Who are the Jehovah Witness?

[TheMatrixHasU71]

How can we prove Jesus is God?

 

First of all the word ELOHIM, plural. Not the so called royal plural which did not exist in biblical days. But God is/Elohim is plural because God is three persons, three distinct persons united as one.

 

In the beginning God/Elohim created the heaven and the earth....

John 1:1-3

1:1   In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

1:2  The same was in the beginning with God.

1:3  All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

 

John 1:14   And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, * (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Connect this with

1 John 4:2   Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

1 John 4:3   And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that [spirit] of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2 John 1:7   For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

 

Jesus is the Word. The Word was with God, the Word WAS/IS God.

The Word/God was MADE FLESH and dwelt among us.

The passages from 1-2 John are saying THAT WE MUST ACCEPT CHRIST IS GOD COME IN THE FLESH.

JWs like to say that Jesus is the first CREATED of all creation but the bible DOESNT SAY THAT. It say Jesus is the FIRSTBORN, which is not the same thing. Firstborn, the only BEGOTTEN (not created) Son of the Father and Holy Spirit.

Jesus could have been born, (by our perspective), billions or trillions of years before the creation of the universe (I say by our perspective as time as we know it doesn't exist in heaven). So its still perfectly proper to say he is God whose goings forth are from old, from EVERLASTING

 

Micah 5:2   But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, [though] thou be little among the thousands of Judah, [yet] out of thee shall he come forth unto me [that is] to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth [have been] from of old, from everlasting.

 

JWs also like to believe Jesus is MICHAEL in heaven because the name Michael means He who is like God. I would like to point out that Jesus isn't LIKE God He IS GOD.

 

Here is an answer to all who believe Jesus was/is Michael.

Hebrews 1:5   For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

Hebrews 1:13   But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?

 

NOW, CHANGE OF SUBJECT HERE BUT I WANTED TO ADD THIS ANYWAY

 

JWS like to believe wrongly that Jesus was hung on a stake, implying there was only one nail used in His wrists. To all who believe that I tell you...

 

John 20:25   The other disciples therefore said unto him, We have seen the Lord. But he said unto them, Except I shall see in his hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into his side, I will not believe.

 

NAILS.....NAILS.....NAILS.....

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 10, 2016 by TheMatrixHasU71

[kwikphilly]

Interesting Topic,,,,,sort of except it tends to go in so many directions most of the time,,,,

      I met a girl recently ,she had tracts in her hand & asked if she could talk a bit,,,,,,,,,"Of course you can" I said,,,,,,she was a JW,,,,,,,we talked a while,I listened mostly & then I asked her about her Bible(which I already knew the answers,,,,,,) she was trying to explain that the Scriptures are from the KJV ,,,,,,,,,,Praying,listening & waiting on the Lord,I responded & asked her to consider what she is reading,,,,,,,we really got into the translation process from the Greek Texts & by the time she left she promised she would look into the unadulterated KJV J& parallel read with her Watchtower edition,,,,,,Praise the Lord

     I explained we were not much different except that the WORD IS GOD,,,,,,,Jesus is GOD,the Trinity,Jesus Deity etc,,,,    rather than always debating what they believe,,,,,,,God Will Reveal Himself through us & whoever is truly seeking God will be convicted by the Holy Spirit,,,,,,that is "who" the JW's are,,,,,,just "people","individuals,,,,,just as we are,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,let go & let God,,,,,,,,To God be the Glory!                                With love-in Christ,Kwik

[woundeddog]

when I am visited by the JW folks I open the door, smile says"please don't go to hell," hand them a track and slam the door-- lol

[Guest Robert]

The average Jehovah’s Witness can make a “doctrinal pretzel” out of the average Christian in about  2 minutes; this is because they are constantly training and rehearsing their "scripts" that deal with standard Christian theology. They spend FIVE HOURS of training and meetings a week at their Kingdom Halls, not to mention adding hours in book studies at member's houses on top of that. Add to all of that the additional time they spend reading "The Watchtower" and "Awake!" magazines to boot!

On the topic of "training": they are specifically taught to "uniquely" interpret and use Scripture to catch Christians off guard. When someone is "off-balance" and doesn't know (or may know but doesn't have the reply ready), they move in and ask questions designed to make people doubt and question their stance in the faith.

Keep in mind: ALL of this is designed with one point in mind: to convert people into a Jehovah's Witness and bring them into the "fold".

