Salty Posted August 13, 2014 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,665 Content Per Day: 0.46 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/11/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted August 13, 2014 Salty The 5th Trumpet is distinctly different from the 6th Trumpet. Two different angels sounding two different Trumpets . The 2nd Trumpet is different, from the 3rd, 4th or 5th. The 6th is different from the rest of the Trumpets. Don't mix events. To kill is to kill. 2nd Trumpet - 1/3 of the living creatures in the sea died, and 1/3 of the ships destroyed. In Christ Montana Marv Yes, we know the 5th and 6th trumpets are not the same trumpets, and are not the other trumpets. But the event associations, that's another matter entirely. The same locust army described in the first part of Rev.9 on the 5th trumpet is the same army mentioned on the 6th trumpet. Rev.9 7 And the shapes of the locusts were like unto horses prepared unto battle; and on their heads were as it were crowns like gold, and their faces were as the faces of men. 8 And they had hair as the hair of women, and their teeth were as the teeth of lions. 9 And they had breastplates, as it were breastplates of iron; and the sound of their wings was as the sound of chariots of many horses running to battle. On the 5th trumpet that says the locusts are "prepared unto battle". The actual battle they do is on the 6th trumpet. It's on the 6th trumpet when their loosing happens. On the 5th trumpet their breastplates are of iron, but on the 6th trumpet they are of fire, brimstone, and of jacinth, and their power is in their 'mouths', and their 'tails' (scorpion tail association picked up from the v.5 description on the 5th trumpet.) If you're familiar with the prophecies in the Book of Joel about those locusts, then you should understand those different locust types given, and how they represent a graduated working upon the earth against God's people. For example, the type of working by the locusts to bring the coming "one world government" system is different than when the Antichrist appears and it becomes de facto a beast kingdom with him sitting over it as king of the world to deceive the nations. As of right now, lot of God's people are involved in bringing the "one world government" system over all nations; they think it's a good thing, ending war, world peace and prosperity for all peoples, etc., and believe they are helping to bring in Christ's Kingdom here on earth, but they are being deceived. The majority of them aren't aware how Satan's workers are behind that strategy, in order to bring the Rev.13:1 beast system over all peoples in prep for the Antichrist-Pseudo-Christ (like Albert Pike's revealing with the goal of world-wide worship of Lucifer, with a twist, because the majority of the world will be led to believe Lucifer is God, and as Christ to the deceived in Christ's Church). That's what the locusts are doing on the 5th trumpet - 1st woe period, preparing the "one world government" for the coming 2nd beast, a king, which is the angel of the bottomless pit. On the Rev.9:13 verse, the 6th trumpet - 2nd woe period begins. That period continues all the way to the 7th trumpet - 3rd woe period. So all those events from Rev.9:13 to Rev.11:14 are within that 6th trumpet - 2nd woe period. What if we look at the events in Rev.11:1-14 then, to see what kind of time that 6th trumpet - 2nd woe period will be? A temple in Jerusalem is shown, with certain ones worshiping in it, with the Gentiles given to tread the holy city for 42 months. It's the same timing the 'dragon' is given to reign per Rev.13. God's two witnesses are prophesying in Jerusalem for that period, and then towards the end of that period are killed with their dead bodies left laying in the street. We are told they are killed by the beast that ascends up from the bottomless pit; that's the dragon of Rev.12 & 13, the king of Rev.9:11. Because of how those two witnesses torment the nations, the nations will rejoice and make merry, and give each other gifts when those two prophets are dead. That is not Armageddon, far from it. That 2nd woe period is the time of great tribulation upon the saints. The nations are not killing each other in that time, not making war, they are sided with that beast that ascends from the bottomless pit, and his locust army of Rev.9. That battle is spiritual, not one with physical military armies. Rev.9 18 By these three was the third part of men killed, by the fire, and by the smoke, and by the brimstone, which issued out of their mouths. Just what is it that is killed by what comes out of one's mouth? What did our Lord Jesus say about what comes out of one's mouth that defiles the man, and not what goes into one's mouth? It's about words, not military weapons. Those locusts destroy using deception by what comes out of their mouths. So what is it they kill by that deception? One's soul. This is why we're told the following about those not affected by what comes out of those locust's mouths... Rev.9 20 And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk: 