Is suicide an "unforgivable" sin

[Fez]

the truth is if you kill yourself you are playing with the fires of hell.

What if one lays down their life to save another? Is that not also self-destruction for a cause?

And where in the Bible does it say the blood of Jesus covers all sin except suicide?

And if you say it's self murder, the Bible says if we hate anyone we are murderers at heart. The Bible says we should not murder, but if we break even one commandment we are guilty of breaking them all - so we are all murderers.

I don't think anyone is saying that the blood of Jesus covers all sins but suicide. I am saying that the blood of Jesus covers all past sins and present sins when someone gets saved, but does not cover all future sins done wilfully. One has to repent of those kind of sins to get forgiveness, therefore, since one cannot repent once they kill themselves, it is not possible for them to be forgiven. In the case of hating someone without a cause, (you left out the without a cause part), that is not a wilful sin. It is a matter of the heart, and it doesn't become wilful till God brings the sin to the attention of the guilty party.

Judgment is His, and who is to say what His judgment will be? Suicide is sin like any other sin. Had God wanted us to know that it was up there with the unpardonable sin He would have said so in His word.

[Guest lovinghim4ever]

I'm just so very thankful that God's mercy endures FOREVER!

(1 Chronicles 16:34)

[Guest lovinghim4ever]

I'm just so very thankful that God's mercy endures FOREVER!

(1 Chronicles 16:34)

And yet there are many that will be sentenced to spend eternity in hell. God is not mocked.

you're right, butero. just ask the pharisees.

Being under grace I don't believe God is as hard on us as we are on each other.

True!

God is not mocked, yet His mercy still endures forever.

Whereas the mercy of this world seems non-existant.

[Fez]

One has to repent of those kind of sins to get forgiveness, therefore, since one cannot repent once they kill themselves, it is not possible for them to be forgiven.

where in the Bible does it say this? where does it say that after salvation, and after the new covenant, we are to ask for forgiveness?

1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

are you sure that's not talking about initial salvation? and it certainly doesn't say that we need to repent of all willfull sins in order to enter heaven. and it doesn't say that if we don't "repent" of them they are not forgiven.

so i ask again, where does the Bible say what you have said?

I feel confident it is not just talking about initial salvation, so I did just tell you where the Bible says what I told you it says. You have added additional questions. First, where does it say we need to repent to be forgiven? In this scripture, it clearly says "if" we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins. It says it in that verse. As for wilful sins, it says in Hebrews 10:26,27

26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

There is nothing in the Bible that says that when you get saved, all sins past, present, and future are automatically covered by the blood, though I hear that promoted by those who believe in the "perseverance of the saints" doctrine.

Read the entire passage in context, who was Paul talking to, and what was he telling them?

Heb 10:24 And let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works,

Heb 10:25 not neglecting to meet together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another, and all the more as you see the Day drawing near.

Heb 10:26 For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,

Heb 10:27 but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries.

Heb 10:28 Anyone who has set aside the law of Moses dies without mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses.

Heb 10:29 How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has spurned the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace?

Heb 10:30 For we know him who said, "Vengeance is mine; I will repay." And again, "The Lord will judge his people."

Heb 10:31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

Heb 10:32 But recall the former days when, after you were enlightened, you endured a hard struggle with sufferings,

Heb 10:33 sometimes being publicly exposed to reproach and affliction, and sometimes being partners with those so treated.

Heb 10:34 For you had compassion on those in prison, and you joyfully accepted the plundering of your property, since you knew that you yourselves had a better possession and an abiding one.

Heb 10:35 Therefore do not throw away your confidence, which has a great reward.

[Nyoka]

To all those who believe a successful suicide will send you to hell due to not being able to repent of it I would like to ask you a question.

When you die: are you 100% positive that you have asked forgiveness for every sin you have ever committed up to that point or do you just ask for a general forgiveness and hope it covers everything?

If a successful suicide sends you to hell then so will any other sin you forget to ask forgiveness for.

