The Fifth Trumpet - Jerusalem's Seige

[Bluefinger]

I was just reading about Rome's war on Judea in 66-70 CE. Something stood out to me that I now feel is a solid confirmation of what the fifth trumpet is:

During the seige that Vespasian laid on the city, he allowed many Jews to enter the city for the Passover but would not let them leave. This was to starve the city of water and resources so that the seige would end quicker. These were caught in the seige and starved to death. Josephus wrote that these poor souls would be found lying on the ground by the seditious and would beg for them to kill them. The seditious refused.

Now, an important piece to note: The 144,000 of the 12 tribes of Israel that were sealed were not harmed. Why? The remnant was told by Jesus' apostles to flee Jerusalem and not follow after false messiahs. Those that went to Jerusalem for Passover obviously followed the wrong teachers.

Jesus' disciples were sealed because they listened to and obeyed His teachings, causing them to abandon the Jewish Cause.

Again, I want to stress the Passover. During Moses' ministry, God sent Abadon, the destroying angel, to kill the firstborn of every family whose windows and doors were not covered by Lamb's blood. In the same way, those Jews who did not receive Jesus' teachings and salvation had went to Passover in Jerusalem only to be destroyed. The destroyer was Vespasian, the Roman king.

Thus, the fifth trumpet was accomplished during the seige of Jerusalem and is not for future fulfillment. The sixth trumpet, then, is obviously the destruction of Jerusalem and its temple as well as the slaughter of the Jewish Nation.

Edited February 6, 2013 by Bluefinger

[Montana Marv]

I was just reading about Rome's war on Judea in 66-70 CE. Something stood out to me that I now feel is a solid confirmation of what the fifth trumpet is:

During the seige that Vespasian laid on the city, he allowed many Jews to enter the city for the Passover but would not let them leave. This was to starve the city of water and resources so that the seige would end quicker. These were caught in the seige and starved to death. Josephus wrote that these poor souls would be found lying on the ground by the seditious and would beg for them to kill them. The seditious refused.

Now, an important piece to note: The 144,000 of the 12 tribes of Israel that were sealed were not harmed. Why? The remnant was told by Jesus' apostles to flee Jerusalem and not follow after false messiahs. Those that went to Jerusalem for Passover obviously followed the wrong teachers.

Jesus' disciples were sealed because they listened to and obeyed His teachings, causing them to abandon the Jewish Cause.

Again, I want to stress the Passover. During Moses' ministry, God sent Abadon, the destroying angel, to kill the firstborn of every family whose windows and doors were not covered by Lamb's blood. In the same way, those Jews who did not receive Jesus' teachings and salvation had went to Passover in Jerusalem only to be destroyed. The destroyer was Vespasian, the Roman king.

Thus, the fifth trumpet was accomplished during the seige of Jerusalem and is not for future fulfillment. The sixth trumpet, then, is obviously the destruction of Jerusalem and its temple as well as the slaughter of the Jewish Nation.

Bluefinger

Odd that you do not know what the 5th Trumpet is and that you have it all backwards. No one dies during this Trumpet, but only those who do not have the seal of God are tormented (in agony) for 5 months. The Roman army was not being tormented by these creatures who came out from the Abyss. Why???

In Christ

Montana Marv

[ENOCH2010]

How did Josephus know what was going on inside the walls of Jerusalem? He was outside the walls, to be able to write as a witness of what was happening he would have had to be in there with them.

[Bluefinger]

I was just reading about Rome's war on Judea in 66-70 CE. Something stood out to me that I now feel is a solid confirmation of what the fifth trumpet is:

During the seige that Vespasian laid on the city, he allowed many Jews to enter the city for the Passover but would not let them leave. This was to starve the city of water and resources so that the seige would end quicker. These were caught in the seige and starved to death. Josephus wrote that these poor souls would be found lying on the ground by the seditious and would beg for them to kill them. The seditious refused.

