At What Point Does a Job Get Abusive?

[gdemoss]

Wondering what others thing about abusive work places. How much is too much to put up with until you can find work elsewhere? I'm thinking of office policy type stuff rather than that "jerk" boss everyone has dealt with at some point in their working lives. This might include things like being told you can't have a lunch break, can't eat at your desk, etc., "you'll just have to eat before you come on your 8 hour shift.", being treated in other ways as if you are a 3 year old each day when you are an adult.

I get it that as believers we are to submit to authority. That's not the issue. What do you do when the authority starts getting abusive?

OSHA...has a law that protects an employee of abuse from a Boss or a co-worker.

It is called ...Work Place Violence.

If you do not have another job in line...I would suggest follow their Golden Rules...or they will give you the BOOT !

And another thing, with the economy the way it is, in order to keep your job...I would not hang with the people who complain about their job,

at your work place. People Love to rat on others at your job. And another way to get the BOOT !

This is my sisters' favorite saying...." Lump it or Leave it " . LOL

Alternatively, join a union or if there isn't a union set up a union: and if they try to sack you, sue, protest and expose them. Your employers behaviour is evil, so make sure people locally know about it - expose their perfidy. No one has a right to exploit and abuse those less powerful than them.

So we should return evil for evil?

Gary

[LOVE SONGS]

Wondering what others thing about abusive work places. How much is too much to put up with until you can find work elsewhere? I'm thinking of office policy type stuff rather than that "jerk" boss everyone has dealt with at some point in their working lives. This might include things like being told you can't have a lunch break, can't eat at your desk, etc., "you'll just have to eat before you come on your 8 hour shift.", being treated in other ways as if you are a 3 year old each day when you are an adult.

I get it that as believers we are to submit to authority. That's not the issue. What do you do when the authority starts getting abusive?

OSHA...has a law that protects an employee of abuse from a Boss or a co-worker.

It is called ...Work Place Violence.

If you do not have another job in line...I would suggest follow their Golden Rules...or they will give you the BOOT !

And another thing, with the economy the way it is, in order to keep your job...I would not hang with the people who complain about their job,

at your work place. People Love to rat on others at your job. And another way to get the BOOT !

This is my sisters' favorite saying...." Lump it or Leave it " . LOL

Alternatively, join a union or if there isn't a union set up a union: and if they try to sack you, sue, protest and expose them. Your employers behaviour is evil, so make sure people locally know about it - expose their perfidy. No one has a right to exploit and abuse those less powerful than them.

So we should return evil for evil?

Gary

What do you think... "Lump it or Leave it " means .....Gary ???

[gdemoss]

Wondering what others thing about abusive work places. How much is too much to put up with until you can find work elsewhere? I'm thinking of office policy type stuff rather than that "jerk" boss everyone has dealt with at some point in their working lives. This might include things like being told you can't have a lunch break, can't eat at your desk, etc., "you'll just have to eat before you come on your 8 hour shift.", being treated in other ways as if you are a 3 year old each day when you are an adult.

I get it that as believers we are to submit to authority. That's not the issue. What do you do when the authority starts getting abusive?

OSHA...has a law that protects an employee of abuse from a Boss or a co-worker.

It is called ...Work Place Violence.

If you do not have another job in line...I would suggest follow their Golden Rules...or they will give you the BOOT !

And another thing, with the economy the way it is, in order to keep your job...I would not hang with the people who complain about their job,

at your work place. People Love to rat on others at your job. And another way to get the BOOT !

This is my sisters' favorite saying...." Lump it or Leave it " . LOL

Alternatively, join a union or if there isn't a union set up a union: and if they try to sack you, sue, protest and expose them. Your employers behaviour is evil, so make sure people locally know about it - expose their perfidy. No one has a right to exploit and abuse those less powerful than them.

So we should return evil for evil?

Gary

What do you think... "Lump it or Leave it " means .....Gary ???

Deal with it or walk away is how I have always receive that saying. What's up with the frying pan...heh?

Gary

[Guest man]

So we should return evil for evil?

Gary

How is righting a wrong....................evil?

[LOVE SONGS]

frying pan ?... oh...sometimes people throw or pick up things to hurt people at work... No Joke !

[gdemoss]

So we should return evil for evil?

Gary

How is righting a wrong....................evil?

We are to defeat evil with good, No? If the church understood judgment they would stop judging everyone and retaliating against all ungodliness. We, the church, are to judge them that are within the church while God is to judge them who are without. But the church is so broken that they judge not even their own and instead are yoked together with unbelievers in unions and pickets etc. They are dragging people before unbelieving judges and court systems instead of bringing people before God and letting God do his job.

As I have stated earlier in this thread, I have issues at work too but I took my issues to God almighty and asked him to come down and have a look at what is going on and judge as he sees fit. I have been watching as he is ripping into management left and right for their ungodly deeds that they are committing against godly workers. I only wish they would repent, accept the gospel and become godly leaders and to this extent I pray that God will do for them. Nevertheless I believe the scriptures that say that God will avenge his elect speedily though he bare long with them.

