Confirming the Covenant

[Montana Marv]

Last Daze

We are reconciled to God when we ask for forgiveness, when we ask for unity in Christ.  It is on our shoulders. In the same way Israel and Jerusalem cannot come to Christ or God and be reconciled to Them until they ask for forgiveness.  When we acknowledge Christ as Lord and Savior we are accepted (all is as new).  When Israel and Jerusalem acknowledge Christ as Lord and Savior, they will be accepted (the slate will be cleaned).  The 70 Sevens are all about Israel and Jerusalem coming around (out of unbelief) to acknowledge Christ as their Lord, King and Savior (believing).  It is they who must accomplish these six tasks.  Lord, I accept Thee; Lord, I accept Thee; Lord, I accept Thee.

Add on edit:  These six tasks are the Salvation message in a nutshell.  Yes, Christ has done it all, but only for those who accept what He has done.

In Christ

Montana Marv

Edited October 31, 2015 by Montana Marv
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[Esther4:14]

Last Daze, 

I find your observations very interesting.  I have read this verse and considered the constitution many times but could not see how they would fit together because we are living in a time when what is happening to the constitution resembles what this verse is saying.  Like for example, the constitution were an example of what the covenant that will be confirmed for one week would look like when it will be revoked in the middle of the week.  But, this obviously wouldn't work because 1776-2015+ would not equal a week.  Although, every time I hear the arguments about freedoms being taken away from us that are included in the constitution, I think of this verse, which didn't make sense because I did read through it without considering that this was part of an existing doctrine.  My personal speculation is that this is how the US would be recruited under the beast.  He will confirm principles from the constitution; or, use principles in the constitution to appeal to Christians in joining in some sort of unification under the Antichrist.  But, this is just speculation.  I do think it is too soon to know for sure what this would entail.  Just wanted to share my considerations.  

Edited October 31, 2015 by Esther4:14

[Sister]

I want to focus on this aspect of the seventy weeks prophecy in Daniel 9.

And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week.  Daniel 9:27

Last Daze

From the day the angel spoke to Daniel to the command to build the temple = 1 week.

Daniel had to wait 1 week, then the command came.

From the commandment to build the temple to the crucifixion = 62 weeks.

From the crucifixion to the destruction of the temple = 7 weeks.

Total 70 weeks.

Prophecy completed.  Their second temple was rebuilt, their Messiah came, the Messiah crucified, then temple destroyed.  After this only abominations till the Coming, but the 70th week was fulfilled at the destruction of the temple. 

 

Christs 3 1/2 year ministry - apostles 3 1/2 year ministry after his death = 1 week (covenant confirmed)

Christ was cut of in the midst of the week.  Half way through that week.  Sacrifices and oblations no longer required, for the Lamb was the sacrifice.  After his death, abominations will spread, as spirit of antichrist and evil will grow until the consummation, ....until the 2 Coming when Christ takes dominion and is crowned King of King and Lord of Lords.

[Sister]

 

But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days,” declares the Lord, “I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.  Jeremiah 31:33

The new covenant is one of the heart.  Jesus spent ~3.5 years confirming this covenant spoken of by Jeremiah, with Israel, as evidenced by His teachings.  Although the new covenant may not have "officially" begun until the shedding of His blood, His entire ministry revolved around explaining it, confirming it.  This leaves roughly 3.5 more years of Christ confirming the covenant with Israel.  I see a couple of possibilities both of which are by proxy:

• the disciples stayed in Israel for 3.5 years before taking the gospel to the Gentiles.
• the two witnesses minister to Israel in the wilderness for 3.5 years just before the return of Christ.

The confirmation of the covenant finished when the apostles ended their 3 1/2 year ministry, giving their testimony.  This is the same 3 1/2 years when the woman was given 2 wings of an eagle and flew into the wilderness which is the world (Rev 12:14).  The true doctrine protected from the enemy, as they were writing the New Testament,  and sending out to the churches, making disciples, and spreading the gospel to Israel and the gentiles.  Satan could not touch what God would preserve for us, his Word.  This is that week.

