The true birth date of Jesus

[Massorite]

Yes folks I am still here and still preaching that which you all dislike so much. But what the hay. I got to do what God has put in me to do.

We can not know for sure the exact day on which Christ was born, but using the Word of God, we can know the time of year he was born in. A normal year on the Hebrew calendar consists of twelve lunar months of 29 or 30 days, for a total of 354 days in a year instead of 365. Twelve out of every 19 Jewish years needs 48 weeks of temple duties and three festival weeks of temple coverage, in which priests perform certain tasks and rituals and Zacharias the father of John the Baptist was one of those priests, and there were certain times during the year that he had to be at the temple officiate. Luke 1:5

[Guest shiloh357]

Yes folks I am still here and still preaching that which you all dislike so much. But what the hay. I got to do what God has put in me to do.

You might be doing what A god told you to do, but you did not get this trash from the God of the Bible.

In Judaism there is a new year that starts in August for the tithing of animals,

Actually, the new year begins in late September AND it is the agricultural year that revolves around seed time and harvest. Furthermore, it was a calendar that the pagans created long before Israel was even on the scene. It is THE Jewish new year and is celebrated on Tishre 1. Stranglely the Jews continued to celebrate the revolution of the year right alongside the pagans and Jesus NEVER condemned them for it.

The Jewish calendar even contains the names of pagan gods and Jesus never seemed to get around to condemning that.

[other one]

actually you can know the exact date of Jesus's birth.....

[other one]

In case you missed it in the other thread:

The world was transfixed by the year 2000--worried about the'Y2K' bug in computers,

millennial madness in cult groups, political union in Europe, and a proposal to make

Mary "co-redemptrix" in the Catholic Church. While Rome flirted with blasphemy, few

realized that the true 2000th lunar anniversary of the birth of Jesus was August 22, 1998,

or on September 11, 1998 by the solar calendar dating we now use.

Many may live to see the consequences of the anniversary, if it foreshadowed a coming

fake Christ. Or at the least, there were dozens of lunatics eager to take advantage of the

year 2000 hysteria to get the attention of the gullible.

Yet the 2000th anniversary of the Nativity actually came 475 days before year 2000

began. The correct anniversary date was about sundown, Jerusalem time, the end of the

Sabbath, Saturday August 22, 1998.

How can we know the exact day--and nearly the hour--of the birth of Jesus?

Simple arithmatic. A child could have done it, if only the basic assumptions had been

correct. But they weren't. In the 19th century, critical scholars made a crucial decision to

reject a total lunar eclipse in January 1 BC and to accept instead one in March 4 BC, as

the chronological cornerstone for dating the death of Herod the Great, and thereby, the

possible birth years for Jesus.

By so doing, the critics could argue Jesus had to born before 4 BC, contradicting

Luke, who tied Jesus' 30th year to the 15th year of Tiberius Caesar, 27-28 AD. Luke

effectively placed the birth in 3 BC, as did many of the early church fathers. Ironically,

even the date used by the Pope during the Christmas Eve midnight mass ritual is itself

consistent with the last half of 3 BC.

The dirty little secret is that virtually all the available evidence has always pointed

at the harvest period of 3 BC as the focal point of the Nativity--including the possibility

of a late summer birth.

By rejecting Luke, scholars also threw out the date of the birth Luke gives in his

Gospel. In his second chapter, Luke tells what happened the day Mary came to the

Temple for purification 40 days after the birth of Jesus. All one has to know is what

day this was. And Luke plainly names the day. In fact, he includes three statements

identifying the day. So what day was this?

Yom Kippur. The Day of Atonement. The 10th day of the seventh month of the

Hebrew calendar.

In Luke's time, Yom Kippur was called three things: The day of the "Fast," the day

of the "Purification,"and the day of "Redemption." Luke uses all three to identify the

day Jesus was brought to the Temple. And he even quotes the Torah rule that mandates

the 40-day period for the mother to wait after the child's birth [Lk 2:22-38].

And if there were any doubt that it was Yom Kippur, Luke tells of a woman named

Anna who had been in the Temple for a "night and day" without leaving. There was

ONLY ONE DAY A YEAR when a person could pray overnight in the Temple: Yom

Kippur. All other days, the Temple was locked at sundown.