21 Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts. The reason why those wicked are doing that evil still within that 6th trumpet - 2nd woe period, and why they are not affected by those plagues out of the locust's mouths is because why? it's because those wicked are already... in Satan's hand; those are already deceived and doing his work on earth. And that brings us to the final revelation of what 6th trumpet - 2nd woe time period is about, and just who the locusts are directed upon: They are directed upon God's people, specifically those who keep God's commandments and have the Testimony of Jesus Christ, and not upon the wicked. If one is a wicked follower of the devil in that time, they are in safety from the Antichrist, for he already owns those wicked (i.e., those who will say, "Peace and safety" like Paul taught in 1 Thess.5). Recall the end of Rev.12 that the dragon-serpent is coming to make war upon the saints in Christ Jesus, not upon those in the world that he already owns. In some ways I'm surprised at how few understand this from that Rev.9 chapter. Especially in light of the specific warnings our Lord Jesus and His Apostles gave us about the coming pseudo-Christ for the end, telling us to not be deceived, and not believe on that coming false one who will sit in a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem and proclaim himself as God, and work miracles on a level that if possible, would deceive even Christ's own elect. Then on the other hand, I'm not surprised why so many brethren would be deceived about this, since the traditions coming out of the seminaries focus so much on that Rev.9 chapter as being about all out war in association with the battle of Armageddon. The Pre-Trib Rapture school happens to be one of the most ardent supporters of that Rev.9 army being a real military in all out war. Yet that's not what it's about for that 6th trumpet - 2nd woe period. The blowing of that 6th trumpet is when the 'dragon' and his angels are loosed upon this earth for the "great tribulation" period, a time opposite of wars and rumours of wars per our Lord Jesus in Matt.24, a time of "Peace and safety" per Apostle Paul in 1 Thess.5, the time of craft prospering in the beast's hand per Dan.8. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marilyn C Posted August 13, 2014 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 30 Topic Count: 266 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 13,204 Content Per Day: 3.49 Reputation: 8,497 Days Won: 12 Joined: 12/21/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/06/1947 Share Posted August 13, 2014 (edited) Hi Last daze, Sorry to give the impression that the martyrs were under judgment. That is why I put them in brackets. The Lord, as we know will avenge their blood. `How long O Lord, holy & true, wilt Thou refrain from judging & avenging our blood on those who dwell on the earth?` (Rev. 6: 10) Just as God said He would do - `Indeed, I lift up my hand to heaven, & say as I live forever, If I sharpen my flashing sword & My hand takes hold on justice, I will render vengeance on My adversaries, & I will repay those who hate Me. I will make My arrows drunk with blood & My sword shall devour flesh, with the blood of the slain & the captives, from the long-haired leaders of the enemy.` `Rejoice, O nations, with His people; For He will avenge the blood of His servants, & will render vengeance on His adversaries, & will atone for His land & His people.` (Deut. 32: 40 - 43) Edited August 13, 2014 by Marilyn C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jesse Posted August 14, 2014 Share Posted August 14, 2014 Hi. After reading rev.11. how can one still believe in pre trib? Revelation 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth. THEY WILL PROPHECY FOR 3/HALF YEARS . Revelation 11:4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.Revelation 11:5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.Revelation 11:6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.Revelation 11:7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them. AFTER THEY HAVE WITNESSED FOR 3/HALF YEARS; HEY WILL BE KILLED,BY THE BEAST.(THE NEW WORLD SYSTEM). Revelation 11:8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified. THEIR DEAD BODIES WILL BE LEFT OUT ON THE STREET OF JERUSALEM FOR 3/HALF DAYS. Revelation 11:9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves. ALL NATIONS WILL SEE THEIR DEAD BODIES FOR 3/HALF DAYS. IT'S LIKE A SHOW OF POWER.Revelation 11:10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth. ALL THAT DWELL ON EARTH WILL REJOICE AND PARTY.THIS MEANS THAT THEY ARE FOR THE NEW SYSTEM BEAST.Revelation 11:11 And after three days and an half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them. AFTER 3/HALF DAYS THEY WILL BE REVIVED,BY GOD.Revelation 11:12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them. THEY WILL BE SEEN TAKEN UP; SEEN BY THEIR ENEMIES. Revelation 11:13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven. THAT SAME HOUR/DAY AGREAT EARTH QUAKE;7000DIED.Revelation 11:14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly. THAT WAS THE SECOND WOE OF THE 6TH TRUMPET. THE THIRD WOE IS COMING QUICKLY, WHICH IS THE 7TH TRUMPET.Revelation 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. THE 7TH TRUMPET IS THE COMING. Revelation 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,Revelation 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.Revelation 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.Revelation 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail. AFTER THE 7TH TRUMPET ;THE TEMPLE IS OPEN AGAIN. IT WAS CLOSED AT THE FIRST TRUMPET. ANYONE CAN TELL WHEN THE COMING WILL BE. (BUT NOT THE DAY OR HOUR). 