Rejecting Christ - The Point of No Return?

[TXDisciple]

Hello Everyone,

The following verses are of a most serious nature. In fact, they speak of eternal consequences and not good ones at that. Over the years I have read many opinions and commentaries regarding what they mean and I would like to read of other peoples viewpoints on these scriptures and how they understand them. I do have my own firm understanding of these scriptures and originally elaborated quite a bit more in this initial post but deleted those comments until a bit later.

So please post your understanding of the following verses:

(Heb 6:1 [KJV])

Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

(Heb 6:2 [KJV])

Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

(Heb 6:3 [KJV])

And this will we do, if God permit.

(Heb 6:4 [KJV])

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

(Heb 6:5 [KJV])

And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

(Heb 6:6 [KJV])

If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

(Heb 6:7 [KJV])

For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:

(Heb 6:8 [KJV])

But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

Regards,

Jay

Edited for incorrect spelling!

Edited February 11, 2011 by TXDisciple

[Littlelambseativy]

The following is from Matthew Henry's commentary- It is difficult to piece it out as you wanted it.

Chapter 6

The Hebrews are urged to go forward in the doctrine of Christ, and the consequences of apostacy, or turning back, are described. (1-8) The apostle expresses satisfaction, as to the most of them. (9,10) And encourages them to persevere in faith and holiness. (11-20)

<a href="http://www.biblestudytools.com/bible/passage.aspx?q=Hebrews+6:1-8" style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(51, 102, 153); ">Verses 1-8 Every part of the truth and will of God should be set before all who profess the gospel, and be urged on their hearts and consciences. We should not be always speaking about outward things; these have their places and use, but often take up too much attention and time, which might be better employed. The humbled sinner who pleads guilty, and cries for mercy, can have no ground from this passage to be discouraged, whatever his conscience may accuse him of. Nor does it prove that any one who is made a new creature in Christ, ever becomes a final apostate from him. The apostle is not speaking of the falling away of mere professors, never convinced or influenced by the gospel. Such have nothing to fall away from, but an empty name, or hypocritical profession. Neither is he speaking of partial declinings or backslidings. Nor are such sins meant, as Christians fall into through the strength of temptations, or the power of some worldly or fleshly lust. But the falling away here mentioned, is an open and avowed renouncing of Christ, from enmity of heart against him, his cause, and people, by men approving in their minds the deeds of his murderers, and all this after they have received the knowledge of the truth, and tasted some of its comforts. Of these it is said, that it is impossible to renew them again unto repentance. Not because the blood of Christ is not sufficient to obtain pardon for this sin; but this sin, in its very nature, is opposite to repentance and every thing that leads to it. If those who through mistaken views of this passage, as well as of their own case, fear that there is no mercy for them, would attend to the account given of the nature of this sin, that it is a total and a willing renouncing of Christ, and his cause, and joining with his enemies, it would relieve them from wrong fears. We should ourselves beware, and caution others, of every approach near to a gulf so awful as apostacy; yet in doing this we should keep close to the word of God, and be careful not to wound and terrify the weak, or discourage the fallen and penitent. Believers not only taste of the word of God, but they drink it in. And this fruitful field or garden receives the blessing. But the merely nominal Christian, continuing unfruitful under the means of grace, or producing nothing but deceit and selfishness, was near the awful state above described; and everlasting misery was the end reserved for him. Let us watch with humble caution and prayer as to ourselves.

[Botanist]

Exodus 12:15

Seven days you shall eat unleavened bread.

Ecclesiastes 9

For all this I considered in my heart even to declare all this, that the righteous, and the wise, and their works, are in the hand of God:

no man knoweth either love or hatred by all that is before them.

Deu 24:19

When thou cuttest down thine harvest in thy field, and hast forgot a sheaf in the field, thou shalt not go again to fetch it: it shall be for the stranger, for the fatherless, and for the widow.

Above verses no help?

Differant denominations declair differant doctrines on this subject and sometimes Gods statements are so multifaceted they can contain several correct interpitations.

