other one Posted September 22, 2014 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,200 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,930 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted September 22, 2014 I am not judging any of you for what you believe. ----snip---- God has shown me a better way. But you are judging in the very same post that you claim you are not judging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Eye Posted September 22, 2014 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 118 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 52 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/20/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/31/1950 Share Posted September 22, 2014 I am not judging any of you for what you believe. ----snip---- God has shown me a better way. But you are judging in the very same post that you claim you are not judging. God has shown me a better way for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenEagle Posted September 22, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.80 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted September 22, 2014 I did read it. I just kept having the verses that talk about "who so ever lives by the sword will die by the sword" run through my mind. Everything about guns, including their purpose is violent. We all fall short, but every moment of our lives is suppose to bring glory to God. How does guns and the violence with them glorify God? Maybe we will just have to agree to disagree on this one. no sorry....I cannot agree to disagree because this is not a matter of opinion and I'll explain why First of all, you state Jesus did not teach or preach violence....that implies that is someone who wants to defend themself, they are not following Christ Second, you mention what Jesus said regarding the sword. Jesus is speaking here of those who use violence as a lifestyle. Is anyone here living by guns? Are responders using weapons to take what they want? Context is everything and the broad application that you and some others wish to make, just does not fit the context in which Jesus spoke I will tell who is actually living by the sword...ISIS and those of like ilk. And they will die as they live. Personal interpretation of scripture in this case is dangerous and puts people into a state wherein they expect God to enact miracles for them and that is not always the case As I already mentionned, it is like saying that the Bible says that God will always heal everyone...no He does NOT Why ignore the questions I ask? It's like I said...the hard, thoughtful questions do not get answered Why did God allow all those Jewish people, men, women and children to be tortured and killed in WWII? Why didn't He intervene and if He did not intervene, does that mean that anyone who saved the Jews enacted against God's will? Things are not that simple...it takes a big working knowledge of the Bible to make the kind of call that says Jesus says this or that and you are not listening That, is a very big responsibility and not an opinion. Further, taking one verse and making a ginormous judgement call on each and every thing that might happen in the life of any one human being on any given day on the planet is just, IMO, well....not understanding how God works in our lives The Bible does not consist of a few words of Jesus...the entire Bible is the word of God +1 to this post Sevenseas. Context in Scripture is key. Guns don't kill people. People kill people. Guns are amoral much like money, etc. God bless, GE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenEagle Posted September 22, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.80 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted September 22, 2014 i've always been curious how one could think doing nothing to protect someone from harm is a reflection of Christ's love. Excellent question/point. Makes me wonder what some people believe about police officers or those in the military? God bless, GE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenEagle Posted September 22, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.80 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted September 22, 2014 I keep hearing, over and over again, what Jesus would do. While that is a valid question, its overlooking some key issues. One, like I pointed out to enoob earlier, the ENTIRE bible was given to us-not just the new testament (2 Timothy 3:16) and the law, was given so that we know what sin is (romans 7:7) Jesus didn't come to eliminate the old testament-He came fulfill the covenant. The law-allows for violence in many cases, such as self defense. In fact, the same God that died for our sins-commanded the Israelites to completly anilate the canannites, men, women AND children. To say that Jesus never condoned violence-is to completly ignore the entire old testament. And its been brought up Jesus told Peter to put his sword away. But I want to point out two things, first off Jesus didn't tell Peter to get rid of His sword-just that it was the wrong time to use it. Second, Jesus told peter to purchase said sword shortly before (Luke 22:36) so that argument bears no weight as far as arguments against the ownership-and use, of deadly weapons. And even before that-Jesus used a whip, to chase off money lenders from a temple. A whip can be just as deadly a weapon as a sword or a gun if used properly-and Jesus did use it. He didn't hurt or kill anyone-but He did use it-and that alone is a clear act of violence. So tell me, how is it your peaceloving Jesus-used violence, and a weapon in that action of violence? And keep in mind-those money changers did not attack Jesus or show any violence toward Him-Jesus was the aggressor in that case. (john 2:15) +1 to this post. God bless, GE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenEagle Posted September 22, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 764 Topics Per Day: 0.18 Content Count: 7,626 Content Per Day: 1.80 Reputation: 1,559 Days Won: 44 Joined: 10/03/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted September 22, 2014 one last thing. is it just a gun thing? or are you also opposed to someone using their physical body to