1.THEY WILL WITNEES FOR 3/HALF YEARS. THEN KILLED. 3/HALF YRS. 2. THEIR DEAD BODIES LEFT OUT FOR 3/HALF DAYS. THEN TAKEN UP. 3HALF DAYS. 3.THE SAME HOUR A GREAT EARTH QUAKE. SAME DAY. 0. 4.THEN QUICKLY THE 7TH TRUMP. THE COMING. THIS COULD BE ONE WEEK? 7 DAYS. ------------------------- NOW WE CAN SEE WHEN CHRIST IS COMING; 3/HALF YEARS AND 10/HALF DAYS. FROM THE FIRST DAY OF WITNESSING. TO THE COMING (APPROX). THE DAY AND HOUR NO ONE KNOWS. jesse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Marv Posted August 14, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 19 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 3,135 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 1,091 Days Won: 2 Joined: 11/03/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted August 14, 2014 Salty The locust of the 5th Trumpet come up out of the abyss. These locust torment people for 5 months. The army of the 6th Trumpet come out of the East. They kill 1/3 of mankind, say between China and the Euphrates River. I find it difficult (by your senerio) that only those West of the Euphrates are not affected by the locust. There is no common tie between the 5th and 6th Trumpets (except) that these from the Abyss after their 5 months of torment may then indwell the horses of the 6th Trumpet on their way from China to the Euphrates River. . That may be possible. In Christ Montana Marv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Posted August 14, 2014 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,665 Content Per Day: 0.46 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/11/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted August 14, 2014 Salty The locust of the 5th Trumpet come up out of the abyss. These locust torment people for 5 months. The army of the 6th Trumpet come out of the East. They kill 1/3 of mankind, say between China and the Euphrates River. I find it difficult (by your senerio) that only those West of the Euphrates are not affected by the locust. There is no common tie between the 5th and 6th Trumpets (except) that these from the Abyss after their 5 months of torment may then indwell the horses of the 6th Trumpet on their way from China to the Euphrates River. . That may be possible. In Christ Montana Marv Forget it. To you it apparently is not given to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spock Posted August 24, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 29 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,239 Content Per Day: 0.86 Reputation: 1,686 Days Won: 6 Joined: 12/26/2013 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 24, 2014 Update 8/23/2014: After researching this topic pretty extensively this past week, I am now more convinced that this battle is different from Armageddon. Yes there are similarities, but the differences, as previously stated, are to insurmountable. I still believe this battle occurs just prior to Daniels 70th week and thus prior to the Day of The Lord. If you want to know even more of what I think-I do believe all believers in Christ who are alive will witness this event on CNN and Fox News. In other words, not Raptured yet, but....... It wouldn't be long after this event..... Up, up, and away........ Don't forget to pray the Luke 21:36 prayer. It's at the bottom of my signature photo if you don't want to look it up. Spock out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Posted August 24, 2014 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,665 Content Per Day: 0.46 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/11/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted August 24, 2014 I'm convinced per the Ezekiel 39 chapter that it is the same timing and battle as Armageddon. Direct parallels drawn between the end of Rev.16 & 19 with Ezekiel 39. And one of the strongest clues is the gathering of the house of Israel, which is to only occur at Christ's second coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted August 25, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.23 Reputation: 9,762 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted August 25, 2014 The thread is closed fore review. Not sure how this thread had been missed. People, in the future, if you cannot discuss the subject without attacking people, don't bother replying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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