[Guest]

Hello Everyone,

The following verses are of a most serious nature. In fact, they speak of eternal consequences and not good ones at that. Over the years I have read many opinions and commentaries regarding what they mean and I would like to read of other peoples viewpoints on these scriptures and how they understand them. I do have my own firm understanding of these scriptures and originally elaborated quite a bit more in this initial post but deleted those comments until a bit later.

So please post your understanding of the following verses:

(Hebrews 6:1 [KJV])

Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

(Hebrews 6:2 [KJV])

Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

(Hebrews 6:3 [KJV])

And this will we do, if God permit.

(Hebrews 6:4 [KJV])

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

(Hebrews 6:5 [KJV])

And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

(Hebrews 6:6 [KJV])

If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

(Hebrews 6:7 [KJV])

For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:

(Hebrews 6:8 [KJV])

But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

Fearsome And Wonderful Scriptures Dear Brother

Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;

As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance:

But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;

Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.

And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:

Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.

Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. 1 Peter 1:13-23

So I'll Gently Drop Two Thoughts

Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. John 3:7

That May Apply To Most

Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein. Mark 10:15

(I Think)

[UncleAbee]

Heb 6:1 [KJV])

Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, - This is talking about progressing forward from the elementary teachings of Christianity. We are not to forget them but to build upon them.

(Heb 6:2 [KJV])

Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. - Baptisms is in the plural sense because their is a mention of several baptisms (Fire, HG, John, Moses, etc) in the NT. Vs 2 is still linked to vs 1 as items we are to learn, build on, and move forward to the next level.

(Heb 6:3 [KJV])

And this will we do, if God permit. - Self explanatory

(Heb 6:4 [KJV])

(Heb 6:5 [KJV])For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, (Heb 6:6 [KJV]) If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

- This is a series of troublesome verses for many. It is clear to me though. I will break it down as follows:

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, - It is clear that this verse is speaking of Christians. Only Christians fit these qualifications. We are 1st enlightened (made aware of God), taste the gift (experience God), and made partakers of the HG (become Christians).

If they shall fall away, - "They" are Christians and the writer is talking about apostasy from the faith of believers. This is not making an error but specifically deciding not to believe in Christ or practice the faith anymore.

to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. - This part of the verse links with the 1st part that says "For it is impossible." Many think once you commit apostasy their is no renewing you. Instead the scripture is saying it is impossible for us to renew an apostasized member. The bible says that all things with God are possible (Matt 19:26). We cannot baptize them again. At this point it takes the working of God to renew them if He decides to do so. THe writer is making apostasy of believers a difficult concept. Why would a person who has experienced the HG then reject it? That's like being hungry, eating a piece of steak, and then throwing the rest away and starving to death. The writer makes it clear though that this is possible and the consequences are dire. The Hebrew writer was writing to people who were under severe persecution and exhorting them not to give up. The consequences of death are far better than leaving the faith under persecution.

(Heb 6:7 [KJV])

For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God: (Heb 6:8 [KJV]) But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned. - This is a warning of judgment on non believers and those who hinder the works of God. Those who obey will receive blessings. Those who do not will receive punishment.

Edited February 11, 2011 by UncleAbee

[Matt712]

The following is from Matthew Henry's commentary- It is difficult to piece it out as you wanted it.

Chapter 6

The Hebrews are urged to go forward in the doctrine of Christ, and the consequences of apostacy, or turning back, are described. (1-8) The apostle expresses satisfaction, as to the most of them. (9,10) And encourages them to persevere in faith and holiness. (11-20)

<a href="http://www.biblestudytools.com/bible/passage.aspx?q=Hebrews+6:1-8" style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(51, 102, 153); ">Verses 1-8 Every part of the truth and will of God should be set before all who profess the gospel, and be urged on their hearts and consciences. We should not be always speaking about outward things; these have their places and use, but often take up too much attention and time, which might be better employed. The humbled sinner who pleads guilty, and cries for mercy, can have no ground from this passage to be discouraged, whatever his conscience may accuse him of. Nor does it prove that any one who is made a new creature in Christ, ever becomes a final apostate from him. The apostle is not speaking of the falling away of mere professors, never convinced or influenced by the gospel. Such have nothing to fall away from, but an empty name, or hypocritical profession. Neither is he speaking of partial declinings or backslidings. Nor are such sins meant, as Christians fall into through the strength of temptations, or the power of some worldly or fleshly lust. But the falling away here mentioned, is an open and avowed renouncing of Christ, from enmity of heart against him, his cause, and people, by men approving in their minds the deeds of his murderers, and all this after they have received the knowledge of the truth, and tasted some of its comforts. Of these it is said, that it is impossible to renew them again unto repentance. Not because the blood of Christ is not sufficient to obtain pardon for this sin; but this sin, in its very nature, is opposite to repentance and every thing that leads to it. If those who through mistaken views of this passage, as well as of their own case, fear that there is no mercy for them, would attend to the account given of the nature of this sin, that it is a total and a willing renouncing of Christ, and his cause, and joining with his enemies, it would relieve them from wrong fears. We should ourselves beware, and caution others, of every approach near to a gulf so awful as apostacy; yet in doing this we should keep close to the word of God, and be careful not to wound and terrify the weak, or discourage the fallen and penitent. Believers not only taste of the word of God, but they drink it in. And this fruitful field or garden receives the blessing. But the merely nominal Christian, continuing unfruitful under the means of grace, or producing nothing but deceit and selfishness, was near the awful state above described; and everlasting misery was the end reserved for him. Let us watch with humble caution and prayer as to ourselves.

I am glad that I read this. There are a rare few passages in scripture that so completely confuse me, and this has helped to clarify the intent of these words for me.

[Rick-Parker]

This is directly from the The Expositor's Study Bible (KJV). I have copied them down in red.

Hello Everyone,

The following verses are of a most serious nature. In fact, they speak of eternal consequences and not good ones at that. Over the years I have read many opinions and commentaries regarding what they mean and I would like to read of other peoples viewpoints on these scriptures and how they understand them. I do have my own firm understanding of these scriptures and originally elaborated quite a bit more in this initial post but deleted those comments until a bit later.

So please post your understanding of the following verses:

(Heb 6:1 [KJV])

Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ (speaks of the "first principles," which refers to the OT; Christ is the centerpiece of the entirety of the Bible), let us go on unto perfection (speaks of the NT sacrifice, the Lord Jesus, and the Testament He inaugurated with His work on the Cross); not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works (refers to Jewish Christians going back to the old sacrificial system, etc.), and of faith toward God (refers to faith toward God in the realm of the Old Testament way, which God will not accept now inasmuch as Jesus has fulfilled the Old Testament Law),

(Heb 6:2 [KJV])

Of the doctrine of baptisms (should have been translated "the Doctrine of Washings"; this concerned the many "washings contained in the OT sacrificial system), and of laying on of hands (goes back to the Levitical offerings of the OT; when the person brought the animal for sacrifice, he had to lay his hands on the head of the innocent victim, confessing his sins, thereby transferring them to the innocent animal which would be slain [Lev. 16:21]), and of resurrection of the dead (refers to resurrection as taught in the OT; there, this doctrine in the OT was incomplete, even as all doctrine in the OT was incomplete; the true meaning could not be given until after the Cross and the Resurrection of Christ, which the Lord gave to Paul [1 Cor., Chpt. 15]), and of eternal judgment. (In the Old Testament, the Lord was looked at more so as a Judge than anything else. Since the Cross, He is looked at more as the Savior.)

(Heb 6:3 [KJV])

And this will we do (in other words, if we don't do this [refers to going on to the perfection of Christ], the results will be disastrous), if God permit. (This refers to the fact that all dependence must be in Christ and the Cross. God will not allow any other type of faith.)

(Heb 6:4 [KJV])

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened (refers to those who have accepted the Light of the Gospel, which means accepting Christ and His great Sacrifice), and have tasted of the heavenly gift (pertains to Christ and what He did at the Cross), and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost (which takes place when a person comes to Christ),

(Heb 6:5 [KJV])

And have tasted the good word of God (is not language that is used of an impenitent sinner, as some claim; the unsaved have no relish whatsoever for the Truth of God, and see no beauty in it) {On this statement I do not personally agree}, and the powers of the world to come (refers to the Work of the Holy Spirit within hearts and lives, which the unsaved cannot have or know),

(Heb 6:6 [KJV])

If they shall fall away (should have been translated "and having fallen away"), to renew them again unto repentance ("again" states they had once repented, but have now turned their backs on Christ); seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh (means they no longer believe what Christ did at the Cross, actually concluding Him to be an impostor; the only way any person can truly repent is to place his faith in Christ and the Cross; if that is denied, there is no repentance), and put him to an open shame (means to hold Christ up to public ridicule; Paul wrote this Epistle because some Christian Jews were going back into Judaism, or seriously contemplating doing so).

(Heb 6:7 [KJV])

For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it (presents the Aspostle using natural things to represent spiritial realities, which is common throughout Scripture), and bringeth forth herbs (presents the natural result of ground that is properly cultivated and receives rain; there will be a harvest) meet for them by whom it is dressed (received by individuals who do the cultivating of the land, etc.), receiveth blessing from God (presents the inevitable result of proper faith):

(Heb 6:8 [KJV])

But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected (this speaks of Believers who have turned their backs on Christ and the Cross {on this I do not personally agree} and now bring forth no proper fruit, but rather "thorns and briers"), and is nigh unto cursing (refers to judgment); whose end is to be burned. (This refers to the simple fact that is a person who once was a Believer remains in that state, he will lose his soul.)

{I personally do not hold to the teaching, of the commentary I posted, that a True Believer would ever turn their back on Christ as they are sealed by the Holy Spirit unto Salvation upon their sincere profession of faith, which is taught in Scripture: Acts 2:38; 1 Corinthians 3:16,17,19; Romans 8:9,11; Ephesians 1:13; Ephesians 4:30; 2 Corinthians 1:21; 2 Corinthians 5:5.}

Regards,

Jay

Edited for incorrect spelling!

[nebula]

The best explanation I heard on this -

When two people are married, is it possible for one to divorce the other? Yes. In a relationship with the Lord, chances are it is the person who files for the divorce, not the Lord.

When two people are married, can they live apart yet still be married? Yes, legally they are still married even though they live separate lives. So with the Lord, a person can chose to live separated yet remain married.

[Guest man]

The best explanation I heard on this -

When two people are married, is it possible for one to divorce the other? Yes. In a relationship with the Lord, chances are it is the person who files for the divorce, not the Lord.

If the Lord decides to divorce the individual, what's the final outcome? What happens to the soul where eternity is concerned?

When two people are married, can they live apart yet still be married? Yes, legally they are still married even though they live separate lives. So with the Lord, a person can chose to live separated yet remain married.

Sounds to me like this would be a better deal. Simply separate myself from God and fall back into a life of disobedience. I wouldn't have to worry about any repercussions because we're still married.

[Botz]

When two people are married, can they live apart yet still be married? Yes, legally they are still married even though they live separate lives. So with the Lord, a person can chose to live separated yet remain married.

Sounds to me like this would be a better deal. Simply separate myself from God and fall back into a life of disobedience. I wouldn't have to worry about any repercussions because we're still married.

People often say this regarding the idea of eternal salvation...e.g. that one can just get saved, then go back to doing anything you want because you have free entry to Eternity with the Righteous....in truth it doesn't work this way, and someone who is born again and thinks like this very soon discovers the consequence of losing 'assurance'.

But I believe there is another aspect that is seldom taught, and that is when Believers that have walked through their faith on 'cruise control' and have followed the flesh rather than be led by the Spirit, come to the place of Judgment, where their works undergo the Holy Fire and virtually everything goes up in flames...nothing beautiful is evidenced...nothing that shows the extent of what the blood of Jesus has done for them....

I don't think that the judgment time of our works before the L-rd is going to be something to look forward to if a Believer has deliberately disdained the precious gift of salvation....that is why Jesus, Paul and the Apostles so urge the brethren to produce Holy Ghost fruit with their redeemed lives....we need to, 'work out our salvation with fear and trembling'.

Hebrews 6:11 And we desire that each one of you show the same diligence so as to realize the full assurance of hope until the end, 12 so that you will not be sluggish, but imitators of those who through faith and patience inherit the promises.

1 Corinthians 3:11 For no man can lay a foundation other than the one which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if any man builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, 13 each man