 

The two witness will most definately confirm the covenant again in the last days, but this will be a testimony against them, and the world, and not linked with Daniel.  Israel and the world will get a good "telling off", shown where they went wrong, as the False prophet has already deceived everyone with his Mark, and gained power.  The remnants of Israel "chosen" will still go through the 7 trumpets, but will have their lives spared because of mercy.

 Jeremiah 31:9   They shall come with weeping, and with supplications will I lead them: I will cause them to walk by the rivers of waters in a straight way, wherein they shall not stumble: for I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn.

 

 

[Sister]

 

What I don't see is a future seven year period of time where the man of sin confirms a covenant with Israel for seven years.  Never is there mentioned a seven year period of time in the context of end times prophecy, nor are we ever instructed to look for one as a sign.

 The false prophet will have power for 3 1/2 years. This will start when he takes over Jerusalem.  But before this, he must rise to power and gain popularity.  He will win everyone over with his smooth words and miracles to deceive.  It will take just under 3 1/2 years to win all the nations over spreading false peace and introducting his new policies.

Where everyone gets the 7 years from is from here;

Daniel 8:13   Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?

  Daniel 8:14   And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

This is from the time when the 10 kings are given the "go ahead" to the Coming.  I think it works out to 6.39 years. They pave the way for their new leader whom they have groomed to emerge and make the conditions right for him in the world.  There is a covenant being made, but I doubt it's a covenant for seven years with Israel, because he thinks he will go on forever, but only given 3 1/2 years from God.

This is how I see it anyway.

[Montana Marv]

I want to focus on this aspect of the seventy weeks prophecy in Daniel 9.

And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week.  Daniel 9:27

Last Daze

From the day the angel spoke to Daniel to the command to build the temple = 1 week.

Daniel had to wait 1 week, then the command came.

From the commandment to build the temple to the crucifixion = 62 weeks.

From the crucifixion to the destruction of the temple = 7 weeks.

Total 70 weeks.

Prophecy completed.  Their second temple was rebuilt, their Messiah came, the Messiah crucified, then temple destroyed.  After this only abominations till the Coming, but the 70th week was fulfilled at the destruction of the temple. 

 

Christs 3 1/2 year ministry - apostles 3 1/2 year ministry after his death = 1 week (covenant confirmed)

Christ was cut of in the midst of the week.  Half way through that week.  Sacrifices and oblations no longer required, for the Lamb was the sacrifice.  After his death, abominations will spread, as spirit of antichrist and evil will grow until the consummation, ....until the 2 Coming when Christ takes dominion and is crowned King of King and Lord of Lords.

Sister

Your numbers are way off.  First of all what is said is from the issuing of the decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes there will be seven - sevens, and sixty - two sevens. (see the order, first the seven, then the sixty two).  It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble.  After the sixty-two sevens, the Anointed One will be cut off.  Here 69 Weeks have pasted.  Then in the future Dan 9:27 - He will confirm a covenant for one seven. 

Then you say that Christ was crucified midweek.  This is false.  Matt 24:15 - So when you see standing in the holy place the A/D spoken of through the prophet Daniel, let the reader understand.  Then those of Judea are to flee to the mountains.  For then there will be great distress.  Nobody fled to the mountains at Jesus crucifixion.

Your numbers don't match with what Scripture says.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Last Daze]

I want to focus on this aspect of the seventy weeks prophecy in Daniel 9.

And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week.  Daniel 9:27

Last Daze

From the day the angel spoke to Daniel to the command to build the temple = 1 week.

Daniel had to wait 1 week, then the command came.

From the commandment to build the temple to the crucifixion = 62 weeks.

From the crucifixion to the destruction of the temple = 7 weeks.

Total 70 weeks.

Prophecy completed.  Their second temple was rebuilt, their Messiah came, the Messiah crucified, then temple destroyed.  After this only abominations till the Coming, but the 70th week was fulfilled at the destruction of the temple. 

 

Christs 3 1/2 year ministry - apostles 3 1/2 year ministry after his death = 1 week (covenant confirmed)

Christ was cut of in the midst of the week.  Half way through that week.  Sacrifices and oblations no longer required, for the Lamb was the sacrifice.  After his death, abominations will spread, as spirit of antichrist and evil will grow until the consummation, ....until the 2 Coming when Christ takes dominion and is crowned King of King and Lord of Lords.

Hi Sister,

The sequencing of the weeks you describe doesn't seem to follow the natural read of the text, and it seems to add a week to the "front-end" of the prophecy that isn't mentioned.

I still tend to vacillate between the apostles or the two witnesses as to which completes the confirming of the covenant.  There seems to be pros and cons both ways.  Given what the prophecy is stated to accomplish, I tend to lean toward the two witnesses.

[Last Daze]

Last Daze, 

I find your observations very interesting.  I have read this verse and considered the constitution many times but could not see how they would fit together because we are living in a time when what is happening to the constitution resembles what this verse is saying.  Like for example, the constitution were an example of what the covenant that will be confirmed for one week would look like when it will be revoked in the middle of the week.  But, this obviously wouldn't work because 1776-2015+ would not equal a week.  Although, every time I hear the arguments about freedoms being taken away from us that are included in the constitution, I think of this verse, which didn't make sense because I did read through it without considering that this was part of an existing doctrine.  My personal speculation is that this is how the US would be recruited under the beast.  He will confirm principles from the constitution; or, use principles in the constitution to appeal to Christians in joining in some sort of unification under the Antichrist.  But, this is just speculation.  I do think it is too soon to know for sure what this would entail.  Just wanted to share my considerations.  

Thanks for your thoughts, Esther.  The prophecy is stated as concerning Daniel's people and holy city.  It references Jerusalem as the holy city so I take "Daniels' people" to mean the Jews.  How do you think this prophecy relates to the US and it's constitution?

[Last Daze]

 

What I don't see is a future seven year period of time where the man of sin confirms a covenant with Israel for seven years.  Never is there mentioned a seven year period of time in the context of end times prophecy, nor are we ever instructed to look for one as a sign.

 The false prophet will have power for 3 1/2 years. This will start when he takes over Jerusalem.  But before this, he must rise to power and gain popularity.  He will win everyone over with his smooth words and miracles to deceive.  It will take just under 3 1/2 years to win all the nations over spreading false peace and introducting his new policies.

Where everyone gets the 7 years from is from here;

Daniel 8:13   Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?

  Daniel 8:14   And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

This is from the time when the 10 kings are given the "go ahead" to the Coming.  I think it works out to 6.39 years. They pave the way for their new leader whom they have groomed to emerge and make the conditions right for him in the world.  There is a covenant being made, but I doubt it's a covenant for seven years with Israel, because he thinks he will go on forever, but only given 3 1/2 years from God.

This is how I see it anyway.

My understanding is that everyone who holds to a future 7 years gets that notion from Daniel 9:27 as being the covenant that is confirmed for one week.

[Last Daze]

I'd like to narrow the focus back down to just the statement about the confirming of the covenant since I see it as foundational.

And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week.  Daniel 9:27a

From this, it's reasonable to conclude that:

• there is an existing covenant that "he" confirms or strengthens
• this "confirming" that he does takes place for seven years.

If this is true then there is no way that this "one week" is a reference to a future seven year covenant confirmed by the man of sin which is broken midway through.  That makes absolutely no sense and is self-contradictory.  You can't claim to have done something for 7 years when you quit doing it after 3.5.  The verse states that the covenant is confirmed for seven years.

Otherwise, please explain why those two specific points are false.