Are you saved by grace alone?

[Guest Xan]

My version says in Prov. 20:1 "Wine is a mocker, strong drink a brawler, and whoever is intoxicated by it is not wise."  There is a difference between having one glass with a sabbath dinner or Passover and beign intoxicated.

Proverbs 31:1-9 is talking about drinking while making judgements because drinking can lead to poor decision making.  I don't drink while I am working, driving, etc.

There is only one kind of wine before the invention of non-alcoholic wine.  The Bible clearly states Yeshua (Jesus) turned water into wine, and the Bible clearly states that He drank wine at Passover.

Psalms 104:15 "And wine which makes man's heart glad..."

I Tim. 5:23 "No longer drink water exclusively, but use a little wine for the sake of your stomach and your frequent ailments."

[Guest harvester]

It only takes one drink for your thinking patterns to be altered,

and if after one drink someone does drive and gets stopped by the cops, they would not be able to drive home, for their alcohol level would be to high!

When having one drink the

[Guest Xan]

You asked some good personal questions.  I used to go to a friend's house for erev shabbat (eve of sabbath), and it is traditional to have a glass of wine.  Her middle son was estranged from her, but when he came back home, she got rid of the wine in her house, if she had any, and we no longer had wine with our shabbat meal.  That is OK.  We don't have to drink.  I never drink to get drunk.  I don't drink even one glass and drive, and I don't make any decisions even if I have had one glass.  BTW, one glass of wine or beer is not enough to cause the blood alcohol level to exceed the legal limits in Texas, but I'm still not drinking and driving.

Outside of the situation with my friend's son, there has never been a problem with outsiders and my buying or drinking wine.  I don't go to bars, and I go to a liquor store around the corner from where I work because of convenience.  Would it be better if I went to a grocery store?  If I saw anywhere in the Bible where it says it is a sin to drink at all, I wouldn't.

Catholics have wine for their communion.  I don't think anyone thinks that impedes their witness, do you?

[Guest suzie]

Grace alone !!!!!!!  The only good inside me is the good that Jesus brings.

[Guest harvester]

Hi, Xan

You mentioned that in your state one glass is not enough to get you in trouble, or does not exceed the legal limits.

I do know here in Canada, they have done extensive tests

and yes it only takes one drink to impair a persons driving ability, most people who drink anyway no matter if they have had one or ten, are convinced in their own minds that they are not affected by what they have had to drink.

With the knowledge we have today that even one drink can alter our thinking, what is it when we think or say that Jesus drank wine, would he allow himself, perfect in all his ways, Holy Just and True, to consume a drink that would alter his thinking?

His blood was the only blood that  could wash away the sins of the whole world, because He is God, Holy Just and True.

The fermentation stage of the grape, or any fruit for that matter is called rotting in a lesser word, even animals that eat to much fruit that has fallen from the trees and has gone rotten, get drunk.

The cup which represents the Lord's blood, Luke 22:20

would not be represented by a wine that is fermented, for His blood is pure, it would not be represented by a wine that alters the mind's thinking ability, For Jesus is without sin, if he had drank wine that alters his thinking, well he just wouldn't have been able to think straight, He is God, Pure Holy and Just.

Romans 12 And be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may be able to prove, what is that good, and acceptable and perfect will of God.

Praise the Lord for his faithfullness to us.

Is there a subject started on this topic of drinking here somewhere?

[Guest Xan]

Hi, Xan

You mentioned that in your state one glass is not enough to get you in trouble, or does not exceed the legal limits.

I do know here in Canada, they have done extensive tests

and yes it only takes one drink to impair a persons driving ability, most people who drink anyway no matter if they have had one or ten, are convinced in their own minds that they are not affected by what they have had to drink.

I realize that, Harvester, which is why I said I don't drink even one glass and drive.

As to why Jews, including Yeshua drink wine on Passover.  Don't know, but the Bible and traditions both say they do/did.

I would like to start a new topic about alcohol using the discussions from this thread.  Unfortunately, I don't know how to cut and paste.

[Guest Tigershark]

Studies have shown that Over The Counter (OTC) medications can impair any fine motor skill activity.  Does that mean that christians should not take OTC meds?

Almost every script medication causes some sort of mental effect on the brain. should chrisitans not take and doctor recommended medications?

I will locate and show that studies have shown that certain foods alter brain function (I present turkey, which causes sleep, therefore altering brain function)  Does that mean that christians should not eat turkey, or anyother brain altering foods?

The point being, that if a call is made to not make any judgements before drinking even a single glass, and that call is lived up to.  No harm-no foul.

[Guest InHisLove]

Grace alone !!!!!!!

[tsth]

Dear IHL,

Your posts are such an encouragement to me.  I am in agreement with you on the Scriptures you posted.

(p.s.-on the drinking issue, I love wine, it is good to me, but....Jesus spoke to me, when He said He would not drink of the vine until we meet in heaven.  If He is waiting for me to come and drink wine with Him, then I will do the same.)

Matthew 26:29 But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in My Father's kingdom."

In His Love,

Suzanne

[Guest Xan]

(p.s.-on the drinking issue, I love wine, it is good to me, but....Jesus spoke to me, when He said He would not drink of the vine until we meet in heaven.