You might believe that unions, OSHA, suing and protesting are the answer. I do not share your opinion. To support the union that is in my shop is to be unequally yoked with unbelievers to achieve a cause. This I will not do. I do go to union stewards about anything nor to I participate in anything union. Next year when the law takes effect, I will also stop giving the union any money as I will have the right to do so.

In Jesus Name,

Gary

[The_Patriot21]

To me, it all depends on the job and the situation. Its called pick your battles, and pick them wisely. Theres nothing inheritantly wrong with OSHA (nothing biblical) admittedly, they get annoying sometimes, but they have their place. but theres usually agencies in place that you can call in an anonymous complaint to, as well. Im not pro union in the least bit, they had their place-they did wonders to improving bad conditions in the workplace-but anymore, their as corrupt as the original companies they fought against. Ive never worked for a company that had a union, likely never will and wont join them unless the actual need for them arrises. Sometimes working conditions get harsh-to the point you need to either fight or leave-Ive been there, done that. I was leased to another trucking company while back that treated us like garbage-was constantly working us over our hours (truck drivers can only drive so many hours and remain legal) constantly, expect us to lie on our logbooks, and then talk trash about us and how poorly we worked, and kept adding boat loads of excess paperwork for no reason whatsoever, and messing up our paychecks. I finally put a stop to it-I started doing just the basic paperwork that gave them the information they needed for billing and told them where they put the rest-but most of all, when telling them no to working the extra hours didnt work, I started logging the hours I was working. Now, doing that opened me up to a fine if the DOT pulled an audit-but it opened the company up for a fine easily 3 times higher then what I would pay, and on top of that I wasnt the only driver doing it-in a matter of 2 days, me and 2 other drivers opened the company up to a possibility of over $50,000 in fines if the DOT decided to pull a random audit, and that put an end to the working extra hours. As far as the paychecks, the company that we directly worked for (it was a sister company, we were just leased to the bad company) got enough complaints they came in, and put us back on their immediate payroll which solved the paycheck problem. Its called choose your battles, decide what your willing to lose, and decide on how and what your going to do, and weigh the pros and cons.

[Guest man]

Well it's pretty obvious you are somewhat ignorant where OSHA is concerned. I don't believe they run around staging pickets and protests and dragging people through the court system. I could be wrong but all the times I've dealt with OSHA I've never encountered any of those things. I think you're letting your anger toward your union influence your actions. Again, I could be wrong but that's what I see.

So we should return evil for evil?

Gary

How is righting a wrong....................evil?

We are to defeat evil with good, No? If the church understood judgment they would stop judging everyone and retaliating against all ungodliness. We, the church, are to judge them that are within the church while God is to judge them who are without. But the church is so broken that they judge not even their own and instead are yoked together with unbelievers in unions and pickets etc. They are dragging people before unbelieving judges and court systems instead of bringing people before God and letting God do his job.

As I have stated earlier in this thread, I have issues at work too but I took my issues to God almighty and asked him to come down and have a look at what is going on and judge as he sees fit. I have been watching as he is ripping into management left and right for their ungodly deeds that they are committing against godly workers. I only wish they would repent, accept the gospel and become godly leaders and to this extent I pray that God will do for them. Nevertheless I believe the scriptures that say that God will avenge his elect speedily though he bare long with them.

You might believe that unions, OSHA, suing and protesting are the answer. I do not share your opinion. To support the union that is in my shop is to be unequally yoked with unbelievers to achieve a cause. This I will not do. I do go to union stewards about anything nor to I participate in anything union. Next year when the law takes effect, I will also stop giving the union any money as I will have the right to do so.

In Jesus Name,

Gary

Just a note: If you are paying union dues, you're supporting everything that union is doing. You may not be supporting them morally, but your money helps them to further their cause, whatever that may be. I know you say you won't be unequally yolked with unbelievers but if you're supporting them financially.......guess what?

[Rare Bird]

RE: "This might include things like being told you can't have a lunch break, can't eat at your desk, etc., "you'll just have to eat before you come on your 8 hour shift."

There's a saying about employment that rings true no matter who are where you are on the corporate ladder: "Hired for what you know; Fired for who you are."

Essentially, if they don't like you (for whatever reason) they will build a case and fire you--whether it's for the reason you stated, or something else in order to release them from legal liability (i.e., wrongful termination).

Without knowing your role in the company and other things about your company, it's difficult to offer advice beyond that what is considered general. So here goes: (also, I am not a lawyer or an HR professional, but I do know a thing or two about dealing with donkey companies and bosses.)

By law, you should've received a company handbook which you read, understood and signed, and retained a copy of. This will detail the amount of breaks and what types an employee is allowed to by law, as well as the company's own discretion. If you don't have a copy of this, I urge you to get one and read/understand what it's policies are, as this will establish legal grounds--both yours and the company's. When you ask for a copy (if you don't have one already), do it in a way that will not draw attention to your dilemma. If HR asks why you need it, just say you never received a copy, or that you lost the original copy and that it's important for you to review so that you can be as productive as possible. (NOTE: Human Resources is NOT your friend, so don't give them any additional information and minimize your contact with them. They are accountable to the boss, not you, and there job is to a) keep the company staffed; and b) minimize the risk of lawsuits. So be careful what you say to them.)

Do you have periodic reviews with your supervisor? If so, this would be a time to bring up your question(s) about the policy in question. You've got to be as gentle as a dove here, yet cunning as a fox when having this discussion so you don't appear to be bucking authority or "rocking the boat". Also during these reviews, your supervisor should present a formal, documented summary of what was discussed, and, of which you will have to sign. Here's the important part: DON'T SIGN IT IF YOU DON'T AGREE WITH IT'S CONTENT. IF YOU SIGN IT WITHOUT ACKNOWLEDGING AND AGREEING WITH WHAT YOUR SUPERVISOR SAYS ABOUT YOU, YOU ARE CONCEDING TO WHATEVER FOLLOWING ACTION WILL BE TAKEN. However, if the company presses you to sign it for "legal purposes" (or whatever term they use), then you will need to refute each item carefully and thoroughly, attaching your addendum, so that there is no question about why you disagree with the review item(s). This will give you legal recourse if you are terminated or suffer continued abuse, based on the item(s) outlined in your review, and/or how they apply to company policies.

And here's the most important part: DOCUMENT. DOCUMENT. DOCUMENT. Document anything/everything that is contrary to legal and company policies, and the times and dates they occur. If you have a job where you use e-mail, keep your own private copies of all related communication. This is what is commonly referred to as CYA. ("cover your arse"). It's also good to have statement in your e-mails that say things like, "...I just want to do what's best for the company." and "...be as productive as I can."

As for OSHA (or other legal entity), yes, you could involve them now. But sooner or later, your name will appear in the investigation and it's usually sooner than what you'd prefer. And typically, you don't want to escalate to an authority without first doing you due diligence to resolve an issue.

Of course, everything I just said will depend on badly you need to keep this job in relation to your current standing at the company. So use whatever is of value in the way you see fit, doing it in all humility and with good intentions. Also make sure you know your rights at the Federal and State levels. Here's a link to some information that might be of help: http://www.las-elc.o...ets/breaks.html

Of course, continue praying about the situation and remember that God is in control of everything that's happening for His sovereign purposes. We are to obey and persevere in order to bring Him glory, no matter our circumstances. I'll be praying for you too. ;-)

P.S. I just thought of this...if you never received an Employee Handbook, or signed a document saying that you read/understand the company's policies (i.e., Employee Handbook), and they do end up firing you because of something in the handbook, you now have grounds for a lawsuit. Now...Whether or not you want to take the time and effort of a stressful lawsuit like this is a whole 'nother matter.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Rare Bird

[gdemoss]

Well it's pretty obvious you are somewhat ignorant where OSHA is concerned. I don't believe they run around staging pickets and protests and dragging people through the court system. I could be wrong but all the times I've dealt with OSHA I've never encountered any of those things. I think you're letting your anger toward your union influence your actions. Again, I could be wrong but that's what I see.

So we should return evil for evil?

Gary

How is righting a wrong....................evil?

We are to defeat evil with good, No? If the church understood judgment they would stop judging everyone and retaliating against all ungodliness. We, the church, are to judge them that are within the church while God is to judge them who are without. But the church is so broken that they judge not even their own and instead are yoked together with unbelievers in unions and pickets etc. They are dragging people before unbelieving judges and court systems instead of bringing people before God and letting God do his job.

As I have stated earlier in this thread, I have issues at work too but I took my issues to God almighty and asked him to come down and have a look at what is going on and judge as he sees fit. I have been watching as he is ripping into management left and right for their ungodly deeds that they are committing against godly workers. I only wish they would repent, accept the gospel and become godly leaders and to this extent I pray that God will do for them. Nevertheless I believe the scriptures that say that God will avenge his elect speedily though he bare long with them.

You might believe that unions, OSHA, suing and protesting are the answer. I do not share your opinion. To support the union that is in my shop is to be unequally yoked with unbelievers to achieve a cause. This I will not do. I do go to union stewards about anything nor to I participate in anything union. Next year when the law takes effect, I will also stop giving the union any money as I will have the right to do so.

In Jesus Name,

Gary

Just a note: If you are paying union dues, you're supporting everything that union is doing. You may not be supporting them morally, but your money helps them to further their cause, whatever that may be. I know you say you won't be unequally yolked with unbelievers but if you're supporting them financially.......guess what?

Your reading emotion into what I post. I am offered this type of thing a lot but reject it in favor of not knowing for sure what emotions a person is expressing through a post and try to just receive the information.

I do not give the union any money. They take it from me. I have no choice until the law goes into effect at which time I will withdraw from them.

Gary