This shows the 40th day of Mary's Purification had begun at the end of Yom Kippur,

the end of the 10th day of the 7th month, because we know the Purification was done at

the earliest opportunity--at the beginning of the 40th day after birth. And since the 6th

month normally had only 29 days, simple arithmatic shows Mary's 39 days of Purification

had to have begun around sundown on the 1st day of the 6th month, called Elul.

This was the night of the first sighting of the new moon of Elul. The Magi in Babylon

were recording this sunset sliver of the new moon on a clay tablet. The cuneiform tablet

the Magi made at that hour 2000 years ago, along with thousands of others from Babylon,

resides in the British Museum. It is possible that this clay tablet was inscribed by one of

the famous Magi who later brought a strange set of gifts to Bethlehem. So the new moon

seen by the Magi in Babylon at the very moment of Jesus being born is recorded on one of

the tablets now in London. Cuneiform scholars have identified the date on this tablet as

equivalent to September, 11, 3 BC.

The Hebrew lunar calendar dates vary with respect to our solar calendar. So the 1st

of Elul was September 11th in 3 BC, but began on August 22 in 1998. The same was true

in the days of the early church, of course. In a given year, the 1st of Elul could have fallen

on September 8th, for example.

This may solve another ancient mystery. No one seems to know how Rome came to

honor September 8th as the birthday of Mary. There is no Biblical, historical, or church

tradition to explain it. It just emerges out of nowhere. Rome keeps the 8th of December as

the Feast of the Immaculate Conception of Mary [ie. conceived without original sin]. It is

a holy day of obligation for all Catholics to attend Mass. This feast is clearly based upon

September 8th also, and mortal sin is attached to the failure of a Catholic to observe it, yet

the origins of these dates are unknown.

On the other hand, we can now see that if Jesus were born on September 11th as Luke

indicates, then Jesus would have been conceived around December 8th in 4 BC. The now

mysterious Mary dates fit Jesus quite well. How might this have happened?

In the late 4th century, in early 380 AD, Pope Damasus I was endeavoring to force all

Christians in the Roman Empire to yield to his authority. He got the Emperor to issue an

edict requiring them to practice the religion of Rome. We know that it is about this time

the Christmas midnight Mass was first celebrated and December 25th first identified as a

Catholic holy day. It is said Damasus was seeking to lure the people away from pagan

rites honoring the birth of the sun god at midnight by compelling Catholic attendance at a

memorial in honor of Christ's death, ie the Mass. The people confused this Mass with the

pagan solar birth rituals conducted at that same time. Gradually, the Christ-Mass became

associated with the Nativity.

Meanwhile, the true feast around September 8th, which naturally honored Mary in

giving birth to Jesus, was converted into a day commemorating her own birth, and an old

holyday honoring the conception of Jesus was converted into a day commemorating the

conception of Mary on December 8th. Strangely, there is still widespread belief among

non-Catholics that this is the day Jesus was concieved--a possible lingering remembrance

of the original meaning of this date.

We can also tell from Luke's Gospel that Jesus had been born in early evening, for

Luke says the shepherds were keeping watch by night, but still had time to go into town

and tell the people what they had seen earlier that evening. People rose early with the sun

in those days, and would have been asleep by 9 or 10 pm. Therefore, the birth had taken

place no later than 8 pm, and probably before 7 pm. Yet Luke says it happened at night,

which means after sunset--surely after 6 pm in September. Hence, it follows that Jesus

was born within a few minutes of 6:30-7:30 pm on the evening of September 11th, 3 BC.

A confirmation of this time is in the book of Revelation. Historian Ernest L. Martin

consulted NASA lunar-phase tables and found the image of the heavens in Revelation 12

showed where the sun and the moon were, relative to Virgo, at the time Jesus was born,

pin-pointing sunset of September 11th of 3 BC. It seems the moon moves so quickly it is

"beneath the feet" of Virgo only a few hours every month. Moreover, the moon comes

within two lunar diameters of Virgo's feet at the time of a new moon but once in 30 years.

The only such occurance any time near the birth of Jesus was on September 11th, 3 BC.

