Christian Festivals

[The_Patriot21]

When Jesus says do as I do in the NT-follow me in my ways-that is a commandment to follow His example and His traditions, one of which was keeping the Holy day festivals, if you want eternal life.

Paul reiterated that to the gentiles in the NT church.

I would be like a broken record if I repeat all the scripture already on this thread calling for us to follow God's commandments including the Holy days. 

My problem is, people want absolute concrete proof without any doubt or faith being needed, to have direct orders to keep God's commandments and traditions verse for verse from the Bible yet they will blindly accept man made pagan themed Christian holidays without any question or proof whatsoever.

Zach 14:16-19 -shows in the end time under Christ's reign on earth, we will be forced to keep the Feast of Tabernacles, as man fails to honor it now.

There is a start and an ending to God's Holy day plan. The millennium is the final stage of God's plan and since Tabernacles represents that, we no longer see the earlier holy days mentioned. Although just because some days are not mentioned it does not mean they will be abandoned. we don't know yet.

When Jesus said we have to keep His commandments He named 3 or 4 of them when asked. Just because He didn't mention them all doesn't mean they were no longer in effect.

The Spiritual aspect of the NT is used by many to forego the physical requirements still needed to be a true Christian-our works. 

 

again, you say when "Jesus says do as I do" and don't list the scripture reference. You listed one in Zacharias, but thats OT not NT. You hinted at a few like the one in revelation-but you have yet to list a single new testament passage. Like where Jesus said do as I do-or that one in revelations.  So please, list some specific new testament passages.

 

I will, however list a scripture reference "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. Ephesians 2:8-9. We are NOT saved through our works. We are NOT saved by following OT festivals. We are saved by faith through grace and not of works. I see nothing, in the new testament that tells us we have to follow OT festivals. Theyre not required for salvation and not required of christians, and many just quite frankly, don't apply-like passover. It was there to remind the Jews of God delivering them from Egypt. Well, were not jews. We were never delievered from Egypt. We were delivered from sin-by Christs death and resurrection, which is why I believe we should observe easter. and Christmas, as well as communion-because Jesus did tell us to do that. But he did not tell us to observe passover, or any of the other jewish holidays-again, If they draw you closer to Christ theres nothing wrong with observing them, but they are not a requirement.

[fruitfull77]

First Holy day festivals were to be kept forever Exodus 12:24, Leviticus 16;29-30 -they were permanent observances

 

1Cor 11:23-27 -Pauls shows not only did they keep the Holy days annually-with its new symbols but also that all Christians(and these are mostly gentiles)should continue to observe them until Christ returns.

1Cor 5:8 - " Let us keep the feast......"

Acts 20:16

! Cor. 16;18 -Paul even arranges his schedule according to where he wanted to be on the festival of Pentecost.

did Jesus celebrate the feast day -Matt 26;17

1Peter 2:21 Paul says we, the church, are to follow Christ's example.

 

Did Jesus tell us to follow His example or instructions -Luke 6:46-49

 

Matt 7:21-29- follow me, do as I do, in respect of all His commands and examples.

 

keeping the Festivals will not save you, correct -they are a reminder of God's plan for salvation leading up to His return and for commemoration 

 

1Peter 2:21-we should do as Jesus did.

 

John 8:12- Jesus says follow me

 

Zacharias is a prophecy, not an OT law you can discard, it's an event that hasn't happened yet- revealing a vision from God depicting what will be happening at the return of Christ during the Millinnium in respect of His Holy day festival --it parallels Revelation

Edited September 8, 2013 by fruitfull77

[JDavis]

isn't it a bit early for the Christmas bashing threads? 

[The_Patriot21]

Zechariah 14:16-19 is not referring to us. It is a OT prophecy and aimed at the Jewish people.

 

It is natural for Paul to follow Jewish festivals, as he himself was a jew. There was nothing wrong with the festivals, and they are a part of his culture, so naturally, he would follow them. What you don't see, anywhere in the NT (correct me if Im wrong) is any gentiles observing jewish feasts.

 

Jesus, also celebrated the feasts-at least, before His death. He was born and raised a jew-if He had refused no one would have even listened to Him, and it would have been hypocritical of Him Not to.

 

So, if we are to literally do everything that Jesus did, do you fish? Jesus fished, so we should all go out and go fishing. And we cant do it with poles, we must use nets.

