib is based on presumption not truth.

Amen...!!!

[Jedi4Yahweh]

Sis Sabrina, as a firm pre-tribber, it would not shake my faith at all if were wrong. However since the scriptures clearly and literally point to two comings of Christ, one unexpected, and the other easily computed once the tribulation starts, I seriously doubt I am wrong.

In His Love,

Bro John

Please show us clearly where their is two comings of Christ in scripture.