[Fez]

To all those who believe a successful suicide will send you to hell due to not being able to repent of it I would like to ask you a question.

When you die: are you 100% positive that you have asked forgiveness for every sin you have ever committed up to that point or do you just ask for a general forgiveness and hope it covers everything?

If a successful suicide sends you to hell then so will any other sin you forget to ask forgiveness for.

Good point, Amen

[Fez]

One has to repent of those kind of sins to get forgiveness, therefore, since one cannot repent once they kill themselves, it is not possible for them to be forgiven.

where in the Bible does it say this? where does it say that after salvation, and after the new covenant, we are to ask for forgiveness?

1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

are you sure that's not talking about initial salvation? and it certainly doesn't say that we need to repent of all willfull sins in order to enter heaven. and it doesn't say that if we don't "repent" of them they are not forgiven.

so i ask again, where does the Bible say what you have said?

I feel confident it is not just talking about initial salvation, so I did just tell you where the Bible says what I told you it says. You have added additional questions. First, where does it say we need to repent to be forgiven? In this scripture, it clearly says "if" we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins. It says it in that verse. As for wilful sins, it says in Hebrews 10:26,27

26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

There is nothing in the Bible that says that when you get saved, all sins past, present, and future are automatically covered by the blood, though I hear that promoted by those who believe in the "perseverance of the saints" doctrine.

Read the entire passage in context, who was Paul talking to, and what was he telling them?

Heb 10:24 And let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works,

Heb 10:25 not neglecting to meet together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another, and all the more as you see the Day drawing near.

Heb 10:26 For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,

Heb 10:27 but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries.

Heb 10:28 Anyone who has set aside the law of Moses dies without mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses.

Heb 10:29 How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has spurned the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace?

Heb 10:30 For we know him who said, "Vengeance is mine; I will repay." And again, "The Lord will judge his people."

Heb 10:31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

Heb 10:32 But recall the former days when, after you were enlightened, you endured a hard struggle with sufferings,

Heb 10:33 sometimes being publicly exposed to reproach and affliction, and sometimes being partners with those so treated.

Heb 10:34 For you had compassion on those in prison, and you joyfully accepted the plundering of your property, since you knew that you yourselves had a better possession and an abiding one.

Heb 10:35 Therefore do not throw away your confidence, which has a great reward.

He was writing to Jewish Christians.

Heb 10:29 How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has spurned the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace?

About the unforgivable sin

[Nyoka]

No it won't. The only sins that will cost you your salvation are those done wilfully that you don't repent of. Part of the Lord's prayer says, "Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our tresspasses, as we forgive those that tresspass against us." If what you are saying is true, then the prayer Jesus gave us to pray has flaws in it, because God won't forgive us for those things we forgot. Wilful sins that we commit and don't repent of are not automatically covered by the blood, but sins done in ignorance are till they are brought to our attention by God. If he brings them to our attention, then we are to confess them specifically.

The Lords prayer nowhere says it is only talking about willful sins. It says "trespasses" with no mention of only willful sins. Saying that this means only willful sins is reading into the scripture that which isn't there. Also I am not the one who believes that a successful suicide means you automatically go to hell. You do so please don't attribute to me what I haven't said or implied. Self murder is a forgivable sin. If a successful suicide can't be forgiven because the person has died then nor can any other sin that you have forgotten to confess before you die. Also please show me where in the bible it says that if you forget to confess a sin, or are unable to, before you die you automatically go to hell.

Edited April 18, 2010 by Nyoka

[Nyoka]

Butero I read those verses in Hebrews differently than you do. I don't want to get into a big debate over them. This is not an issue which affects our salvation so we can agree to disagree on it.

God's blessings upon you

Edited April 18, 2010 by Nyoka

[Rick-Parker]

Once again, Christ's death on the Cross paid for the believers sins, past, present and future. "We are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. And every priest stands daily ministering and offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. But this man, after He had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever [past, present and future] sat down at the right hand of God . . . . For by one offering has He perfected forever those who are being sanctified." Hebrews 10:10-12, 14