Most previous attempts at determining the birth time were based upon astrology and

dating the Star of Bethlehem. No one considered 3 BC because that year had erroneously

been assumed to follow Herod's death. However, Dr. Martin has proven that Herod did

not die in 4 BC, but in 1 BC. Scholars are now generally accepting the new chronology for

Herod, and this in turn has allowed the confirmation of the New Testament date for the

birth of Jesus. Unfortunately, many churches continue to promote the critics' errors and

paganized traditions about the Nativity.

that being said, I don't see anything wrong with people celebrating his birth on whatever day they wish. I don't like the pagan traditions myself, but who am I to judge someone elses heart on the matter.

[nChrist]

Christmas is a beautiful time of the year for most Christians to get together, worship God, and have a time of sweet fellowship in the Lord. The ACLU and other Anti-Christ organizations have done much to try and stop this beautiful time of the year, and it's a mystery why some self-professing Christians have joined the stopping Christmas effort. Most churches also have special services at Christmas, and many people who don't normally go to church attend and get to hear the Gospel of the Grace of God.

It's offensive that Scriptures are twisted to make some sort of prohibition against observing Christmas. The day that Jesus Christ was born is not material because He is Lord over all days, and we should be worshiping Him on all days. Most people get a few extra days off and it's used by most Christians to get together and honor God. Even a legalistic argument has to be twisted severely in the attempt to bash Christmas. Frankly, I find it offensive to say the least. People trying to bash Christmas aren't doing God's work at all, rather working against God. Trying to create a Biblical prohibition of Christmas results in FALSE TEACHING at the least.

Matthew 22:36-40 KJV Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Colossians 2:13-17 (KJV) 13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; 14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; 15 [And] having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. 16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body [is] of Christ.

Trying to judge and condemn others for observing Christmas would be similar to the acts of a Pharisee, and we know how Jesus Christ felt about them. I've heard every possible Christmas bashing exercise every year, and I simply mark the argument off as heretical and a waste of time. If anything, it makes me more determined to observe Christmas. God is well pleased with what my family does at Christmas. For the Christmas bashers, go somewhere and hide at Christmas and mind your own business.

[benjamin-benjamin]

Hopefully this is not taken the wrong way, but don't you think maybe there is a reason the bible doesn't tell us the exact date and more importantly can you imagine all the good you could learn/accomplish if all this effort to "find" Jesus's birthday was actually put into REAL, quality research on Jesus's teaching?

[Fez]

Here we go with the Christmas silly season again

When was Jesus actually born?

"In the beginning was the Word"

He was never born, He always has been...

When He came to earth as a man?

It makes absolutely no difference to our Faith, nor our belief (well it shouldn't, because there are far more important things to concentrate on).

Why is it that a bunch of fat guys on street corners, many looking like homeless people in red bio hazard suits ringing a bell in our faces, invoke such a hysterical response? It's not an anthrax attack.

Blessings

[Believer1997]

If we celebrate His Birth, His Life and His Sacrifice each and every day we are going to get 'it' right! I personally enjoy celebrating with family and fellowship on December 25. Seems as good a day as any. I'm going to rejoice EVERYday.... People get far too caught up in their own certainties of when, where, what .... and as one poster said - it takes away from the message He was teaching. So - celebrate on Dec. 25, Oct 1, Sept. 22, August 3 .... it does not matter as long as you have Christ in your heart and your eyes on Him. Blessings to all!

[Fez]

If we celebrate His Birth, His Life and His Sacrifice each and every day we are going to get 'it' right! I personally enjoy celebrating with family and fellowship on December 25. Seems as good a day as any. I'm going to rejoice EVERYday.... People get far too caught up in their own certainties of when, where, what .... and as one poster said - it takes away from the message He was teaching. So - celebrate on Dec. 25, Oct 1, Sept. 22, August 3 .... it does not matter as long as you have Christ in your heart and your eyes on Him. Blessings to all!

Amen K! Amen!

[~candice~]

Some people can't see the forest, because they are too busy reading the tea leaves.

Jesus came to earth, was born as a man, would eventually die on the cross for our sins and redeem us. Celebrate!