[fruitfull77]

If you read the whole chapter 14 of Zechariah you will see the prophecy portraying the coming of the Lord to take over rule of the whole world.

The time frame is addressed right from the outset in verse 1.-Behold the Day of the Lord is coming..."

The Day of the Lord designates the time of God's intervention in human affairs to assume rulership over the earth as described in Revelation. It applies to everyone.

 

Paul speaks to the gentile converts in Corinthians and Colossians.

1Cor 5;8-" Therefore let us keep the feast..."

 

Paul shows that pagan customs and traditions have no place in God's church or its people - 2 Cor 6:14-18

Jesus says the same thing-Mark 7:6-9

 

Did Paul dump the Old Testament Commandments and Holy days when he joined Jesus-no. He kept them, and taught them to the gentile converts. You can take that to the bank.

 

If you want to do a study about the Christian holidays of our time-xmas, easter, halloween even , I would welcome that.

If your 100% sure man's traditional holidays have replaced God's Holy Days then why not take this challenge.

Which man made holiday would you like to start with?

Edited September 9, 2013 by fruitfull77

[The_Patriot21]

1 corinthians Paul is not even talking about keeping a specific festival, he is just using that as a metephor, so to speak. He is addressing the corinthian church about their sins of fornification-that they needed to do away with them, and become pure and follow Christ-and used the feast to examplify his point. Goes back to reading the entire chapter, not just part of it, as you accused me of doing with zachariah.

 

Speaking of Zachariah, yes, it is mentioned in the prophecy, that perhaps we will keep it when Christ comes-but I see no command to keep it now.

 

i agree, pagan rituals have no place in the church. But, I don't see how celebrating Christs Birth, His death, and His resurrection, are pagan. It matters not what day you celebrate them-what matters is that you do celebrate them, because without that, we are nothing. We have no salvation without what Christ did for us on the cross-without that, no matter how many festivals we keep, we are doomed to hell.

 

And you get me wrong. I dont think theyve necessarily replaced them-I just see them as more important. I have nothing against others who wish to keep the OT holidays. If I ever get the chance to observe a jewish passover or feast of tabernacles, I would probably go. But, I don't see them as being required. I see requiring us to do it is the very definition of legalism-and goes against Gods grace. I celebrate the modern ones-christmas, easter, and good friday, because they remind me of what Christ did for me on that cross 2000 years ago-and that Is what I find important.

 

It matters not what holidays you observe. What matters, is where your heart is, because if you follow a holiday for any other reason then to draw closer to God, whether it be because of "tradition" or "the law" or "chocolate covered eggs and presents" then you are following it for the wrong reasons.

[fruitfull77]

When we read " Let us keep the Feast " Paul is telling the Corinthians to keep the feast.-Paul is comparing a Christian's  deliverance from sin through the sacrifice of Christ.to Israel's deliverance from Egypt using leaven representing sin.

Does Paul say Let us not keep the Feast anywhere in the New Testament. 

Was Paul going to celebrate Pentecost or is there somewhere in the NT Paul said we don't need to celebrate it anymore?

In Acts 18:21-When Paul said I must by all means keep this Feast. When does He make the big turn around and start telling people don't keep these Feast days anymore.

I can't find it anywhere-please show me.

[OneLight]

Acts 21:25

"But concerning the Gentiles who believe, we have written and decided that they should observe no such thing, except that they should keep themselves from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality.”

[fruitfull77]

Acts 21:25

"But concerning the Gentiles who believe, we have written and decided that they should observe no such thing, except that they should keep themselves from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality.”

I believe this concerns clean and unclean meats not the Holy day festivals-some accused Paul of forsaking Moses but he refutes this in Acts 24:14.

 

But my question remains: If so called Christian holidays, like xmas and easter weren't introduced until several centuries after Paul's death, what Holy days did Paul teach and celebrate in the New Testament then?

Edited September 10, 2013 by fruitfull77

[other one]

Col 2:16-17

16 Therefore let no one act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day —   things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.

NASB

 

 

I would say none for we gentile believers anyway..  They seem to be optional.

 

I am not speaking in favor of Christmas or Easter, however I don't make an issue about it when friends participate.   I do participate in the hanging of the green at church for there is one wreath that I'm the only one tall enough to hang up without a stool.  I don't think God will get me for it.