kwikphilly Posted October 2, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 96 Topic Count: 307 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 18,143 Content Per Day: 4.62 Reputation: 27,832 Days Won: 327 Joined: 08/03/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted October 2, 2013 Blessings to everyone, I see much opinion about a person that none of us know.....although out of her own mouth she seems to be trying to defend her actions(sin)to others by her statement that she believes she is forgiven for her lifestyle....obviously she knows that she is continually sinning ,however we still cannot know her heart.I have never even met this person and if I did ,of course,I would try to help her ... None of us know what her heart is saying ,none of us know although she is seeking the approval of man that she doesn't lie awake at night saying",Lord...what do I do?I do not know how to change my ways,I don't want to change my ways but I cannot stand the guilt".....and yet she still struggles with one knee bent but the other just can't make it to the floor. I only say these things because I lived it....I looked and sounded like I had no remorse but I was dying inside.....thank God my brothers & sisters loved me and ministered to me without jugdement....Glory to God that He forgave me while I was yet in sin and was my patient,loving and gracious Savior that kept tugging at my heart as I continued to sin ....whispering softly,"You are worth so much more,I love you....come nearer" With love,in Christ-Kwik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micheal Westin Posted October 2, 2013 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 1 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 616 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 96 Days Won: 3 Joined: 03/07/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted October 2, 2013 (edited) It seems here you are equating normal Christian who have the typical struggles in their walk with what God calls reprobates...people who have not had a regenerate spirit in them. It seems too you also are equating the Gospel with the way God dealt with people under the Law... Which is not the same in my opinion. God's word is what it is. I believe the scriptures apply to people who claim they are saved. There is really nothing to debate in the above texts as scripture speaks for itself, and interprets itself, but some have a hard time understanding and will always find something somewhere to change what the scriptures says. Some it seems would rather try to "win a debate" when there is no debate, than to take scripture to mean what it says. absolutely! I believe living in sin unrepentantly is conclusive evidence you are not abiding in Christ Edited October 7, 2013 by GoldenEagle Edits in red. fixed edited quoted posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted October 2, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted October 2, 2013 (edited) absolutely! I believe living in sin unrepentantly is conclusive evidence you are not abiding in Christ It is also conclusive in my opinion that a person has yet to experience salvation. Edited October 7, 2013 by GoldenEagle edits in red. fixed edited quoted post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted October 2, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.10 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted October 2, 2013 (edited) Well I believe Jesus is talking about people who leave the faith. All scripture is Holy Spirit inspired. I believe you are making up an idea that is not scriptural. To me, the writer of Hebrews tells us the same thing but worded differently in Hebrews 10:26-32 "For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins. But a certain fearful looking for ofjujdgment and firey indignation, which shall devourthe adversaries. He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, sujppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of Grace?" I believe you have convoluted the simple message. It is my understanding a believer never willfully continues in sin, but has an aversion to sin. Kind of like the idea of the new man and the new nature... As soon as a believer sins, he is confronted by Holy Spirit within, and is aware of the battleground he has just stepped on. Absolutely, F.A.! Good interpretation. Edited October 7, 2013 by GoldenEagle <<< fixed edited quoted posts... >> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted October 2, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted October 2, 2013 (edited) Well I believe Jesus is talking about people who leave the faith. All scripture is Holy Spirit inspired. I believe you are making up an idea that is not scriptural. To me, the writer of Hebrews tells us the same thing but worded differently in Hebrews 10:26-32 "For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins. But a certain fearful looking for ofjujdgment and firey indignation, which shall devourthe adversaries. He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, sujppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of Grace?" I believe you have convoluted the simple message. It is my understanding a believer never willfully continues in sin, but has an aversion to sin. Kind of like the idea of the new man and the new nature... As soon as a believer sins, he is confronted by Holy Spirit within, and is aware of the battleground he has just stepped on. No one automatically becomes a new person. You don't become sinless because you speak it and you don't suddenly or necessairly stop being an alcoholic or adulter or whatever just because you have become a believer. Christians are in counselling or asking for prayer regularly BECAUSE they have the perception there is something wrong with them when actually they are still dealing with the sin nature...which Paul talks about at great length. Anyway, I'm not getting more involved than what I just posted as it becomes like a game of tennis back and forth and that is useless. I say if someone acknowledges what scripture states...that is ALL of it... PRECEPT UPON PRECEPT...and does not take verses out of context or put a spin on them or think there is a magic combination of words...we do reach the conclusion that some do fall away and we do not achieve perfection EVER on this earth. That, is simply false and WOF teaching in my opinion. I believe there are some very sincere Christains who have ongoing sin issues and they are unresolved issues because they have not systematically studied the Bible and do not understand what they are dealing with. There are Christians who are demonized as well...not possessed as some like to think...but who do have a harder struggle as they are attacked and have no idea how to defend themselves or how to grow spiritually. These are complicated issues...any one of which can be solved through understanding and the application of the truths of the Bible but too many prefer shortcuts and expect things that God never promised. I'm not getting into the fray here, but there has been some false concepts presented here that help no one and may instead inflict even more guilt. Such as, the reason you still