Meantime, many Christians aren't well versed in the Bible at all: no offense is intended to anyone, but a great many are comfortable with simply believing what is taught to them on Sunday by their pastor, and never dig deeper to find out why they believe what they do. Fewer than half of people in the US can name the four Gospels, while sixty percent cannot name even five of the Ten Commandments. Meantime, multiple polls reveal that 82 percent of American Believers think "God helps those who help themselves," is a Bible verse (it isn't). And while we should not expect unbelievers to be knowledgeable about scripture, when 83 percent of Americans identify as "Christian" , that means a large percentage of "believers" are biblically illiterate and have little (if any) idea of what scripture really says!

This makes for a lot of people without the Sword of the Spirit, or for that fact, the Armor of God entirely!

With that said, let's disassemble a couple of the more "popular" arguments used by JW's to throw believers off-kilter:

 

JW Argument #1: "Jesus is a Created Being"

Verse they use: Colossians 1:15: “He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.”

The Watchtower teaches that the word “firstborn” in the above verse means that at some point a point in time when Jesus was "born" or came into existence.

Reply: While Jesus was indeed "born" to Mary as a human on Earth, scripture clearly teaches that Jesus' existence went back far longer than that. A prime example is John Chapter 1, as is John 8:58:

 

Quote

" Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am." (John 8:58, NASB)

 

The word "firstborn" did not simply mean "first in chronological order", as several places in scripture show where the first chronologically born son was removed and another son named "the firstborn". In Jewish culture, the "firstborn" could also mean "preeminent", as they had special rights such as double the portion of the father's estate. An example:

Quote

"Now the sons of Reuben the firstborn of Israel (for he was the firstborn, but because he defiled his father's bed, his birthright was given to the sons of Joseph the son of Israel; so that he is not enrolled in the genealogy according to the birthright." (1 Chronicles 5:1, NASB, emphasis mine)

 

Related to that is a comparison of Genesis 41:51-52 with Jeremiah 31:9.  Manasseh is listed as the first one born to Joseph, but then Ephraim becomes the firstborn, or preeminent one:

 

Quote

" Joseph named the firstborn Manasseh, “For,” he said, “God has made me forget all my trouble and all my father’s household.” He named the second Ephraim, “For,” he said, “God has made me fruitful in the land of my affliction.”" (Genesis 41:51-52, NASB, emphasis mine)

 

Quote

"With weeping they will come, And by supplication I will lead them; I will make them walk by streams of waters, On a straight path in which they will not stumble; For I am a father to Israel, And Ephraim is My firstborn. " (Jeremiah 31:9, NASB, emphasis mine)

Another place in scripture this happens is in Psalm 89:27 : David is called "firstborn", even though he was the last son born to  Jesse, his father.

 

JW Argument #2:  "Jesus is Inferior to the Father"

Verse they use: John 14:28:  “I am going to the Father, for my Father is greater than I.”

The Watchtower says that this verse indicates Jesus is inferior to the Father.

Reply: Like several other verses utilized by Jehovah’s Witnesses to confound believers, this one can be explained with a proper understanding of the relationship between Jesus and the Father. Most JW's think that Christians believe that Jesus and the Father are one in the same person. For instance, they will ask you questions such as, “If Jesus is God, did He pray to Himself?” Or, “If Jesus is God, who ran the universe when He died?“

They confuse nature with position.

Jesus and the Father are not the same person: that "belief" is known as Modalism. But in scripture, we see that Jesus and the Father are two separate persons, equal in nature but different in position. The Father has a greater position than the Son does, but they both share the same nature as God.  John 14:12. gives us an excellent defense, as Jesus says that His apostles will do “greater” works than His own:

Quote

"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes in Me, the works that I do, he will do also; and greater works than these he will do; because I go to the Father." (John 14:12, NASB, emphasis mine)

 

 If a Jehovah’s Witnesses applies their definition of "greater"  to the same word in John 14:28 , they would have to conclude that Jesus’ works were inferior to His followers works. 

 

These are just a couple of examples of the stuff in their "bag of tricks".  A parting thought:  don’t simply "memorize responses", as a lot of Jehovah’s Witnesses do that already. If you get them away from their rehearsed scripts and "arguments, they’re like a fish out of water. But rather than think of it as "us versus them", think of the situation rather as trying to reach out to some seriously deceived people. They may be sincere, but they are sincerely misled by the Watchtower. And if you don’t know an answer to one of their "arguments", its okay to say, “I don’t know. Let me look into that question and then get back to you." Writing it down will help you to research it and answer it fully the next time they come to talk. This will give you another opportunity to witness to them, and start a dialogue rather than a battle of "scriptural memory"..

