TAKE CARE, FAREWELL OR CURSE?

[Guest shiloh357]

Thank you aggiekat and shiloh for your defense of me, I sincerely appreciate it.

larryt, what exactly is your point with the "idle" words anyway? We've all gone 'round and 'round regarding what it means and yet I'm still unclear how it pertains to this post.

Hey Tess, No prob sis!!

The point about "idle" words came about after we had made the point that the phrase, "take care" was an innocuous, harmless way of saying goodbye and wishing someone well.

Larry calls it "idle" speech and then quotes Matt 12:36 where it says we will be accountable for every idle word.

Problem is that Jesus was not referring to harmless phrases, He was referring to the injurous statements made the Jewish religious leaders when they committed blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. In that verse Jesus used the word idle to mean "evil."

Instead of just admitting that he picked the wrong verse to make his point, Larry chooses to force "idle" in Matt 12:36 to mean "lazy."

[larryt]

I'm sorry but my septuagent doesn't have "argos" in either of those verses. Your case does not stand. I don't understand how you arive at that conclusion since it is not used in the septuagent.

Doesnt really matter since "argos" is used in the New Testament Greek manuscripts and Shav is the Hebrew equivalent. You are the one who brought forth the word argos in your post trying to prove that it meant "lazy" in Matt. 12:36. My point is that "argos" in the Matt. 12:36 cannot be forced to mean lazy, simply because the context does not allow it.

How can you say it doesn't matter? You point out Duet. 5:11, 20 and say this is where the greek word coresponds to the hebrew and yet they translate it into a different word. "argos" is the only word translated idle in the NT. You have NOT proved that "argos" can mean anything other than "lazy" Show me any other greek writer that uses the word to mean "evil" anywhere.

The word means lazy.(period) Until you can PROVE, not assert, otherwise.

LT

[Guest shiloh357]

How can you say it doesn't matter? You point out Duet. 5:11, 20 and say this is where the greek word coresponds to the hebrew and yet they translate it into a different word. "argos" is the only word translated idle in the NT. You have NOT proved that "argos" can mean anything other than "lazy" Show me any other greek writer that uses the word to mean "evil" anywhere.

The word means lazy.(period) Until you can PROVE, not assert, otherwise.

LT

I guess context means nothing to you? When Jesus was addressing blasphemy of the Holy Spirit and called it "idle" in Matt: 12:36, was he referring to "lazy" speech?

Is blaspheming the Holy Spirit evil or is it just "lazy?"

The context proves what Jesus was referring to. You are just too "lazy" to interpret scripture correctly.

[Kabowd]

Even if we accept that "idle" means lazy... you still cannot prove that saying "take care" to someone constitutes an "idle" word. As was stated earlier, in order to prove this you would have to know the speaker's motives and intentions when speaking it. Is this really that unclear to you?

[larryt]

shiloh357

I am sorry but that is just reading more into the phrase than is there, or is intended. This approach is called being "hyper-literal."

Just a question, Did Jesus really mean we would give an account of EVERY idle word.

Mt 12:36  But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.

And should we take to heart the things He says(Mal 2:1-2).

LT

Tess

Peace be multiplied to you.

This is my first post here. I posed a question.

shiloh responded "'Idle' in the sense of unGodly, or evil. It does not cover innocuous phrases or conversations."

I asserted that idle means lazy, ie not taking any thought about, taking the side that it does mean innocuous.

I take seriously the meaning of words for if we mean different things then we are talking about different things. I don't buy his assertion that argos means in any way evil. He hasn't shown the correspondence between argos and shaveh. You know a little bit about law without agreement on a premiss further argument is useless.

LT

[larryt]

Thank you aggiekat and shiloh for your defense of me, I sincerely appreciate it.

larryt, what exactly is your point with the "idle" words anyway? We've all gone 'round and 'round regarding what it means and yet I'm still unclear how it pertains to this post. 

Hey Tess, No prob sis!!

The point about "idle" words came about after we had made the point that the phrase, "take care" was an innocuous, harmless way of saying goodbye and wishing someone well.

Larry calls it "idle" speech and then quotes Matt 12:36 where it says we will be accountable for every idle word.

Problem is that Jesus was not referring to harmless phrases, He was referring to the injurous statements made the Jewish religious leaders when they committed blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. In that verse Jesus used the word idle to mean "evil."

Instead of just admitting that he picked the wrong verse to make his point, Larry chooses to force "idle" in Matt 12:36 to mean "lazy."

And would you care to answer the rest of my exlaination and not just leave it out. I gave an alternative which you seem to just brush asside.

LT

[larryt]

How can you say it doesn't matter?  You point out Duet. 5:11, 20 and say this is where the greek word coresponds to the hebrew and yet they translate it into a different word.  "argos" is the only word translated idle in the NT.  You have NOT proved that "argos" can mean anything other than "lazy"  Show me any other greek writer that uses the word to mean "evil" anywhere.

The word means lazy.(period)  Until you can PROVE, not assert, otherwise.

LT

I guess context means nothing to you? When Jesus was addressing blasphemy of the Holy Spirit and called it "idle" in Matt: 12:36, was he referring to "lazy" speech?

Is blaspheming the Holy Spirit evil or is it just "lazy?"

The context proves what Jesus was referring to. You are just too "lazy" to interpret scripture correctly.

Ex 32:9  And the LORD said unto Moses, I have seen this people, and, behold, it [is] a stiffnecked people:

You are just too "lazy" to interpret scripture correctly.

Have I resorted to attacking you personally?

LT

[Guest shiloh357]

shiloh357

I am sorry but that is just reading more into the phrase than is there, or is intended. This approach is called being "hyper-literal."

Just a question, Did Jesus really mean we would give an account of EVERY idle word.

Mt 12:36

[artsylady]

This is one of the silliest things I've ever seen here on Worthy.

When I tell someone to take care, I do hope that they do 'take care'. I hope that they mind the rules of the road and wear their seatbelt. This is not a curse. This is just politeness and concern. Don't tell me I'm a bad person for saying 'take care' or that I've done something evil.

Some of you see evil in the most ridiculous places. Why do you go searching for it like this, twisting and contorting every thing - even every good thing? I'm getting tired of it.

[artsylady]

When I wrote my last post I was angry. Once I got over that, i was moved to tears. There is a lost and dying world out there!!!! What are you going to do if an unbeliever tells you to 'take care" - rebuke them???

Why must we find evil where it doesn't even exist! Why give the devil that kind of credit?

When you think the devil is lurking behind everything, including a statement made out of love and concern, there is a problem!!

And in a thread that's called 'take care', one of our sisters is yet offended again, for what? her age?????

If Tess never revealed her age, we'd think she was a fully grown mature adult. She comes across as wise and thoughtful, yet some choose to disregard her because of her age.

'Out of the mouths of babes", "And a little child shall lead them'.

How old was Christ when he was teaching the elders? 12.

Tess is VERY mature and she has a thick skin and is able to forgive and forget quickly - yet another sign of maturity. But frankly, I'm tired of people talking down to her because of her age. Grow up people!!!!