have a problem or the reason you are not healed is because you don't have enough faith. This is nonsense in my opinion. Edited October 7, 2013 by GoldenEagle Edits in red Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted October 2, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,991 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,689 Content Per Day: 11.79 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted October 2, 2013 People who are Christian and are being rebellious and doing wrong when they know it is against God are in big trouble in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted October 2, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted October 2, 2013 (edited) No one automatically becomes a new person. You don't become sinless because you speak it and you don't suddenly or necessairly stop being an alcoholic or adulter or whatever just because you have become a believer. Christians are in counselling or asking for prayer regularly BECAUSE they have the perception there is something wrong with them when actually they are still dealing with the sin nature...which Paul talks about at great length. Anyway, I'm not getting more involved than what I just posted as it becomes like a game of tennis back and forth and that is useless. I say if someone acknowledges what scripture states...that is ALL of it... PRECEPT UPON PRECEPT...and does not take verses out of context or put a spin on them or think there is a magic combination of words...we do reach the conclusion that some do fall away and we do not achieve perfection EVER on this earth. That, is simply false and WOF teaching in my opinion. I believe there are some very sincere Christains who have ongoing sin issues and they are unresolved issues because they have not systematically studied the Bible and do not understand what they are dealing with. There are Christians who are demonized as well...not possessed as some like to think...but who do have a harder struggle as they are attacked and have no idea how to defend themselves or how to grow spiritually. These are complicated issues...any one of which can be solved through understanding and the application of the truths of the Bible but too many prefer shortcuts and expect things that God never promised. I'm not getting into the fray here, but there has been some false concepts presented here that help no one and may instead inflict even more guilt. Such as, the reason you still have a problem or the reason you are not healed is because you don't have enough faith. This is nonsense in my opinion. I believe every single person who accepts Jesus Christ receives a new nature, but we all have a remnant of the old man within us, which is the reason why we have a conflict, a battle waging in us! Do you not understand why we are told to put on the whole armour of God? Yes, I would agree there are Christians who suffer because of ignorance of the word of God, and possibly due to strongholds (demonization), and in some cases I believe some never do receive deliverance, but continue to suffer as if that is their "cross to bear", not aware that they have been offered complete freedom in Christ! I believe Faith is how we receive all that God promises. Edited October 7, 2013 by GoldenEagle Edits in red Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted October 2, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted October 2, 2013 People who are Christian and are being rebellious and doing wrong when they know it is against God are in big trouble in my opinion. Simple and true. But if they have had a rebirth in Christ, they will have trouble, but God's mercy will be on them because they belong to Him. We can trust God who has made their lives His abode, to continue to chase after them until they become so uncomfortable in their rebellion that they repent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightsilence Posted October 2, 2013 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 1 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 3 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/02/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted October 2, 2013 (edited) John 3:16-21: "16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son. 19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that their deeds will be exposed. 21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what they have done has been done in the sight of God." Here I am, a man who is guilty of gross sin before God. I cannot understand how or why God would still choose to love me. I don't know why a cur has any place in His sheepfold. May God be praised and blessed in every nation, just, thank you, Jesus. Edited October 3, 2013 by OneLight This is a family friendly site. Please help us keep it that way! Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted October 3, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted October 3, 2013 (edited) I believe every single person who accepts Jesus Christ receives a new nature, but we all have a remnant of the old man within us, which is the reason why we have a conflict, a battle waging in us! Do you not understand why we are told to put on the whole armour of God? Yes, I would agree there are Christians who suffer because of ignorance of the word of God, and possibly due to strongholds (demonization), and in some cases I believe some never do receive deliverance, but continue to suffer as if that is their "cross to bear", not aware that they have been offered complete freedom in Christ! I believe Faith is how we receive all that God promises. Would you like to point out where I stated that Christians do NOT have a new nature in Christ? IMO the problems that occur when someone misquotes what another poster states are a fine example of what happens when the Bible is misquoted Kindly note, I am not putting anything myself or another poster on the same level as the Bible (lest that also gets misquoted) Faith comes from God...it is not what we work up or the words we say...and that is a MAJOR sticking point with WOF teaching... So to me YOUR words do not have the same import as the words of Christ. We are not little Jesus' running around with God obeying the words we speak. If anyone lacks faith, then they should ask of God, as scripture teaches, who is more than willing to give the very thing we lack. Faith is not an end in and of itself. I believe this is a terrible distortion of what the Bible states and the reason so many people become disenchanted with WOF teaching. Christians suffer from more than a lack of what should be the Bread of Life...they also suffer greatly because of the distorted picture painted by false shepherds, prophets and teachers that God has not called by His Holy Spirit and has not gifted. The gifts are for the building up of the Body of Christ...for the edificaiton of the church (believers) They are not so people can become famous and milk others for money. These false miracle workers have their reward now...they will not have another. Edited October 7, 2013 by GoldenEagle Edits in red Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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