Hitlerism II

[ted]

Yup, he was de-membered.

t.

[JesusisGod2]

Oh where oh where did our little Tim go, oh where oh where can he be? Google Tim. Go to the end of the listings where the least respected scholars are. Maybe you can find them scholars in the back of the listings.

I don't think you'll be getting a reply from Tim anytime soon. He's been de-membered (polite way of saying banned). Did anyone notice that he made over a 100 posts in just the few days since he joined? Wow. Since he is no longer a member and cannot respond to accusations, I think it would probably be best to not gossip about him, which is what some of these responses are at the very least bordering on.

Be careful, friends.

Romans 1:28-30 And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done. They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips, slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents,

The Holy Bible, English Standard Version

[Scudbuddy]

Oh where oh where did our little Tim go, oh where oh where can he be? Google Tim. Go to the end of the listings where the least respected scholars are. Maybe you can find them scholars in the back of the listings.

I don't think you'll be getting a reply from Tim anytime soon. He's been de-membered (polite way of saying banned). Did anyone notice that he made over a 100 posts in just the few days since he joined? Wow. Since he is no longer a member and cannot respond to accusations, I think it would probably be best to not gossip about him, which is what some of these responses are at the very least bordering on.

Be careful, friends.

Romans 1:28-30 And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done. They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips, slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents,

The Holy Bible, English Standard Version

[JesusisGod2]

Hello Scudbuddy,

Do you think that confronting someone with racist views should be done gently?

It should always be done in love. We are Christians, this means that we bear the name of Christ.

How should we react when we are persecuted by non-believers?

Would you consider complimenting them on their interest in the subject, and then slipping in the middle of kind words that just maybe hating Jews and denying their place of suffering isn't all that it is cracked up to be?

I dont believe anyone is saying that at all, but does that justify the name calling and hatred that one shows when they are in a "confrontational" mode.

This does not lead to understanding or winning one over to your view being expresseed.

I am sorry, but I didn't learn that method of confrontation. I do my best to confront at the level of wrong committed.

Neither did I scuddbuddy, as a matter of fact my growing up was pretty extreme as far as confrontation, it usually ended up in fistacuffs.

But praise God those days are over, no one ever won by those means of confrontation. Even when I won fights, i didnt walk away unscaved, I was always hurting somewhere in my body even if it was just my heart.

Someone says something of little matter, it is easier to be all nice and complimentary.

When someone promotes views by Nazis and others that hate the Jews (enough to get kicked off the site) I find that it is a different arena I am in. The Neville Chamberlains of the world are always careful about how the Hitlers take the word "No!" So they say it this way. "I am telling you, if you invade one more country, there are some people who might not like that. So please don't do it."

Our battle is not against flesh and blood, but against the powers of darkness. No one will stop the hitlers of today, but we can win souls for Jesus.

Hitler invades Czecheslovakia.

"If you do it again, others might be disapointed in you."

Hitler invades Poland.

This is when World Wars start. The problem is, that war should have started years before when the Hitlers of the world were violating the treaties, and were small enough to deal with.

It takes men with conviction to put a stop to the Hitlers of this world. Their words go something like this. "We shall fight them on the beaches,................" They don't mince words with the Hitlers of the world. And they always sooner or later replace the Neville Chamberlains of the world.

No doubt hitler was an evil man.

So when someone forcefully stands up to men like Tim Vaughn and makes it clear who he is, what he believes, and how wrong it is; and then points out so that all can see; "This is what hate is. A Coward full of wrong information trying to suck you into the same appeasements in the name of niceities."

We dont react in the name of "niceties" but in the Name of Jesus.

Well I think you found the wrong man to bring that up with. I will never feel bad about getting in the faces of men like that. Nor in the Neville Chamberlains faces either. That is called "Doing the Right thing, even if it hurts."

Evidently so! I am not saying that confronting the wrong is wrong, but how you confront the wrong is everything.

And my biblical example can be taken from the likes of Jesus, Peter and Paul.

"Snakes and Vipers." Jesus to the face of Snakes and Vipers.

Interesting point. Let me ask you this thoutgh, can you say in your heart that in your confrontation, that you have done so in the same spirit as these great men? have they ever called anyone out for confrontation?

Peter to Ananais and Sapphaira was a conversation that ended in their deaths.

He never had confrontation with them, at least not the same type of confrontation as this one.

He asked them a question and they lied, and the Spirit of God brought about their deaths because they lied to the Holy Spirit. This is much different than the situation at hand.

Paul rebuked Peter very strongly in front of all the other people in the church for his racist decisions. And it was done not only loudly, but it was written down for all the church through history to see.

This had nothing to do with racism persay, but with trying to mix law with grace, to take away from the finished work on the cross, to put a prerequisite on salvation. This was a salvation issue, not really a racisit issue.

They were putting a stummbleing block in the path of salvation which is the same reasons that Jesus had the confrontations with the pharisees. If you would notice these confrontations that these great men had with others, never involved worldly matters, but matters of God.

That is why I feel absolutely no guilt for such dealings with a man who has refused any counsel whatsoever on this forum in the short time he was here.

Whether you feel any guilt or not is not for me to judge or to try to instill, that is purely up to God! even if you did feel guilt, this is purely the work of the Holy Spirit.

However, it is my duty when I see a wrong to address it, wheteher one listens to it or not is irrelevant, but if he listens it says that you have won your brother.