Now, an important piece to note: The 144,000 of the 12 tribes of Israel that were sealed were not harmed. Why? The remnant was told by Jesus' apostles to flee Jerusalem and not follow after false messiahs. Those that went to Jerusalem for Passover obviously followed the wrong teachers.

Jesus' disciples were sealed because they listened to and obeyed His teachings, causing them to abandon the Jewish Cause.

Again, I want to stress the Passover. During Moses' ministry, God sent Abadon, the destroying angel, to kill the firstborn of every family whose windows and doors were not covered by Lamb's blood. In the same way, those Jews who did not receive Jesus' teachings and salvation had went to Passover in Jerusalem only to be destroyed. The destroyer was Vespasian, the Roman king.

Thus, the fifth trumpet was accomplished during the seige of Jerusalem and is not for future fulfillment. The sixth trumpet, then, is obviously the destruction of Jerusalem and its temple as well as the slaughter of the Jewish Nation.

Bluefinger

Odd that you do not know what the 5th Trumpet is and that you have it all backwards. No one dies during this Trumpet, but only those who do not have the seal of God are tormented (in agony) for 5 months. The Roman army was not being tormented by these creatures who came out from the Abyss. Why???

In Christ

Montana Marv

I don't think you read my post right Marv. I never said they died. Josephus recorded that many in Jerusalem were struck down with hunger due to the seige-induced famine. They came in for Passover and were not allowed to leave. As they lied on the ground motionless, they begged the seditious to kill them but they would not. This is clear evidence to me.

Abadon was the angel that destroyed Egypt's firstborn and all those whose doors and windows were not covered with lamb's blood (for which the Passover commemorates. After the sixth seal, the 144,000 of the 12 tribes of Israel were sealed with the blood of the Lamb. So, during Passover, Vespasian allowed the Jews to come into Jerusalem unharmed but would not let them leave.

And that seige lasted five months. That's how long the people starved.

[firestormx]

Abadon was the angel that destroyed Egypt's firstborn

Please show me where this is in scripture. I Think the only angels that have been named in the bible was, Gabriel, Micheal and the fallen angel lucifer.

[Bluefinger]

Abadon was the angel that destroyed Egypt's firstborn

Please show me where this is in scripture. I Think the only angels that have been named in the bible was, Gabriel, Micheal and the fallen angel lucifer.

"For the Lord will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the Lord will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite you." (Exodus 12:23 KJV)

Evidently, the destroyer was the LORD. But, as typical in Exodus, the Angel of The Lord's presence often interacted with the people. I think it is the same in the case.

Abaddon was often used to describe a place of destruction. To transfer it to Greek to denote the name of a king brings it into perspective. If the angel of the Lord's presence was the one that killed the firstborn of each Egyptian, there is no reason to suspect that God wouldn't send someone (Vespasian) to destroy Jerusalem.

"And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said, The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son, And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come. Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage. But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise: And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them. But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city." (Matthew 22:1-7 KJV)

The king, evidently God, sent his armies to destroy the Jewish Nation and burn Jerusalem.

[Montana Marv]

One needs to go back to Rev 8:13 which follows the 4th Trumpet. 8:13b - Woe, Woe, Woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the trumpet blasts about to be sounded by the other three angels.

The 5th Trumpet is not limited to Israel. It encompasses all those on the earth who don't have the seal of God. Woe, Woe, Woe to the inhabitants of the earth. The 5th Trumpet is a woe to the inhabitants of the earth; the 6th Trumpet is a Woe to the inhabitants of the earth; the 7th Trumpet is a Woe to the inhabitants of the earth. Gobal "Woe"-ality.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[firestormx]

Abadon was the angel that destroyed Egypt's firstborn

Please show me where this is in scripture. I Think the only angels that have been named in the bible was, Gabriel, Micheal and the fallen angel lucifer.

"For the Lord will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the Lord will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite you." (Exodus 12:23 KJV)

Evidently, the destroyer was the LORD. But, as typical in Exodus, the Angel of The Lord's presence often interacted with the people. I think it is the same in the case.