protect an innocent? for example, if a pedophile was caught assaulting a child, would you have the same problem with the christian who slammed him up against a wall to get him off the child? I don't like guns at all, so I won't even pretend I do. as for the rest, well....I just don't know. The bible says whatever is not of Faith is sin, so I guess it would depend on the heart of the christian( which only God can Judge the Heart). Guns however have 1 purpose, they were created for one purpose....to maim, to kill and to destroy, and that is not how we are instructed to live. No LadyC I don't like Guns. Interesting, again how does this apply to law enforcement and military? God bless, GE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Eye Posted September 22, 2014 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 118 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 52 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/20/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/31/1950 Share Posted September 22, 2014 I think if one uses a weapon to kill an animal to feed their family is a good use for a weapon. If one chooses to be a police officer or in the military and they use their weapon on somebody, then they have to live with what they have done the rest of their lives. I know. But if someone says they will shoot anyone who is about their harm their loved ones, well, where does God fit in? Do you say, "move over God, I'll take care of this". Or do you cry out, JESUS!'. Or do you say to yourself something else? Do you panic and shoot in fear? Do you shoot with the feeling of justification? What goes on inside your heart when you pull the trigger? I'm not judging, I just don't understand. Can someone express their feelings about this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted September 22, 2014 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,200 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,930 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted September 22, 2014 I think if one uses a weapon to kill an animal to feed their family is a good use for a weapon. If one chooses to be a police officer or in the military and they use their weapon on somebody, then they have to live with what they have done the rest of their lives. I know. But if someone says they will shoot anyone who is about their harm their loved ones, well, where does God fit in? Do you say, "move over God, I'll take care of this". Or do you cry out, JESUS!'. Or do you say to yourself something else? Do you panic and shoot in fear? Do you shoot with the feeling of justification? What goes on inside your heart when you pull the trigger? I'm not judging, I just don't understand. Can someone express their feelings about this? if it is not ok for me to use a weapon to protect myself and family, what makes a police officer any different..... you do realize that a police officer can only use his weapon for his self defense, or someone near by him. Main difference is that I don't go out looking for trouble..... but times are getting more and more dangerous. I would take it that you have probably never been mugged or had someone call you in the middle of the night declaring that he is going to beat you up, molest your wife and then kill you both...... I've even gotten some pretty nasty emails over a couple or three things I have posted here on worthy about the Muslim Brotherhood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Eye Posted September 22, 2014 Group: Junior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 118 Content Per Day: 0.03 Reputation: 52 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/20/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/31/1950 Share Posted September 22, 2014 I think if one uses a weapon to kill an animal to feed their family is a good use for a weapon. If one chooses to be a police officer or in the military and they use their weapon on somebody, then they have to live with what they have done the rest of their lives. I know. But if someone says they will shoot anyone who is about their harm their loved ones, well, where does God fit in? Do you say, "move over God, I'll take care of this". Or do you cry out, JESUS!'. Or do you say to yourself something else? Do you panic and shoot in fear? Do you shoot with the feeling of justification? What goes on inside your heart when you pull the trigger? I'm not judging, I just don't understand. Can someone express their feelings about this? if it is not ok for me to use a weapon to protect myself and family, what makes a police officer any different..... you do realize that a police officer can only use his weapon for his self defense, or someone near by him. Main difference is that I don't go out looking for trouble..... but times are getting more and more dangerous. I would take it that you have probably never been mugged or had someone call you in the middle of the night declaring that he is going to beat you up, molest your wife and then kill you both...... I've even gotten some pretty nasty emails over a couple or three things I have posted here on worthy about the Muslim Brotherhood. You would take it? Don't take it. You have no idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted September 22, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted September 22, 2014 so, would you say that God wasn't in control of the lives of the jews rebuilding the walls of jerusalem, who armed themselves while working, to protect their lives, their family, and their work? would you say God wasn't in control of david's life when he killed goliath with a weapon? would you say God wasn't in control of the lives of every biblical patriarch that went into battle, armed with weapons, killing the enemy? perhaps Jesus is in control of the lives of those who use weapons today to defend themselves, their family, and even their country. wouldn't you agree, tiger, that that is entirely possible? How is it these things are constantly overlooked? I found these stories in my Bible too It is the entire Bible we go to...not just cherry picked verses that fill our personal fruit baskets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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