Keep in mind: the goal of any witnessing encounter is not to win a debate, but to try to show someone who is lost where the Truth and Light really are. This is not about us, but about the Truth; so many are lost out there, just as we once were.

 

God bless.

 

-Robert

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 10, 2016 by RobertS
spelling

[MorningGlory]

4 minutes ago, RobertS said:

The average Jehovah’s Witness can make a “doctrinal pretzel” out of the average Christian in about  2 minutes; this is because they are constantly training and rehearsing their "scripts"

I don't believe this at all; when they come to my door I say 'hi' then when I realize they're JWs I say 'have a nice day' and close the door.  The key is to give them no opportunity to speak. I don't believe the average Christian is unaware of who they are and what they believe. It wouldn't work with me anyway because I know what they're about after reading up on them years ago.

[missmuffet]

1 minute ago, MorningGlory said:

I don't believe this at all; when they come to my door I say 'hi' then when I realize they're JWs I say 'have a nice day' and close the door.  The key is to give them no opportunity to speak. I don't believe the average Christian is unaware of who they are and what they believe. It wouldn't work with me anyway because I know what they're about after reading up on them years ago.

That is what I do too MG. I do that with the Mormons as well. I just say "No thanks, I am not interested".

[Guest Robert]

7 minutes ago, MorningGlory said:

I don't believe this at all; when they come to my door I say 'hi' then when I realize they're JWs I say 'have a nice day' and close the door.  The key is to give them no opportunity to speak. I don't believe the average Christian is unaware of who they are and what they believe. It wouldn't work with me anyway because I know what they're about after reading up on them years ago.

I wasn't referring to you MG; you happen to be well-versed in scripture! That said, the sad truth is that a lot of folks identifying as "christian" are not in their bibles by their own admission. I've seen this personally in my time, and it's disheartening. And I've had to directly intercede when someone I care about was being picked apart by a pair of JW's, and she had tried to "close the door on them" (they used their foot to keep it open).

 

They were quite shocked to find someone who could quote scripture at length fro memory!

 

Sadly, the church in the US is in trouble because all too often we fight the battles that have no meaning, but run from the important ones. If all we do is "close the door" on them, then it may very well be that we have also closed the door on people the Lord would have us give the truth to. A chilling question on that note is: what if those who shared the gospel with us had instead "shut the door" and left us outside.

 

Something to think about.

[MorningGlory]

6 minutes ago, RobertS said:

I wasn't referring to you MG; you happen to be well-versed in scripture! That said, the sad truth is that a lot of folks identifying as "christian" are not in their bibles by their own admission. I've seen this personally in my time, and it's disheartening. And I've had to directly intercede when someone I care about was being picked apart by a pair of JW's, and she had tried to "close the door on them" (they used their foot to keep it open).

 

They were quite shocked to find someone who could quote scripture at length fro memory!

 

Sadly, the church in the US is in trouble because all too often we fight the battles that have no meaning, but run from the important ones. If all we do is "close the door" on them, then it may very well be that we have also closed the door on people the Lord would have us give the truth to. A chilling question on that note is: what if those who shared the gospel with us had instead "shut the door" and left us outside.

 

Something to think about.

i assumed that all Christians knew that JWs are a cult.  Are you serious that they put a foot in the door? In Texas, that's attempted breaking and entering.  The Lady needs to learn the art of slamming a door on a foot. But, seriously, if anyone reading this doesn't know that JWs (or Mormons) are not Christian, please google these cults and find out the truth; don't leave yourselves open to deceit.

[Guest Robert]

40 minutes ago, MorningGlory said:

i assumed that all Christians knew that JWs are a cult.  Are you serious that they put a foot in the door? In Texas, that's attempted breaking and entering.  The Lady needs to learn the art of slamming a door on a foot. But, seriously, if anyone reading this doesn't know that JWs (or Mormons) are not Christian, please google these cults and find out the truth; don't leave yourselves open to deceit.

That's why I had to intercede; they were quite pushy. But rather than escalate an altercation, I took the opportunity to 1) educate them on scripture, and 2) educate them on law (same law applies here).

As far as the Lady being able to stop them, she is disabled and has physical ailments that preclude her from such a thing. Normally, they don't do that, but this pair were a lot more "gung-ho" than normal. I also took the opportunity to call the local Kingdom Hall and explain this to one of their elders there. THe two haven't been back since.

[post]

 

i am Jehovah's witness. 

i am Christ's witness, and He is the witness of the Father who sent Him. 

He came in Jah's name, and i come in His.

 

Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever receives the one I send receives me, and whoever receives me receives the one who sent me.
(John 13:20)