Abaddon was often used to describe a place of destruction. To transfer it to Greek to denote the name of a king brings it into perspective. If the angel of the Lord's presence was the one that killed the firstborn of each Egyptian, there is no reason to suspect that God wouldn't send someone (Vespasian) to destroy Jerusalem.

"And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said, The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son, And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come. Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage. But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise: And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them. But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city." (Matthew 22:1-7 KJV)

The king, evidently God, sent his armies to destroy the Jewish Nation and burn Jerusalem.

Thanks for answering but I still don't agree saying that it was an angel named abaddon, when the bible don't say that. It's adding to scripture. I guess my problem with this goes to before I was saved. Years ago before I was saved I heard the name abaddon alot, but I was in satanism at the time. I've only heard the name abaddon from occult places. Never scripture. Besides, if the bible say it was the Lord that passed through, why are you saying it was an angel named abaddon?

[other one]

Abaddon is the king Angel of the Abyss. His name in Greek is Apollyon or as we would say today Apollo. i'd have to look it up but I think it's in Rev. chapter nine.

[Bluefinger]

Abadon was the angel that destroyed Egypt's firstborn

Please show me where this is in scripture. I Think the only angels that have been named in the bible was, Gabriel, Micheal and the fallen angel lucifer.

"For the Lord will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the Lord will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite you." (Exodus 12:23 KJV)

Evidently, the destroyer was the LORD. But, as typical in Exodus, the Angel of The Lord's presence often interacted with the people. I think it is the same in the case.

Abaddon was often used to describe a place of destruction. To transfer it to Greek to denote the name of a king brings it into perspective. If the angel of the Lord's presence was the one that killed the firstborn of each Egyptian, there is no reason to suspect that God wouldn't send someone (Vespasian) to destroy Jerusalem.

"And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said, The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son, And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come. Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage. But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise: And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them. But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city." (Matthew 22:1-7 KJV)

The king, evidently God, sent his armies to destroy the Jewish Nation and burn Jerusalem.

Thanks for answering but I still don't agree saying that it was an angel named abaddon, when the bible don't say that. It's adding to scripture. I guess my problem with this goes to before I was saved. Years ago before I was saved I heard the name abaddon alot, but I was in satanism at the time. I've only heard the name abaddon from occult places. Never scripture. Besides, if the bible say it was the Lord that passed through, why are you saying it was an angel named abaddon?

Abaddon was a name frequently used in the Hebrew language in the Old Testament. It meant destruction or place of destruction. Translators only used Abaddon when Revelation called for its Hebrew name. So, when you see destruction or destroy in the Old Testament, its is likely a variant of the word Abaddon.

Apollyon means destoyer. Likely, this was a common word in the Greek Septuagint that has been lost over time.

Also, it was common for the angel of the LORD's presence to be treated as God Himself. For example:

"Now Moses kept the flock of Jethro his father in law, the priest of Midian: and he led the flock to the backside of the desert, and came to the mountain of God, even to Horeb. And the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed. And when the Lord saw that he turned aside to see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said, Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I. And he said, Draw not nigh hither: put off thy shoes from off thy feet, for the place whereon thou standest is holy ground." (Exodus 3:1, 2, 4, 5 KJV)

Who called out to Moses? The angel of the LORD or the LORD Himself? After establishing that Christ is greater than the angels, the writer of Hebrews says this:

"For if the word spoken by angels was stedfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompence of reward; How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;" (Hebrews 2:2, 3 KJV)

The author of Hebrews says that angels gave the Law even though it was well accepted that the Law came from the finger of God.

So, after seeing that God often ministers to humanity through angels, it should not be a far stretch for me to say that the destroyer that killed Egypts firstborn was an angel of the Lord. That explains why God said He would destroy Egypts firstborn and then, in the same passage, assign that duty to the destoyer. And Apollyon in Greek means the destroyer.