He just wanted to spread lies and get rid of those who confronted them.

It was just an opinion of his, and I dont agree with what he layed out either. But two wrongs dont make it right.

This is just what I have observed, thats all. That doesnt mean I am right either, But I felt impelled to respond.

In Jesus

kevin

[Scudbuddy]

Scudbuddy said,

"Paul rebuked Peter very strongly in front of all the other people in the church for his racist decisions. And it was done not only loudly, but it was written down for all the church through history to see."

Jesus is God 2 replied,

"This had nothing to do with racism persay, but with trying to mix law with grace, to take away from the finished work on the cross, to put a prerequisite on salvation. This was a salvation issue, not really a racisit issue.

They were putting a stummbleing block in the path of salvation which is the same reasons that Jesus had the confrontations with the pharisees. If you would notice these confrontations that these great men had with others, never involved worldly matters, but matters of God."

________________________________________________________________________________

This was all about racism. The Jews could hardly stand the idea of even being around Gentiles. Peter had this revelation about God wanting to bring the Gentiles into this great salvation, and he convinced them to receive them. Then, whenever they would get together, Peter would pretend not to even know them. He would leave their table, and sit with the Jews. That is racism.

And Paul was not gentle in confronting it. And neither should we be when confronting this sort of hateful conduct on a Christian board. Recognize the time to get in someones face, or placate them with your gentility. There is a time to take a whip out and scourge some Pharisees. And if we are to be held to the standard of "Are you as good as them" before we practice what is taught, then I believe the battle is already lost. One, none of us can honestly say we know just how good any of the apostles were. They were men just like us. They just happened to live in a time when our Savior walked the earth. They just happened to have his words touch their ears. They obeyed their calling. I do not worship any of the saints. They are no more righteous than the generations after them. They are not my standard. Jesus is.

And He said to do as He did. To live like Him. And Paul said the same thing. He tried to live like Jesus, and asked us to follow that example. But if we are held to the idea, "Are you an apostle?" then we have just violated scripture. I am not Jesus, yet I am told to be like Him.

I will continue to forcefully and vigorously confront evil at the level it confronts me. I have done so in person in Communist countries, and God has honored it. My hope in confronting Tim was two things. To bring truth to the forefront, and to remind those thinking that racism is ok that not even the church will tolerate it in any form. Most understand that sort of conviction. Even respect it.

When you do not hold such a strong conviction, you hand over flowers to racist and ask "Can't we all just get along?" Racist must change, or I will not get along. I don't smile around hatred.

[apothanein kerdos]

One of the saddest things in Christianity today is that we'd rather be more concerned and spend more time debating on how the message is delivered than sticking up for justice.

Not everything must be handled in a gentle matter. Paul called the Galatians foolish. If someone is being racist and they are being very hard about it, you m ust be hard back and defeat it. Racism is ugly and should be destroyed.

btw, Scud is right about the confrontation with paul and peter. It is about Racism. Heck, Paul spent the first 8 chapters of Romans describing how the Jews are no better than the Gentiles.

[Scudbuddy]

One of the saddest things in Christianity today is that we'd rather be more concerned and spend more time debating on how the message is delivered than sticking up for justice.

Not everything must be handled in a gentle matter. Paul called the Galatians foolish. If someone is being racist and they are being very hard about it, you m ust be hard back and defeat it. Racism is ugly and should be destroyed.

btw, Scud is right about the confrontation with paul and peter. It is about Racism. Heck, Paul spent the first 8 chapters of Romans describing how the Jews are no better than the Gentiles.

Thank you Super Jew,

I grew up in a Christian home that loved Jesus. But my father learned the lesson of racism the hard way. He used the "N" word around us kids often. And yet he never expressed any particular hatred toward them. It was how his father referred to African-Americans.

One day, we were on a bus, and my 3 year old sister, when a black man came on the bus stated very loudly for all to hear, "Daddy, is that a N." Between the looks of cold hate from those in the bus, and the look of pity coming from this man, my father realized the world he had created for his children. I never heard the word again from his mouth.

Since then I have ministered in many countries where prejudice exist in the extreme. It is accepted in many countries that those who are different are less. And the church in many of those countries says little or nothing. They are the one source that can confront this evil. Dietrich Bonhoeffer saw this for what it was, and tried to confront it with assasination. Surprisingly, many in the church see this man in a bad light for wanting Hitler dead. Amazing! They are the ones who would have stood by why Nazis killed their neighbors. They would have done this in the name of "gentle love." Love can be thee most violent expression ever. It can be so violent that it splits families, nations, churches, and any group in its' way.

"I came not into the world to bring peace to the world, but to bring a sword." Jesus.

This nation is headed for an extreme racial conflict and those leading the charge against it are the liberal churches. That is a shame. I believe in a "Whole Gospel" where the whole man is ministered too. The evangelicals need to say with conviction "No!" to this hatred out there. Pussy-footing around is only going to encourage the problem.

[JesusisGod2]

Hi Scudbuddy,

Peace brother!

As I said this was just an observance I am not saying I am right. If you find peace with God and are comfortable in this kind of approach, who am I to say, its between you and Him.

In Jesus

kevin

[Scudbuddy]

Hi Scudbuddy,

Peace brother!

As I said this was just an observance I am not saying I am right. If you find peace with God and are comfortable in this kind of approach, who am I to say, its between you and Him.

In Jesus

kevin

That I can handle. Same to you. :hug: